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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
 Posted - 20 Feb 2009 : 18:46:08
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I agree with this entire post (although I only want to address the this small excerpt)-
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
It might be pushing it, but you could even make the main bad guy be a descendant of Thauglorimorgorus, the original Purple Dragon who ruled this land before the elves. Maybe the main baddie wants to destabilize things enough to put himself or his own puppet in charge, returning the land to the control of someone descended from the first ruler.
THAT is an intriguing idea... especially if the decendent can trace bloodlines to BOTH the Obarskyrs and Thaug-whatshisname.
If you make it a human with a little Elven blood, you could even say it was decendent of Iliphar, who at some point inter-mingled with both the Dragon's brood and the Obarskyrs, giving him (or her) a three-way claim to the lands of Cormyr. That may be a little much, though.
I like the Eldreth Veluuthra angle as well, but they wouldn't want a half-Elf on the throne, and I doubt the people of Cormyr would want a full-blooded Elf for a king. If you use them at all, I would say their interest (and whatever help they may be providing to the 'main players') is simply to destabilize the Cormyrian Gov't, making it ripe for an Elven takeover (not really possible, but the EV are all a little crazy anyway). If you do it that way, you could say each group you involve (Zhents, Thay, IT, EV, Fireknives, etc..) could all have heir own agenda, and all plan on back-stabbing the others at some pont in the plot (and at any moment, each faction could choose to temporarily side with the PCs, just to remove another 'player' in the game, and then turn on the PCs). 
Since this is probably 4e (unless I'm mistaken?), if you DO involve the Shades/Shar, bring in some Zhentish help for the PCs - that would be an unexpected and untrustworthy plothook to throw at them - perhaps it is the Zhents that first get wind of the plot, when they capture and torture some Sharites? At that point, your players won't know who to believe...
I do so love intrigue-based story-arcs.  |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 20 Feb 2009 18:50:01 |
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Wrigs13
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
201 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2009 : 19:43:00
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I'm liking the idea that a pc is being positioned to take either the throne or more likely the fall for the whole plot.
I was trying to work out a way for the bad guys, say the Fire Knives, to actually hire the pc's to look into the possibility of a plot against the throne. this way they will run around causing trouble with nobles and villians alike pointing fingers at all the wrong people. Hopefully they will end exposing a high level and very loyal member of court as the traitor while the true masterminds position themselves to take advantage of the pc's facing off against a powerful good guy.
The problem is how to organise all the different factions, and how to plot the sections of the story arc so that the pc's don't spot an obvious double cross or get confused and end up following red herrings in circles. |
Do not try to understand the 4th edition. Thats impossible. Instead...only try to realise the truth. There is no 4th edition. |
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crazedventurers
Master of Realmslore
United Kingdom
1073 Posts |
Posted - 02 Mar 2009 : 17:28:18
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Just something from my current campaign.
I had Foril (Azoun and Fee's) son come back to claim his throne just before his nephew was crowned. Rather than him being assasinated waaaaay back when (as reported by the Crown), apparently he had been kidnapped by the Fire Knives instead and kept hidden from the Obarskyrs for decades, growing up in Wetgate and the Vilhon Reach until the time was right to return.
Obviously it is a little more complicated than that, with various other groups sticking their oar in (not to mention the decade long civil war ), but he made an interesting addition to the Realm and gave the PC's something to get their teeth into (fortunately for the Forest Country they managed to uncover the plot, and the rightful King, Azoun V now sits upon the Dragon Throne).
Just a thought
Damian |
So saith Ed. I've never said he was sane, have I?
Gods, all this writing and he's running a constant fantasy version of Coronation Street in his head, too. .
shudder,
love to all,
THO
Candlekeep Forum 7 May 2005 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36966 Posts |
Posted - 02 Mar 2009 : 17:53:40
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quote:
Originally posted by crazedventurers
Just something from my current campaign.
I had Foril (Azoun and Fee's) son come back to claim his throne just before his nephew was crowned. Rather than him being assasinated waaaaay back when (as reported by the Crown), apparently he had been kidnapped by the Fire Knives instead and kept hidden from the Obarskyrs for decades, growing up in Wetgate and the Vilhon Reach until the time was right to return.
Obviously it is a little more complicated than that, with various other groups sticking their oar in (not to mention the decade long civil war ), but he made an interesting addition to the Realm and gave the PC's something to get their teeth into (fortunately for the Forest Country they managed to uncover the plot, and the rightful King, Azoun V now sits upon the Dragon Throne).
Just a thought
Damian
I like that idea... But I'd argue that in that particular scenario, Azoun V isn't the rightful king. Foril was the legitimately born son of the previous king, and as such, the throne should have passed to him before going to Azoun V. Azoun V would be next in line, until such time as Foril had his own kids. |
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crazedventurers
Master of Realmslore
United Kingdom
1073 Posts |
Posted - 02 Mar 2009 : 23:00:05
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I like that idea... But I'd argue that in that particular scenario, Azoun V isn't the rightful king. Foril was the legitimately born son of the previous king, and as such, the throne should have passed to him before going to Azoun V. Azoun V would be next in line, until such time as Foril had his own kids.
[/quote]
I concur entirely and Foril was crowned King however, the busybodies errrr the PC's realised that something was just not right as everyone else in Cormyr was all "rah-rah-rah all hail King Foril" and so begin to stick their noses into the issue, suffice to say that Foril was 'unmasked' and Azoun now rules.
What would be interesting is what the rules of sucession are in Cormyr if the true Foril came back before Azoun V ascends, and after he ascends.
Off to post on Ed's thread.
Cheers
Damian
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So saith Ed. I've never said he was sane, have I?
Gods, all this writing and he's running a constant fantasy version of Coronation Street in his head, too. .
shudder,
love to all,
THO
Candlekeep Forum 7 May 2005 |
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Wrigs13
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
201 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2009 : 09:07:39
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Just looking at the Kings of England shows that being the rightful heir is not the same thing as being the succesful heir.
Cousins, uncles and half brothers five times removed have claimed the throne over better candidates. So it is a matter of support and not right that dictates who ascends the throne.  |
Do not try to understand the 4th edition. Thats impossible. Instead...only try to realise the truth. There is no 4th edition. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36966 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2009 : 12:29:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Wrigs13
Just looking at the Kings of England shows that being the rightful heir is not the same thing as being the succesful heir.
Cousins, uncles and half brothers five times removed have claimed the throne over better candidates. So it is a matter of support and not right that dictates who ascends the throne.
Oh, that's a given. I was just saying that I didn't see the king's grandson thru a daughter being the rightful heir when the king's son was around. |
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Wrigs13
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
201 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2009 : 15:17:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Oh, that's a given. I was just saying that I didn't see the king's grandson thru a daughter being the rightful heir when the king's son was around.
Fair point but who is cutest?  |
Do not try to understand the 4th edition. Thats impossible. Instead...only try to realise the truth. There is no 4th edition. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36966 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2009 : 16:56:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Wrigs13
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Oh, that's a given. I was just saying that I didn't see the king's grandson thru a daughter being the rightful heir when the king's son was around.
Fair point but who is cutest?
Me, of course. 
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Asgetrion
Master of Realmslore
Finland
1564 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2009 : 20:35:05
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Wrigs13
So the big question seems to be who is behind this ingenious plot?
Zhents, Thay, Shar or something much more interesting and devious?
Which God, Organisation or Greater Evil might profit from chaos of discovery or a puppet king senario?
The thing is, it doesn't have to be anyone outside one or two noble families. It could be, but doesn't have to be. I'd avoid the Zhents and Thay as being too obvious, and for the love of Lurue, Shar has got her hands in enough evil plots in the official Realms, as it is.
I'd go with one of the other shadowy groups mentioned. The Iron Throne might work, and the Fire Knives are a great choice. I think the Eldreth Veluuthra might be a fun choice, too -- the elves once controlled all the lands now belonging to Cormyr, so a particularly ambitious (or crazy!) member or faction of the Victorious Blade might want to destabilize the kingdom as the first step in getting rid of humans in the area.
It might be pushing it, but you could even make the main bad guy be a descendant of Thauglorimorgorus, the original Purple Dragon who ruled this land before the elves. Maybe the main baddie wants to destabilize things enough to put himself or his own puppet in charge, returning the land to the control of someone descended from the first ruler.
Or all of them, scrambling over each other (and the PCs)? In fact, my current Cormyr-campaign features *both* Iron Throne and Eldreth Veluuthra as major campaign villains (in addition to the "obvious" Cyricists, Zhents and Red Wizards). |
"What am I doing today? Ask me tomorrow - I can be sure of giving you the right answer then."
-- Askarran of Selgaunt, Master Sage, speaking to a curious merchant, Year of the Helm |
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Wrigs13
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
201 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2009 : 21:42:56
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Wrigs13
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Oh, that's a given. I was just saying that I didn't see the king's grandson thru a daughter being the rightful heir when the king's son was around.
Fair point but who is cutest?
Me, of course.
In which case I will sponser you as rightful ruler of Cormyr.
Long live King Wooly Rupert I! |
Do not try to understand the 4th edition. Thats impossible. Instead...only try to realise the truth. There is no 4th edition. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36966 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2009 : 22:06:59
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quote:
Originally posted by Wrigs13
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Wrigs13
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Oh, that's a given. I was just saying that I didn't see the king's grandson thru a daughter being the rightful heir when the king's son was around.
Fair point but who is cutest?
Me, of course.
In which case I will sponser you as rightful ruler of Cormyr.
Long live King Wooly Rupert I!
It's good to be King.  |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2009 : 22:48:47
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quote:
Originally posted by Wrigs13
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Wrigs13
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Oh, that's a given. I was just saying that I didn't see the king's grandson thru a daughter being the rightful heir when the king's son was around.
Fair point but who is cutest?
Me, of course.
In which case I will sponser you as rightful ruler of Cormyr.
Long live King Wooly Rupert I!
"Oh ****, there's goes the planet!" 
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Wrigs13
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
201 Posts |
Posted - 04 Mar 2009 : 12:49:57
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Not to bring the newly appointed King back to the point, but who would gain the most or be most motivated by the idea of chaos in Cormyr?
Is Besheba that petty?
Do the Fire Knives want to regain power or just revenge? |
Do not try to understand the 4th edition. Thats impossible. Instead...only try to realise the truth. There is no 4th edition. |
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader
USA
3252 Posts |
Posted - 04 Mar 2009 : 13:46:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Wrigs13
Not to bring the newly appointed King back to the point, but who would gain the most or be most motivated by the idea of chaos in Cormyr?
The Short List (in no particular order):
A) Disgruntled Nobles
B) The Zhentarim
C) Malcontent Nobles
D) Sembian Merchants
E) Power-hungry Nobles
F) The Church of Cyric (just because it is chaos)
G) Sneaky-Tricksey Nobles
H) The Shades
I) Back-stabbing Nobles
J) The Fire Knives
K) Money-hoarding/Blackmarket Nobles |
I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.
Ashe's Character Sheet
Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36966 Posts |
Posted - 04 Mar 2009 : 14:11:44
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quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart
quote:
Originally posted by Wrigs13
Not to bring the newly appointed King back to the point, but who would gain the most or be most motivated by the idea of chaos in Cormyr?
The Short List (in no particular order):
A) Disgruntled Nobles
B) The Zhentarim
C) Malcontent Nobles
D) Sembian Merchants
E) Power-hungry Nobles
F) The Church of Cyric (just because it is chaos)
G) Sneaky-Tricksey Nobles
H) The Shades
I) Back-stabbing Nobles
J) The Fire Knives
K) Money-hoarding/Blackmarket Nobles
You forgot to mention unhappy nobles.
And hey, this is post 15,000 for me! |
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Wrigs13
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
201 Posts |
Posted - 04 Mar 2009 : 14:53:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart
quote:
Originally posted by Wrigs13
Not to bring the newly appointed King back to the point, but who would gain the most or be most motivated by the idea of chaos in Cormyr?
The Short List (in no particular order):
A) Disgruntled Nobles
B) The Zhentarim
C) Malcontent Nobles
D) Sembian Merchants
E) Power-hungry Nobles
F) The Church of Cyric (just because it is chaos)
G) Sneaky-Tricksey Nobles
H) The Shades
I) Back-stabbing Nobles
J) The Fire Knives
K) Money-hoarding/Blackmarket Nobles
You forgot to mention unhappy nobles.
And hey, this is post 15,000 for me!
Congratulations Wooly.
So I take it that Nobles are probably involved. |
Do not try to understand the 4th edition. Thats impossible. Instead...only try to realise the truth. There is no 4th edition. |
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crazedventurers
Master of Realmslore
United Kingdom
1073 Posts |
Posted - 04 Mar 2009 : 18:38:10
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Answer from Brian (Garen Thal) and confirmed by Ed as well re sucession
"To answer the salient question, though: an heir to the throne, thought dead, does not immediately supplant another heir that has been declared heir apparent. Foril was, at the time of his death, the heir presumptive to the Dragon Throne, but his reappearance does not in any way place him first in line for the job."
Cheers
Damian |
So saith Ed. I've never said he was sane, have I?
Gods, all this writing and he's running a constant fantasy version of Coronation Street in his head, too. .
shudder,
love to all,
THO
Candlekeep Forum 7 May 2005 |
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crazedventurers
Master of Realmslore
United Kingdom
1073 Posts |
Posted - 04 Mar 2009 : 18:42:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Wrigs13
Is Besheba that petty?
Beshaba perhaps not (misfortune, ill luck), but Talos is another manner..... (he is the God of Chaos for me, and more subtle than just raging storms his portfolio suggests)
Just my thoughts
Damian
not that I am suggesting that in my game Talos did cause the decade long civil war and all the other problems the Forest Country is having..... |
So saith Ed. I've never said he was sane, have I?
Gods, all this writing and he's running a constant fantasy version of Coronation Street in his head, too. .
shudder,
love to all,
THO
Candlekeep Forum 7 May 2005 |
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Wrigs13
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
201 Posts |
Posted - 04 Mar 2009 : 20:46:37
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I was only thinking of Besheba just to spite for Tymora, and one pc is a priest of Tymora.  |
Do not try to understand the 4th edition. Thats impossible. Instead...only try to realise the truth. There is no 4th edition. |
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Topic |
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Evil Organisations in Cormyr
