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Originally posted by Jamallo Kreen



Long ago a DM pointed out to me that his Supers character, a female human who could regenerate, was virgo intacta each and every time she had sex, which led to this real question coming up during a session of my game: if a female who has had the flower of her maidenhood plucked is thereafter given a cure light wounds or stronger healing spell, does she revert to being virgo intacta?

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Originally posted by Markustay

Also, even it it did effect her 'virtues'

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So if you got yourself one of those mythical virgins, you can repeat your honeymoon night over and over and over...

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Originally posted by ErskineF

I think it's called a 'hymen'.

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Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin

You know, it's possible for women to be born without a hymen, or to for it to break from physical activity other than sex. Also, I have it on good authority that it is scientifically impossible to tell if a person is a "virgin"* by examining her hymen.

Also, remember that the Realms isn't a setting that considers chastity synomonous with moral virtue, at least according to everything Ed has said on the subject. For this reason, I am puzzled by the talk in here equating virginity with "purity" and such within the setting--heck, I'm puzzled by it even in the real world (I know where the ideas come from, I just don't think they're rational).




*Especially since the concept of "virginity" isn't particularly scientific to begin with.

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Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin

For this reason, I am puzzled by the talk in here equating virginity with "purity" and such within the setting--heck, I'm puzzled by it even in the real world (I know where the ideas come from, I just don't think they're rational). I'm skeptical of the idea that most people in the Realms would care much at all about either virginity or having an intact hymen.

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April 25, 2007:

Speaking of which, Ed DOES have some Realmslore to impart, this time regarding this recent query from Kuje: “Ed, do any of the races know of, or use, circumcision? If you would, also answer if there are any races/nations/etc that operate on female genitalia.... I phrased that as gently as I could think of.”

The Sage expressed his interest in hearing Ed’s reply, and Eytan Bernstein then echoed: “I apologize in advance to the squeamish.

...

On the same note, I have a faint recollection of reading about some sort of - how should I put it - sterilization ceremony in one of Elaine's Councilors and Kings novels. Is there any precedent for sterilization, eunuchs, castration, or similar processes, whether magical or surgical? See what kind of can we've opened up here?”

and Zandilar posted: “Heya, Heh... This is interesting stuff I have to say. I'd be interested in reading answers to these questions too.

However, I must say, in such a magic rich world I sincerely doubt that such proceedures would be performed wholely surgically... Magic can achieve a lot of things, and it isn't beyond the realms of possibility that most small towns or even primitive tribes might have a cleric, adept, or shaman that can use 0 or 1st level divine spells. That means access to Cure Minor Wounds (useful for stopping bleeding), and Cure Light Wounds (for more substantial injuries, like during actual casteration or sustained during an initiation rite) - if not an actual spell or minor magical ritual to circumcise, castrate, or even spay/neuter animals.

...

Dargoth then directed Eytan to Ed’s earlier posts (archived by Kuje): “you should find some stuff on Princess Alusair of Cormyr which mentions magical sterilization”

Ed now speaks:

Thanks, all. In the Realms, sterilization is usually accomplished magically (which has the benefit of usually being reversible, so you can let a young prince/princess or other heir/heiress “have fun” without causing unwanted bastards), or (in rural areas) by cutting out the male testes and then cauterizing the wound, sometimes as an clerical rite (either with magical or herbal pain-deadening, or not), and sometimes to create the equivalent of “eunuch harem guards” (BTW, these are as rare in the Realms as they were in real life, and as in real life, the penis is seldom removed except as a cruel punishment).

Certain priesthoods (Loviatar, for example) do use piercings, brandings, scarifications, and other ritual practices that embrace pain (salt put into wounds, for example), but aside from piercings, the female genitalia are left alone. A priestess of Loviatar wants to continue to have the ability to feel pain, not have sensation cut off forever (and her genitalia are likely to be whipped - - often with stinging nettles - - in rituals, or endure the wax of melting candles carried in a manner you can guess at, NOT be permanently scarred). There’s no cultural basis in Faerûn for female circumcision.

The basis for all such behaviour in the Realms is religious or (more rarely) locally cultural, NOT racial.

Some priesthoods cut off foreskins or introduce beads under the skin all over the male member, or even pierce the member (to hold dangling talismans normally hidden except in holy inner temple rituals). These may be isolated sects, or only practiced in some temples, or among “secret societies” of zealots within a faith - - and in any event usually mark the achievement of a certain holy rank, or augmentations (yes, more talismans) as ranks increase.

Among the Netherese diaspora there were all sorts of “odd” beliefs (held or just suggested by the various archwizards) that have since become further twisted by time and misunderstandings, into purely local practices (often coming-of-age rituals, which can be as tame as vigils or forest chases, and as severe as ceremonial deflowerings, brandings, or circumcisions.

In short, there’s nothing shameful or “disgusting” about tattoos, or brands (except obvious slave or “this person is a traitor” brands) or piercings (nipple, ear, labial, etc.) but they are more uncommon than common across Faerûn. Remember, in a polytheistic world, especially in locales (ports and capitals) where trade-travel is frequent, tolerance of “different ways” is high; the real-world small-town repression and disdain for “those who are different” is far rarer in the Realms. Having multiple races (not just humans with different skin colours) and “everybody knowing all the gods are real, not just one” will cause that, inevitably.

So, Eytan, if you need a priesthood (or a ruling noble family, or a secret society or cult) to have a circumcision ritual, feel free to add it. However, there has to be a reason why not every reader of Realms novels and game products doesn’t already know about it. In other words, it’s likely to be secretive (or at least done within a faith), and locally-based, not something that applies all across a country or continent. (I’m reminded of the old real-world joke about the village that only had one sharp knife, so the boys had to line up about half a year before they came of age...)

So saith Ed.

Who is trying to be helpful without being TOO explicit. He didn’t tell you about the priestesses of Loviatar with the frontal triangle of chains joining their, er, prominent bits, or some of the other sights that certainly made Torm of the Knights open his eyes wide and make inevitable comments...

Ahem.

love to all,
THO

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On March 21, 2008 THO said:- It would indeed (you naughty, naughty lads; why, if this goes on, I'll have to be commanding some of you to whip me), but to answer the question seriously: Ed ran healing thus: tissue and skin completely restored, old air expelled as ash, new hair (in condition just as before, so if it was graying or going white, it still is) starts to grow immediately. The hair grows about an inch an hour, until it reaches the length it was before affected by the fire, with two exceptions: it stops growing immediately, ending the effects of the healing magic, if any other magic is cast directly on it or the body part it's growing from, or it is cut (sheared, trimmed) with "cold iron" (iron, steel, ferrous alloys). so much I can remember quite vividly. I think I'll leave the "quite vivid" part private until some scribe happens to ask a question that would 'legitimately' reveal it.
love to all,
THO
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The Singing Sprite: [...]
The Sprite is named for Lathiril Shrune, the long-dead wife
of its builder, the human wizard named Ganatharas. She was a
sprite who sang atop tables to the delight of patrons.
-- The North: Cities. p.64

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