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cohn
Acolyte
United Kingdom
3 Posts |
 Posted - 21 Apr 2009 : 16:55:44
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Hello new to the forum.
Heres the deal, after recently coming into possession of some 3.5 Realms stuff and finding an old PC book. A friend said to me why dont we convert our old characters to 3.5. and see if we can get the old group back together?
A little background: We stopped playing before the arrival of 3ed as we all went and had families and moved away and grew up basically! The last game in the realms I DMd was Zhentil Keep and something to do with Banes Son in 136xDR. Not sure what year that adventure was published?
Anyway looking for recent campaigns I came across Shadowdale Scouring of the Land. This seemed to fit as the players are about 10th level.
And as the PCs became instrumental in the Time of Troubles I think it would be great if one last time they come to the aid of Mystra/Midnight once again [ I think thats were the adventure is heading, am i wrong?].
So my reason for posting is to ask any learned DMs out there, can the Pcs be converted easily from 2ed to 3.5.
What are the major differences to look out for in the rules.
With regard to the realms what is and where can i find out about the Shadoweave?? As that is all new to me as are some races and many other things come to think of it!
Why we are not going to 4e is that I really dont like what they have done with the realms, although the actual rules maybe good?[ we played a gritty tolkienesque game rather than the high fantasy computer game style that seems to have become popular in our absence]
Sorry for rambling
cheers
Cohn
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader
USA
3252 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2009 : 17:13:42
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Here's the official conversion guide from 2nd to 3rd Edition:
Conversion Guide
Since you're going to 3.5, you want to check out the update booklet (available here) to see the difference between 3/3.5.
All said, though, I'd suggest having the players look through the various classes/prestige classes available to see what best 'fits' their characters. For example, some 2E rangers would feel more comfortable as 3E weapon finesse Rogues or specialist fighters. |
I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.
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Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2009 : 18:23:58
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'Recently returning to the Forgotten Realms', and you want to convert your 2e stuff to 3.5? 
I just have to say it - "I love you, man." 
Oh....and welcome to the forums. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 21 Apr 2009 18:24:57 |
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader
USA
3252 Posts |
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Mace Hammerhand
Great Reader
Germany
2296 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2009 : 21:32:13
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| The conversion is easy...in general terms, but what I'd suggest before you begin to convert the old toons: play a couple of levels with 1st level characters and up from there so that the players will get used to the mechanics feats etc. My group and I converted to 3.5 about 2 years ago (or so) and some people still have a little trouble with feats and all...which may be because they don't bother with rules as much as others, but still... take the group through lvls 1-6 or so, this way they get a feel for the classes, be they basic or prestige |
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader
USA
3252 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2009 : 21:40:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Mace Hammerhand
The conversion is easy...in general terms, but what I'd suggest before you begin to convert the old toons: play a couple of levels with 1st level characters and up from there so that the players will get used to the mechanics feats etc. My group and I converted to 3.5 about 2 years ago (or so) and some people still have a little trouble with feats and all...which may be because they don't bother with rules as much as others, but still... take the group through lvls 1-6 or so, this way they get a feel for the classes, be they basic or prestige
Oooh! Adventure idea!
Have them make 1st level characters and send them on a search for their 10th-level characters...
Edit: And, by the way, the Shadoweave is discussed in the FRCS, Player's Guide to Faerūn, Magic of Faerūn and a bit in Faiths & Pantheons. |
I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.
Ashe's Character Sheet
Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs |
Edited by - Ashe Ravenheart on 21 Apr 2009 21:42:26 |
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Faraer
Great Reader
3308 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2009 : 00:44:29
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Why learn a new ruleset to play one adventure? Many of us, Ed and his group included, prefer to use second edition in the Realms.
Conversion of characters isn't hard, but it's not a direct 1:1 translation mainly because of 3E's freer multiclassing (which does model some characters better) and feats (which add a whole new layer of complication to character creation and game play). Watch out for players seeking to use that leeway to min/max. I wouldn't bother with prestige classes at all: apart from the very few that offer something that can't be represented by multiclassing or feats they're a powergaming toy.
The Shadow Weave is a nonsense introduced because Rich Baker thought there needed to be a counter to Mystra's Weave (he later changed his mind). The designers never made their mind up about exactly what it was or how it worked.
I'm sure 4E is good, but it's very rules/gameplay-led rather than content-led, a bit like Euro board games, as well as drawing more from current media fantasy and less from older literature, and won't be a good choice if your approach is more simulationist or narrativist. |
Edited by - Faraer on 22 Apr 2009 00:46:31 |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2009 : 00:50:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
The Shadow Weave is a nonsense introduced because Rich Baker thought there needed to be a counter to Mystra's Weave (he later changed his mind). The designers never made their mind up about exactly what it was or how it worked.
Indeed. Descriptions of the Shadow Weave have shifted and flip-flopped because unlike the core Realms, where the published information is the tip of a pre-existing iceberg, there's no underlying lore or sense to the Shadow Weave beyond the sum of what various people have written about it in sourcebook overviews, novel appearances, and messageboard posts.
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Edited by - The Sage on 22 Apr 2009 01:02:16 |
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Faraer
Great Reader
3308 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2009 : 00:56:35
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If I ran Shadowdale: Scouring, and I like a lot of things about it as I discussed on Eric Boyd's thread, it wouldn't be hard to replace the totalizing Weave-itself-is-unravelling plot -- part of the onslaught of simplistic, overschematic 'bright ideas' that have been eroding (plaguing) the Realms' substance and dynamics since 1989 -- with something more local, less out-of-nowhere and more setting-appropriate.
I think when I was talking about the Shadow Weave being introduced carelessly I was partly referring to its being borrowed from Rich's Realms-converted Birthright novel The Shadow Stone. |
Edited by - Faraer on 22 Apr 2009 00:59:13 |
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Knight of the Gate
Senior Scribe
USA
624 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2009 : 07:50:06
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And, since you're looking at adventures for 10th level PCs, can I suggest City of the Spider Queen? It's a great mod, well written... tho it does require alot of conversion from 3 to 3.5.
Welcome back, man! |
How can life be so bountiful, providing such sublime rewards for mediocrity? -Umberto Ecco |
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cohn
Acolyte
United Kingdom
3 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2009 : 08:15:27
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thanks for the replies. dont think theres much chance of playing other characters as its hard enough to get together as it is [but you never know]. some of the group did play the conan rpg so i assume that is similar to 3.5?
we may yet decide to play 2e and convert the scenario back to 2e if we end up getting bogged down in rules?is there any where that consolidates all the feats and prestige classes?
the reason we are using shadowdale is that i assumed that it and the next advnture would involve aiding mystra in a sort of Time Of Troubles type event?[which would mean the old pcs would of come full circle], does anyone have a review of anauroch scenario as I could be wrong about this? |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2009 : 09:53:08
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If this is a one of thing with an old group, wouldn't it then be better to just go with the system you all know and have good memories of? Going with the old system would be less preparation, specially if someone kept the old 2ed. books. That is, unless of course people got really tired of the system and want something new.
But I must admit that I am partial as I prefer 2ed. to the newer versions of the game. |
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Faraer
Great Reader
3308 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2009 : 11:35:25
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cohn, I do understand your wanting to try 3E -- I felt the same way and it's worth doing because it might suit your preferences and needs. But -- especially as there's an old-school revival going on where many people are rediscovering the abandoned virtues of older editions than 2nd -- equally one doesn't want to switch to newer editions just because they're newer.
Mongoose's Conan RPG is indeed mechanically similar to 3E, sharing what Wizards of the Coast called the 'd20 system'. I seriously recommend sticking to the feats in the Player's Handbook and whatever Realms sourcebooks you get, but here's an index of all the ones Wizards published. It might be interesting for us to help you out with the conversion process if you decide to use 3E. |
Edited by - Faraer on 22 Apr 2009 11:36:00 |
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edappel
Learned Scribe
Brazil
211 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2009 : 12:47:32
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Well.. I think you should try 3.5, AND 4E... Just then you can choose what's best for you.
Do not stop at 2nd edition without trying the others. |
--- Ed Appel
*** I'm a brazilian FR fan. So, feel free to correct my writing mistakes to improve my english. |
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Hawkins
Great Reader
USA
2131 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2009 : 18:01:07
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quote:
Originally posted by edappel
Well.. I think you should try 3.5, AND 4E... Just then you can choose what's best for you.
Do not stop at 2nd edition without trying the others.
While the concept is nice, if his group just now acquired the 3.5 books, I would suggest that they give it a chance before spending yet more money in the poor economy on 4e just so they can demo it too. Especially since all that you need to build a 3.5 character is free HERE and HERE, so his friends don't need to go out and buy new books. Also, if they want to try it with 3.5 rules instead of 2e rules, I don't see why they shouldn't. It is their gaming group, and this seems to be the decision that they made. Finally, I would also suggest using City of the Spider Queen. Even though it is a 3e adventure for 10th level characters, I would argue that you can run it with 3.5 characters with little or no conversion. |
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Edited by - Hawkins on 22 Apr 2009 18:01:53 |
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Raith
Seeker
USA
76 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2009 : 22:57:21
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| I agree, City of the Spider Queen is a complete blast. |
"Power and dominion are taken by the Will. By divine right Hail and Kill!" |
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Mr_Miscellany
Senior Scribe
545 Posts |
Posted - 23 Apr 2009 : 01:51:28
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Don't use City of the Spider Queen until you've played and understand the 3.5 rules set. That is absolutely not an adventure for novice players, no matter how much prior gaming experience you have.
Not to say CotSQ isn't fun. On the contrary it's an absolute blast to DM, in part because it makes use of the 3.5 rules to their fullest.
It just puts DMs through their paces and can turn into a real meat grinder if the DM isn't careful.
Best of luck to you cohn! |
Edited by - Mr_Miscellany on 23 Apr 2009 01:54:15 |
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cohn
Acolyte
United Kingdom
3 Posts |
Posted - 23 Apr 2009 : 19:29:07
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thanks again for the replies.
as i said before we may still use 2ed if we i can find a 2ed scenario with cataclysmic/time of troubles type fx. Just because it would seem the right sort of adventure to get the old party bback together. I suppose i could just convert the shadowdale adventure back to 2ed if the players cant be bothered to learn a new system.
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cohn
Acolyte
United Kingdom
3 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2009 : 11:47:03
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| what happened to specialist priests. One of the players had a specialist preist of Tymora are thereany guidelines??? |
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Wenin
Senior Scribe
585 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2009 : 13:00:18
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| Essentially, all priests are specialists. You're not suppose to have a priest that doesn't devote themselves to a patron deity. |
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Knight of the Gate
Senior Scribe
USA
624 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2009 : 15:30:31
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In 3e all priests are, essentially, specialists. Not only being devoted to a particular god/dess, but also within the church of that power. This is represented via the use of Domains. I.e., Tymora has the domains of Luck (duh),Travel, Good, Chaos, and Protection. I'd guess a cleric of T. without the Luck domain would be a pretty odd bird, but the player can choose any two of the domains for his character to have access to. This choice portrays a given cleric's relationship to his power...so, a cleric of Tymora might represent the goddess' aspect of 'good fortune' by taking the Luck and good domains...or her patronage of adventurers with Luck and Travel, or her aspect of Victory with Luck and Protection. These choices may occasionally reflect the Cleric's place in the church, as well... thus, all (or most) clerics with Luck and Chaos might work towards the Auspician PrC, and be considered a sect within the overall church of Tymora. Another (possible) example might be that the few clerics with the Travel and Protection domains might work with merchant caravans allied to the faith, protecting them on the road, thus enriching the faith. The list of possible combinations, and their attendant possible sub-groups is huge, which is (I suspect) why they were never all codified.
In the end it's one of my personal favorite parts of the 3e rules, especially in the Realms with all its colorful Powers- it's very flexible with no hard-and-fast rules, other than the ones that you make up for your own use. |
How can life be so bountiful, providing such sublime rewards for mediocrity? -Umberto Ecco |
Edited by - Knight of the Gate on 27 Apr 2009 15:38:16 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36965 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2009 : 16:26:22
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| I loved the 2E specialty priests. I never had any use for generic clerics, but some of the specialty priests simply ruled -- and they were so much more flavorful. |
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Knight of the Gate
Senior Scribe
USA
624 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2009 : 16:37:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I loved the 2E specialty priests. I never had any use for generic clerics, but some of the specialty priests simply ruled -- and they were so much more flavorful.
I was a big fan, too... but (IMO) the 3e rules allow you to re-create most of the spec.priests, and give each faith several types of S.P. at the same time.
Back on topic, I do know of a 3e Realms group in which the DM re-created the specialty priests as exactly as possible, by giving the clerics of a specific god/dess certain domains (even if it made less sense), making a few new domains, and changing a few existing domains. The choice wasn't up to the player- i.e., you play a cleric of Tempus, you get War and Chaos, and that's that. I wasn't so much a fan, since it limited player choice unnecessarily, and involved a fair amount of prep-work for the DM.
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How can life be so bountiful, providing such sublime rewards for mediocrity? -Umberto Ecco |
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malchor7
Seeker
62 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2009 : 17:31:29
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quote:
Originally posted by cohn
what happened to specialist priests. One of the players had a specialist preist of Tymora are thereany guidelines???
Like the auspician mentioned earlier, Prestige Classes sort of take the place of specialty priests. Check out the various PrCs in the FRCS, Faiths and Pantheons, and Player's Guide to Faerun (and others). Many, many deities have specialty priest PrCs, though not all--you should be able to construct a reasonable approximation of any deity you need a PrC for.
Also consider checking out the Book of Exalted Deeds. Apostle of Peace makes a lot of sense for a priest of Eldath, for example. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36965 Posts |
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returning to the realms
