| Author |
 Topic  |
|
Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4436 Posts |
 Posted - 29 Dec 2009 : 20:40:27
|
In all seriousness, with how the updates are being handled and my DDi supscription, I honestly doubt there will be a 4.5. It's my belief that after each major update they put out, they should change the printings of all material to match that of the changes. That way, a person who buys the PHB next June wouldn't have to worry about any Errata. I just don't know how feesable doing this would be?
As for 5E, I'm thinking it'll be virtual. Lets face it, print is dying and soon we'll all be using data-pads like in Star Trek lol. |
Edited by - Diffan on 29 Dec 2009 20:41:14 |
 |
|
|
Julian Grimm
Seeker
86 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2009 : 20:55:22
|
| I don't think print will die off as fast as some think it will nor do I see it going completely away. They may try to make 5e a virtual edition but I don't think it will be well received. |
|
|
|
Fizilbert
Learned Scribe
USA
123 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2009 : 21:38:18
|
| Frankly I dont like virtual editions. I was quite disappointed when Dragon stopped paper production and went strictly virtual. It's just not the same. |
Fiz
Level 10 Vice-president
World of Elethril |
|
|
|
Julian Grimm
Seeker
86 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2009 : 22:03:10
|
| Though I think some good things have come from virtualization I think gaming, especially table top gaming, has suffered as a whole from it. I prefer gaming face to face rather than over any distance on a computer. I stop to think of what my other gaming interests would be like if they were virtual. I don't like the prospect of playing Magic, Risk, Axis & Allies or any other traditional table top game in the online arena. |
|
|
|
Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36798 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2009 : 23:01:41
|
quote:
Originally posted by Julian Grimm
Though I think some good things have come from virtualization I think gaming, especially table top gaming, has suffered as a whole from it. I prefer gaming face to face rather than over any distance on a computer. I stop to think of what my other gaming interests would be like if they were virtual. I don't like the prospect of playing Magic, Risk, Axis & Allies or any other traditional table top game in the online arena.
I think, though, that WotC was wrong not to pursue virtual game play. They did promise a virtual gaming table, but Lurue only knows if we'll ever see that... It is my opinion that what is killing the PnP gaming industry more than anything else is that people simply don't find it as easy to gather with friends to game as they once did -- this is especially true once college, jobs, and families become factors for players. Players aren't able to gather to game, so they turn to the next best thing -- MMOs.
A virtual gaming table, done right, would give people the same convenience for gathering with other players as MMOs currently do. And I think that giving a choice between virtual D&D or no D&D, gamers would choose the former. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
|
|
|
Julian Grimm
Seeker
86 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2009 : 23:15:03
|
| I guess I am lucky in that we can find the time to do so. I also have much of my family that games with me so that is a plus as well. Of course I try to make time for us to do things together as most of us are into the idea of slowing down our lives and removing the extras we think we need that consumes so much time. |
|
|
|
Fizilbert
Learned Scribe
USA
123 Posts |
Posted - 30 Dec 2009 : 02:12:14
|
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Julian Grimm
Though I think some good things have come from virtualization I think gaming, especially table top gaming, has suffered as a whole from it. I prefer gaming face to face rather than over any distance on a computer. I stop to think of what my other gaming interests would be like if they were virtual. I don't like the prospect of playing Magic, Risk, Axis & Allies or any other traditional table top game in the online arena.
I think, though, that WotC was wrong not to pursue virtual game play. They did promise a virtual gaming table, but Lurue only knows if we'll ever see that... It is my opinion that what is killing the PnP gaming industry more than anything else is that people simply don't find it as easy to gather with friends to game as they once did -- this is especially true once college, jobs, and families become factors for players. Players aren't able to gather to game, so they turn to the next best thing -- MMOs.
A virtual gaming table, done right, would give people the same convenience for gathering with other players as MMOs currently do. And I think that giving a choice between virtual D&D or no D&D, gamers would choose the former.
What happened to the virtual table top game that they were bringing out with 4E? I remember watching some videos when the system was first being advertised and one of the key things they were talking about was having a virtual gathering place to play D&D. |
Fiz
Level 10 Vice-president
World of Elethril |
|
|
|
Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader
USA
3243 Posts |
Posted - 30 Dec 2009 : 02:23:17
|
quote:
Originally posted by Fizilbert
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Julian Grimm
Though I think some good things have come from virtualization I think gaming, especially table top gaming, has suffered as a whole from it. I prefer gaming face to face rather than over any distance on a computer. I stop to think of what my other gaming interests would be like if they were virtual. I don't like the prospect of playing Magic, Risk, Axis & Allies or any other traditional table top game in the online arena.
I think, though, that WotC was wrong not to pursue virtual game play. They did promise a virtual gaming table, but Lurue only knows if we'll ever see that... It is my opinion that what is killing the PnP gaming industry more than anything else is that people simply don't find it as easy to gather with friends to game as they once did -- this is especially true once college, jobs, and families become factors for players. Players aren't able to gather to game, so they turn to the next best thing -- MMOs.
A virtual gaming table, done right, would give people the same convenience for gathering with other players as MMOs currently do. And I think that giving a choice between virtual D&D or no D&D, gamers would choose the former.
What happened to the virtual table top game that they were bringing out with 4E? I remember watching some videos when the system was first being advertised and one of the key things they were talking about was having a virtual gathering place to play D&D.
The bean-counters didn't realize that it actually takes time to develop a working virtual environment and not just some pictures in a PowerPoint presentation... |
I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.
Ashe's Character Sheet
Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs |
|
|
|
Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36798 Posts |
Posted - 30 Dec 2009 : 04:58:54
|
Well, without being cynical, we really don't know what happened to the virtual gaming table. I've heard of various issues, like the code being lifted from someone else illegally, and there's also the fact that even before they started laying folks off, there were problems on the cyber-side -- including the suicide of a higher-up.
Officially, though, WotC just kinda quietly stopped saying anything at all about the virtual gaming table. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 30 Dec 2009 04:59:40 |
|
|
|
Joran Nobleheart
Senior Scribe
USA
495 Posts |
|
|
Darkmeer
Senior Scribe
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 30 Dec 2009 : 07:22:38
|
quote:
Originally posted by Joran Nobleheart
Does anyone know if Pathfinder will have a virtual presence? That would be rather nice, I'd think.
I believe they have stated that they aren't looking to do that right now, and they stated that they'd be happy if a third party did something within that realm. Lots of interest, but they are focusing on what they know to make a better product (as far as I see). I wish I could remember which thread they did that on. I'll post a link if I find it.
Anyhoo, I'll take a dram of Scotch if'n you please, I'm liking the cool tone of this cave (better than the fiery one I just came out of). This is the kind of "edition" discussion I hope for, everyone being calm across all editions.
/d |
"These people are my family, not just friends, and if you want to get to them you gotta go through ME." |
Edited by - Darkmeer on 30 Dec 2009 07:23:54 |
|
|
|
Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4436 Posts |
Posted - 30 Dec 2009 : 09:07:20
|
I don't think the whole virtual table-top thing is too far off but they still haven't fixed the bugs for the Adventurer Builder and the update for my Character Builder messed it up so I had to re-download the program. But it is going to take a lot more time than what WotC thought before they started advertising all these "cool, nifty" options for players. WotC really needs to learn how to walk before they can run.
On a side note, I've been extreamly happy with the D&D Compendium, Dragon and Dungeon issues for a pretty low price of just over $5 dollars a month. |
|
|
|
dwarvenranger
Senior Scribe
USA
428 Posts |
Posted - 30 Dec 2009 : 13:17:32
|
Have you guys seen this: http://rptools.net/ ?
I saw on the paizo boards that there were folks developing adventures for this toolset. |
If I waited till I knew what I was doing, I'd never get anything done.
|
|
|
|
Julian Grimm
Seeker
86 Posts |
Posted - 30 Dec 2009 : 15:58:56
|
| Funny, with all this virtual discussion I still think Core Rules 2.0 was the pinnacle of computer assisted gaming. ;) |
|
|
|
Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36798 Posts |
Posted - 30 Dec 2009 : 16:09:26
|
In my mind, the ideal virtual gaming table doesn't even need a lot of stuff... You need a whiteboard that can be set to have either squares or hexes, an integrated die roller, some way to do IMs that not everyone can see, and voicechat. Anything else would be purely optional.
Going this simplistic approach would allow it to be used for any edition of any game... Supplemental stuff, like tiles, monsters, damage templates, etc, could all be sold extra, for a minimal cost.
And that's all you need, on the front end. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
|
|
|
froglegg
Learned Scribe
317 Posts |
Posted - 30 Dec 2009 : 19:20:03
|
quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart
quote:
Originally posted by Fizilbert
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
I think I'm gonna get a VIP pass and come or go as I please 
Hey! One of those 4E guys is trying to sneak in! Get him! ;)
Now, now, now... Everyone's welcome. For shortly there will be a 4.5 and then a 5th Edition, and he can join in the lamentations of previous editions like the rest of us.
 You must be a Prophet sir!
John |
Long live Alias and Dragonbait! Kate Novak and Jeff Grubb the Realms need you more then ever!
On my word as a sage nothing within these pages is false, but not all of it may prove to be true. - Elminster of Shadowdale
The Old Grey Box gets better with age! |
|
|
|
Wenin
Senior Scribe
585 Posts |
Posted - 30 Dec 2009 : 20:40:17
|
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
In my mind, the ideal virtual gaming table doesn't even need a lot of stuff... You need a whiteboard that can be set to have either squares or hexes, an integrated die roller, some way to do IMs that not everyone can see, and voicechat. Anything else would be purely optional.
Going this simplistic approach would allow it to be used for any edition of any game... Supplemental stuff, like tiles, monsters, damage templates, etc, could all be sold extra, for a minimal cost.
And that's all you need, on the front end.
Look into Fantasy Grounds then. =) They have all but voice, but you can get that cheap and easy with Skype. |
Session Reports posted at RPG Geek.
Stem the Tide Takes place in Mistledale.
Dark Curtains - Takes place in the Savage North, starting in Nesmé. I wrapped my campaign into the Hoard of the Dragon Queen, but it takes place in 1372 DR. |
|
|
|
Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
|
|
Fizilbert
Learned Scribe
USA
123 Posts |
Posted - 31 Dec 2009 : 14:20:47
|
I may be asking for it here, but since we're talking about edition differences, and I have not gotten 4E so I'm not really too familiar with it, what are some of the major differences between 4E and 2E?
I mean I know in 3E they altered THAC0, got rid of proficiencies and went with feats, got rid of weapon and casting speeds, and reduced 5 saves to 3. |
Fiz
Level 10 Vice-president
World of Elethril |
Edited by - Fizilbert on 31 Dec 2009 14:23:28 |
|
|
|
Ayunken-vanzan
Senior Scribe
Germany
657 Posts |
Posted - 31 Dec 2009 : 18:53:32
|
| Five saves? There were two more? |
"What mattered our lives now? When our world had been torn from us? Folk wept, or drank, or stood staring out over the land, wondering what new horror each dawn would bring."
Elender Stormfall of Suzail
"Anyone can kill deities, cause plagues, or destroy organizations. It takes real skill to make them live on."
Varl
FR/D&D-Links • 2ed Downloads |
|
|
|
Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4436 Posts |
Posted - 31 Dec 2009 : 23:58:26
|
quote:
Originally posted by Fizilbert
I may be asking for it here, but since we're talking about edition differences, and I have not gotten 4E so I'm not really too familiar with it, what are some of the major differences between 4E and 2E?
I mean I know in 3E they altered THAC0, got rid of proficiencies and went with feats, got rid of weapon and casting speeds, and reduced 5 saves to 3.
Hmm......where to start...
First of, most basic difference of all is that many aspects are based off half your level. Your attacks start with the primary ability modifier (Str isn't the primary ability for all weapon attacks across the board anymore) and then you add 1/2 your level and the weapon's proficiency bonus if your proficient with the weapon. In 4E, you can use weapons your not proficient with, you just don't gain the benefit of a bonus to attacks. Same goes for AC. You tally up your bonuses from armor, shield, and if your wearing light armor then your Dex or Int modifier and add 1/2 your level to get your total AC. And the same goes for your other Defenses (Fort, Ref, and Will).
Something unique about 4E is that the attacker always rolls to hit. There's no more "cast lightning bolt and stand back to watch the fireworks". Spells and what-not have an attack line which targets either AC, Fort, Ref, or Will. The target no longer rolls to evade effects. Additionally, powers have an range to which they're effective. Some are Melee weapon, meaning you can only hit someone within your weapon's reach while others are Close burst 1. This means the attack targets each creature adjacent to you. Then you roll to attack each target. But once you roll all your attacks, you just have to roll once for damage.
Another big change is Saving Throws. Some effects will say (save ends). Meaning the condition will only end if you successfully make a saving throw. You always roll your saving throws at the end of your turn. And a successful saving throw is a d20 roll that's 10 or greater. It's simple I know, but it works well with the system. Some example effects are "you take 5 ongoing fire damage (save ends)." This means at the beginning of your turn, you automatically take 5 fire damage and if you don't save at the end of your turn, it continues.
You get feats every even level in 4E but the quality of them are somewhat lack luster than in 3E. in 3E, feats were gold and you had to spend them very, very wisely. In 4E, they're good but I don't think the emphasis is as heavy as it once was. Feats don't let you do crazy or highly complex things that they allowed in 3E.
They culled the Skill list down to 17 skills and took out ones that didn't directly effect the mechanics of the game like Profession or Performace. For me, this was a great idea since I didn't feel the need for a RP aspect to effect mechanics of the character. And you also add 1/2 your level to your skill checks as well.
I could go on for quite a while about class roles and party mechanics but I think my space here is limited lol. |
|
|
|
dwarvenranger
Senior Scribe
USA
428 Posts |
Posted - 05 Jan 2010 : 02:15:25
|
quote:
Originally posted by Ayunken-vanzan
Five saves? There were two more?
Well they were more specific. You had (and I'm going off memory here so anyone feel free to correct me) Paralysis/Poison/Death Magic, Rods/Staffs/Wands, Petrification/Polymorph, Breath Weapons and Spells. |
If I waited till I knew what I was doing, I'd never get anything done.
|
|
|
|
Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 05 Jan 2010 : 12:22:42
|
| As I am a bit late for this discussion I will say that I more or less agree with what Julian Grimm has said. No need for me to add a heap of grumblings and pro-TSR arguments as most posters here already has read them before. I will stay in the inner parts of the cave with my TSR products. And a stack of vinyl together with an old record player of course. |
|
|
|
Fizilbert
Learned Scribe
USA
123 Posts |
Posted - 05 Jan 2010 : 12:35:20
|
quote:
Originally posted by dwarvenranger
quote:
Originally posted by Ayunken-vanzan
Five saves? There were two more?
Well they were more specific. You had (and I'm going off memory here so anyone feel free to correct me) Paralysis/Poison/Death Magic, Rods/Staffs/Wands, Petrification/Polymorph, Breath Weapons and Spells.
Your memory is correct, those are the 5 saves from 1E and 2E. |
Fiz
Level 10 Vice-president
World of Elethril |
|
|
|
Julian Grimm
Seeker
86 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jan 2010 : 00:00:12
|
quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
As I am a bit late for this discussion I will say that I more or less agree with what Julian Grimm has said. No need for me to add a heap of grumblings and pro-TSR arguments as most posters here already has read them before. I will stay in the inner parts of the cave with my TSR products. And a stack of vinyl together with an old record player of course.
Set the record player next to the TV. Don't bump the NES or the Atari I am still getting things set up. BTW, I have some OD&D books here as well if you want to play that. |
|
|
|
Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jan 2010 : 14:48:42
|
quote:
Originally posted by Julian Grimm
quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
As I am a bit late for this discussion I will say that I more or less agree with what Julian Grimm has said. No need for me to add a heap of grumblings and pro-TSR arguments as most posters here already has read them before. I will stay in the inner parts of the cave with my TSR products. And a stack of vinyl together with an old record player of course.
Set the record player next to the TV. Don't bump the NES or the Atari I am still getting things set up. BTW, I have some OD&D books here as well if you want to play that.
Got the Karameikos book handy or should I bring my own? And you know perfectly well that the record player and speakers deserve a wall of honour all by itself. Along with shelf upon shelf of lp`s of course.
Now is that a moderator I feel breathing down my neck? |
|
|
|
froglegg
Learned Scribe
317 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jan 2010 : 23:27:51
|
quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
quote:
Originally posted by Julian Grimm
quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
As I am a bit late for this discussion I will say that I more or less agree with what Julian Grimm has said. No need for me to add a heap of grumblings and pro-TSR arguments as most posters here already has read them before. I will stay in the inner parts of the cave with my TSR products. And a stack of vinyl together with an old record player of course.
Set the record player next to the TV. Don't bump the NES or the Atari I am still getting things set up. BTW, I have some OD&D books here as well if you want to play that.
Got the Karameikos book handy or should I bring my own? And you know perfectly well that the record player and speakers deserve a wall of honour all by itself. Along with shelf upon shelf of lp`s of course.
Now is that a moderator I feel breathing down my neck?
HEE HEE!!!!!
John |
Long live Alias and Dragonbait! Kate Novak and Jeff Grubb the Realms need you more then ever!
On my word as a sage nothing within these pages is false, but not all of it may prove to be true. - Elminster of Shadowdale
The Old Grey Box gets better with age! |
|
|
|
Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
|
|
Topic |
|
Taking my 3.5 books and hiding in a cave
