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Demzer
Senior Scribe
877 Posts |
 Posted - 03 Aug 2013 : 13:47:47
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Awesome as always, Brian!
Thinking about the Blades, it's a tricky situation:
1 - Pending Filfaeril/Caladnei/Laspeera's vetos on specific individuals the Blades will be the next "ruling class" among the nobility of the Realms (the new Lords and Lady Lords, Purple Dragon officers, Wardens and so on). So if your sons or daughters are "out of the loop" your family will be too, especially if you're not one of the royal noble houses or of the loyal old guard.
2 - And if you're one of those noble houses that isn't so loyal to the Crown and would gladly build a ruling council of nobles (like what was proposed during the Abraxus Affair) you have to decide between getting out of the loop (and losing influence even among the nobility) or "surrendering" your sons and daughters to the Blades (and probably seeing them being "corrupted" by Alusair's and the other nobles influence and turning loyal to the Crown despite your house plans for them).
Am i completely wrong and off the mark with these assumptions? |
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 04 Aug 2013 : 04:15:00
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quote:
Originally posted by Demzer
Awesome as always, Brian!
Thinking about the Blades, it's a tricky situation:
1 - Pending Filfaeril/Caladnei/Laspeera's vetos on specific individuals the Blades will be the next "ruling class" among the nobility of the Realms (the new Lords and Lady Lords, Purple Dragon officers, Wardens and so on). So if your sons or daughters are "out of the loop" your family will be too, especially if you're not one of the royal noble houses or of the loyal old guard.
2 - And if you're one of those noble houses that isn't so loyal to the Crown and would gladly build a ruling council of nobles (like what was proposed during the Abraxus Affair) you have to decide between getting out of the loop (and losing influence even among the nobility) or "surrendering" your sons and daughters to the Blades (and probably seeing them being "corrupted" by Alusair's and the other nobles influence and turning loyal to the Crown despite your house plans for them).
Am i completely wrong and off the mark with these assumptions?
Not exactly.
Alusair keeps her Blades close to her to determine their worth an sincerity; to have able blades nearby; to placate those who insist that she marry, nobly and soon; to ensure the loyalty of their houses; but most of all, to groom these young men. Alusair believes that proper duty to the realm comes from service to one's fellows, and that one gains the fastest fellows on the battlefield. She knows full well that nobles will be the high courtiers and military commanders of Azoun's court, and wants to ensure that these gentlemen have more than their own interests, and those of their houses, at heart.
Some nobles don't need testing, or prove themselves in other ways--excelling as a commander, for example--but those nobles will earn their positions without a close relationship with Alusair.
Being one of Alusair's "blades" isn't an appointment. You can't be drafted or pressed into service. Alusair needs to want you to ride with her, and if she does, she'll use that time to test your worth, or you'll soon be found elsewhere. Families don't "surrender" or even volunteer their sons to be among Alusair's cohort. She selects them. |
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Demzer
Senior Scribe
877 Posts |
Posted - 04 Aug 2013 : 18:14:17
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Uhm, i'm still a little confused.
What's clear to me:
1 - Alusair keeps the Blades close to her to test them, groom them and shape them in a cohesive future ruling class devoted to the Realm.
2 - Alusair selects the Blades from among the nobility, "service" in the Blades is not forced in any way and prospective members can refuse.
3 - Not being in the Blades doesn't prevent nobles that distinguish themselves at court or on the battlefield or somewhere else from becoming high courtiers and military commanders.
What's not clear to me:
1 - Refusing to join the Blades has no consequences? Isn't it seen like not wanting to prove yourself a true loyal Cormyrean noble? Since i doubt that Alusair's going to ask "non-combatant"* nobles or those already serving the Realm in other guises to ride with her this leaves those that refuse with what explanations? The only one that may hold is the "only heir" one, all the others arouse suspicion or infamy ("You fear for your well being? Above that of the Realm? Coward!", "What do you mean you don't like the Steel Regent? Traitor!" or "Your family doesn't want to send you? Neither your brother nor your cousin? Why? What are you hiding? Traitors!")**
And even if the refusal is accepted without questions and without insistence, i bet next time there is to appoint a new Purple Dragons commander those that refused the "screening" by avoiding to join the Blades will be at the bottom of the list of candidates (with the Blades and those that independently distinguished themselves way above them).
2 - In the case of traitorous or not particularly loyal houses the Blades are just another roadblock in the way of power, wealth and influence at court.
If you refuse your youngsters to the Blades, see above.
If you let your youngsters go in the Blades they will either be discarded (and i don't think a discarded Blade has any chance of seating in any position of power), turn to be valuable members of the Realm (yay for the Realm but probably not for your own schemes), get killed or they have to be so cunning, strong willed and lucky that they completely shrug off any good teaching they get while "serving" and avoid getting tagged as liar traitorous spell targets by the War Wizards that i suppose keep an eye on the Blades (highly unlikely).
In the end the effect is that said house either loses a son/daughter to death or to the Realm or said son/daughter loses any meaningful chance to be in any position of power in the near future.
In other words the noble house loses a generation while the Crown goes on strong and true.
With all this verbose post i'm not trying to find a way for traitorous nobles to get to positions of power in Cormyr easily and then betray the Crown.
I'm trying to figure out if my interpretation of the Blades as another way for the Crown to keep nobility in check is correct and therefore there are noble houses that secretly despise the situation and adds it up at the list of "reasons why i would live better without Obarskyrs"**.
Barely related question: how does the existence of the Blades "placate those who insist that she marry, nobly and soon"? (Filfaeril: "So dear, have you found that one honest special young man that will give me lots of grand-sons?" Alusair: "Not yet. But i have 20 new Blades, i'll bed them all and let you know")**
* "non-combatant" means those that have talents different from riding/archery/sword-swinging or that are inept
** wild exaggerations to make myself clear
As always thanks for your help in understanding the Forest Kingdom better and sorry if i'm pestering you on the matter. |
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 05 Aug 2013 : 02:53:53
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Demzer, I think part of the confusion stems from the fact that the Blades are not an official organization or unit in service to the Crown. The best way to think of them is as a clique or "gang," with Alusair at their head.
Telling Alusair you don't want to be among her Blades isn't seen as disloyalty to the Crown, although the wrong reasons for refusing to ride beside the Steel Regent (as leisure, remember, not in times of war) can be seen as a personal insult. There are nobles with responsibilities to their families, those with ill relatives who expect them to stay near home, those with business interests they need to tend to, and those with actual commands in the Purple Dragons. All of these are perfectly legitimate reasons not to ride beside Alusair.
Alusair invites those she expects to accept. Some tight-laced courtly noble might be a perfectly capable commander, but who isn't any fun, is like not to be invited.
Now, that's not to say that Alusair doesn't take refusals personally. Of course she does. But she holds the good of the realm over her pride. A legitimate or regretful refusal has no real repercussions.
Young nobles--especially those who don't stand to inherit immediately--take to adventuring and 'riding the realm' in their youths as a means to seek excitement. Generally, this means drawing bright swords against brigands, getting captured by said brigands, purchasing expensive armor, getting lost in old ruins, threatening common folk who don't deserve it, wenching across the realm, and otherwise getting into trouble. From among those that go riding, Alusair picks her Blades to redirect some of that energy into tasks she feels are important--and, yes, win friendships among the young nobility. If they're going to be riding and slashing brigands and drinking and wenching, better they do the first three under her watch, and some of the fourth with her, rather than siring a whole new generation of bastards. (And yes, Balin the Cavalier, an alias of her father's, is exactly the sort of noble that would be invited into the Blades.)
Being a Blade isn't a permanent thing. Some few Blades die. Some get appointed to Purple Dragon offices or court titles. Some tire of riding the realm. Some inherit titles or lands and go off to run their households. Some decide to become full-on adventurers. Eventually, being nobles with families to consider, almost all wind up getting married.
It's absolutely true that being a Blade means a closer personal relationship (and not just sexual) with Alusair. It's not necessarily true that this personal relationship translates into a tangible benefit. Alusair sometimes finds that a friend is wholly incapable of doing a task she might otherwise have assigned him if she did not know him so well.
People who disapprove of Alusair have one of the following opinions of their sons being Blades:
-Yes, stay close to her, and learn her secrets, for the betterment of your House.
-Alusair's father slept his way through most of the nobility of Cormyr, and she only means to finish the job. Stay away.
-I don't care what she does, but if you are to advance, you'll need this friendship.
Basically, traitorous houses don't want their sons becoming friends with Alusair, but some are willing to let them try and earn her trust.
As for placating, it has nothing to do with Filfaeril (who has long stopped insisting on Alusair marrying), but rather, it stems the tide of noble after noble seeking Alusair at Court to ask for her hand. The kind of men she prefers are around her all the time. If she was inclined to marry, it would be one of them. |
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Demzer
Senior Scribe
877 Posts |
Posted - 05 Aug 2013 : 09:33:15
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Perfect!
Everything cleared up.
Many thanks, Brian! |
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Demzer
Senior Scribe
877 Posts |
Posted - 11 Aug 2013 : 11:22:31
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And i'm back for more:
1 - Has anyone ever made the connection between the Cormyrean caravans of sapphires and the low taxation in Cormyr? I'm not referring to specific individuals (that will probably just be silenced/mind controlled by the War Wizards) but rather to organizations like the Knights of the Shield, the Council of Six in Amn, the Twisted Rune or even the Zhentarim or Harpers. All this organizations (except the Harpers and the Twisted Rune that are professional meddlers) have strong commercial and financial interests and will surely keep an eye on caravans of big, perfect sapphires even if they appear infrequently. The Zhentarim in their quest for the destabilization of Cormyr must have tried to research the source of the financial stability of the Realm.
2 - From my (limited) knowledge Cormyr is the thriving happy country beset by hostile interests and forced to defend itself from all types of attacks. Has Cormyr ever tried to expand past his known borders (roughly Tunlands/Stonelands/Thunder Peaks/Lake of Dragons)? Has Cormyr ever attempted an invasion of Sembia? And if not, why?
3 - What are post-Devil Dragon Cormyr relations with the following neighbours?
- Proskur;
- Iriaebor;
- Easting;
- Elversult;
- Ilipur;
- Pros;
- Teziir;
- Westgate (with all its baggage of exiled cormyreans and infamous Night Masks); |
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 11 Aug 2013 : 17:28:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Demzer
And i'm back for more:
1 - Has anyone ever made the connection between the Cormyrean caravans of sapphires and the low taxation in Cormyr? I'm not referring to specific individuals (that will probably just be silenced/mind controlled by the War Wizards) but rather to organizations like the Knights of the Shield, the Council of Six in Amn, the Twisted Rune or even the Zhentarim or Harpers. All this organizations (except the Harpers and the Twisted Rune that are professional meddlers) have strong commercial and financial interests and will surely keep an eye on caravans of big, perfect sapphires even if they appear infrequently. The Zhentarim in their quest for the destabilization of Cormyr must have tried to research the source of the financial stability of the Realm.
2 - From my (limited) knowledge Cormyr is the thriving happy country beset by hostile interests and forced to defend itself from all types of attacks. Has Cormyr ever tried to expand past his known borders (roughly Tunlands/Stonelands/Thunder Peaks/Lake of Dragons)? Has Cormyr ever attempted an invasion of Sembia? And if not, why?
3 - What are post-Devil Dragon Cormyr relations with the following neighbours?
- Proskur;
- Iriaebor;
- Easting;
- Elversult;
- Ilipur;
- Pros;
- Teziir;
- Westgate (with all its baggage of exiled cormyreans and infamous Night Masks);
1. Well, Volo has, for one. Sapphires from the Crystal Grot are not sold by the caravan or the cart load, but in small amounts in distant lands, usually transported by trusted couriers. When a large sapphire can net you the same coin as raising the tax on fifty thousand commoners by a single silver, you take advantage of the opportunity.
2. Officially, the rest of Faerūn views the Tunlands and the Stonelands as Cormyrean, which is to say, "Cormyr's problem." The same is true of the mountain ranges and the Lake of Dragons (although Westgate has much to say about activities east of the Neck).
Cormyr doesn't seek much expansion beyond its mountainous borders for two reasons: the grant of the elves (and before that, Thauglor) gave the Obarskyrs rule only within the ring formed by the mountains, but more importantly, it's incredibly difficult to defend those lands. Cormyr doesn't seek empire, and expanding for such a purpose is against its interests (they did, however, take on some cities as protectorates as Netheril's influence grew).
Cormyr doesn't expand into Sembia because it's full of Sembians.
3. This is slightly too much detail for me to go into right now. After the devil dragon, relations are good but distant: Alusair is concerned with securing Cormyr's own borders, everyone is watching Shade try to expand its influence, and the individual cities are going about their business. It's only when we reach the next century that these relations become more interesting. |
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Demzer
Senior Scribe
877 Posts |
Posted - 11 Aug 2013 : 22:26:35
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Thanks for the speedy reply, Brian.
quote:
Originally posted by Garen Thal
Well, Volo has, for one.
Ah! But we all know Volo is an avatar of Lord Ao ... or something ...
quote:
Originally posted by Garen Thal
Cormyr doesn't expand into Sembia because it's full of Sembians.
Uh, right, well, makes sense. Is there really this much bad blood? I mean yes, of course rich Sembians are a bunch of money grabbing schemers and whatnot but not every Sembian is a rich merchant or even a merchant.
quote:
Originally posted by Garen Thal
This is slightly too much detail for me to go into right now.
I'm sorry. Didn't mean to bother you too much.
My last attempt at annoying you is by asking some questions about Westgate mid 1370s:
1 - What's the Cormyreans opinion on Westgate?
2 - Does the Crown know about the Fire Knives and the exiled Cormaerils/Bleth?
2a - If yes to the above, has the Crown dispatched Highknights and/or War Wizards to keep an eye on the Fire Knives or to thwart their plans? |
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 11 Aug 2013 : 22:36:53
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It's not about bad blood; it's about the fact that there are fundamental cultural differences that have been brought about by centuries of divergent development, and it doesn't appeal to Cormyr to invade another country and then try and convert the locals' culture. Yes, Cormyreans look down on Sembians (and the opposite is also true), but there's little gain in such an invasion.
Cormyreans see Westgate as a cesspool. Much is allowable there that's not in Cormyr, and it's where the dregs of society can be sent to be out of sight and mind. As Skullport is to Waterdeep, to most Cormyreans, so is Westgate to Cormyr.
Yes, the Crown knows about the Fire Knives. It's a primary reason the group is not permitted to operate in Cormyr. Of course, there are agents in Westgate (and elsewhere) to thwart the Fire Knives, with varying degrees of success. |
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Demzer
Senior Scribe
877 Posts |
Posted - 12 Aug 2013 : 16:02:04
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| Many thanks for the swift reply and more for your willingness to answer questions! |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31777 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2014 : 04:53:53
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Greetings Brian,
I've a quick query about something you wrote in your "Blades of Kings: The Cormyrean Swords of State" article for DRAGON #407.
On the first page of your write-up, you note that folk sometimes pray near the specially housed swords. I'm curious as to whether you had any specific deities in mind that these folk would regularly pray to, like Tyr or Helm, for example? Or could it just be any deity the devotee wishes to pray to for guidance?
Interestingly, I thought that, perhaps, maybe some of the more "Cormyrean-centric" devotees might actually pray to one or all of the "functions" you've attributed to each sword -- deifying or 'spiritualising' [for lack of a more appropriate term] the functions of Ansrivarr, Orbyn, Rissar and/or Symylazarr as divine philosophies made manifest in each of the blades and the mythologies that surround them.
Thoughts? |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 25 Jun 2014 : 14:03:30
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Greetings Brian,
I've a quick query about something you wrote in your "Blades of Kings: The Cormyrean Swords of State" article for DRAGON #407.
On the first page of your write-up, you note that folk sometimes pray near the specially housed swords. I'm curious as to whether you had any specific deities in mind that these folk would regularly pray to, like Tyr or Helm, for example? Or could it just be any deity the devotee wishes to pray to for guidance?
Interestingly, I thought that, perhaps, maybe some of the more "Cormyrean-centric" devotees might actually pray to one or all of the "functions" you've attributed to each sword -- deifying or 'spiritualising' [for lack of a more appropriate term] the functions of Ansrivarr, Orbyn, Rissar and/or Symylazarr as divine philosophies made manifest in each of the blades and the mythologies that surround them.
Thoughts?
Young children look at the swords as sort of friendly spirits, with direct lines to the gods. They aren't animate, and certainly don't have any will of their own, but in the same way that a modern child might make his or her wishes known by speaking aloud to a toy or doll so that a parent might overhear, children will whisper secret desires to the swords.
Many adults see the swords as a sort of hotline to the gods, but are more specific in their direction. It's rare that a person goes to the Shrine to specifically offer worship to a given deity, but there are usually a few deities that are expected to hear the prayers and desires uttered in secret to one of the swords.
Here are some samples of the sorts of prayers that might be offered, and which deities might be expected to hear them.
Ansrivarr: Prayers for steadfastness, longevity, vigilance, or healing. Deities: Chauntea, Helm, Lathander, Torm
Orbyn: Prayers for justice, vengeance, revelation of secrets, or divine retribution. Deities: Tyr, Hoar, Ibrandul, Shar, Bhaal, Cyric
Rissar: Prayers for love, attraction, marriage. Deities: Sune, Sharess, Siamorphe
Symylazarr: Prayers for battle valor, skill at arms, knightly recognition, or specific victory. Deities Tempus, Red Knight, Torm
No prayers for the dead are ever offered at the Shrine. These are normally reserved for the Monument of the Purple Dragon to the northwest.
It should be noted that while most Cormyreans don't do much praying/offering at the Shrine, almost all of them do believe that these prayers are heard, and that when one of the swords is drawn and wielded, these wishes may be fulfilled--if the sword is drawn for a purpose related to the whispered desire.
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31777 Posts |
Posted - 19 Sep 2014 : 04:17:26
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Ed brought this up in his scroll, and I meant to also ask you of it here as well, at the same time, but I seem to have forgotten.
Anyways:-
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
A possible quick one for Ed, or mayhap Garen Thal:-
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
Zhonder's Study (named for a Court Sage who perished in the reign of King Duar protecting royal records during the "troubles;" this room had been his workplace)
I'm not familiar with this curious fellow. And I don't recall his mentioning in any previous Realmslore.
What more can you share with us about Zhonder?
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 19 Sep 2014 : 14:28:31
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On Zhonder:
There is not much that I can say without stealing Ed's thunder, but Zhonder was (to my estimation, at least), though not a mage (or not one of any identifiable power) the sort of calm, thoughtful, far-thinking sage around whom the prototypical War Wizard s built: examining situations and documents, and contemplating scenarios in which peril might face the realm--and then determining the best way to meet that peril. Though much of his work was done in quiet, with light and parchment and quill and little else, his example is used to point out the importance of studying and understanding historical records.
One such wizard, far more modern, was Aundable Inthré, Laspeera's husband, who no doubt spent some time in Zhonder's Study, though he was the sort to root out more direct threats to the kingdom.
Maybe more from Ed, later? |
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Asgetrion
Master of Realmslore
Finland
1564 Posts |
Posted - 02 Nov 2014 : 23:54:32
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Garen, would you have any information about the ruling clan and other prominent dwarven clans and families that dwelled in Thunderholme before its fall? (actually, around the time Emerlin III died)
Yeah, I know I already asked this on Ed's thread, and I don't normally press you esteemed loremasters for answers, but this time I'm in a hurry, because I'm likely going to need the information in the next session of my Cormyr campaign (very soon, that is).  
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"What am I doing today? Ask me tomorrow - I can be sure of giving you the right answer then."
-- Askarran of Selgaunt, Master Sage, speaking to a curious merchant, Year of the Helm |
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Eilserus
Master of Realmslore
USA
1446 Posts |
Posted - 28 Dec 2014 : 04:31:57
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Hi Garen,
In the novel Cormyr, at the beginning when Thauglor is eating forest buffalo, he speaks with the black hatchling Kreston. Kreston says: "Spawn of Casarial out of Miranatol, grandchild of Hesior, blood of the mighty Thauglorimorgorus, the Black Doom. Sir."
Is there anything else that could be said of Miranatol, Kreston, Casarial, or Hesior?
A bit further into the story, Thauglor notes that "dwarves distrusted the woods from some long-past racial trauma and would only risk crossing through a dragon's domain if there were rich metals to be found."
Is there anything that can be told as to what this racial trauma was?
And lastly, we have Skurge and her offspring, Tyra and Despayr (both young now dead) who lived in Araulurrin, the central cavern and capital city of old Oghrann. Given that Oghrann's boundaries did encompass the Storm Horns, were there any other dwarven cities in the Storm Horns (I know THO mentioned there was one hidden in the western wall, unknown if part of old Oghrann.)?
Was Thauglor's hoard ever found/recovered? And if possible, where was his lair?
Many thanks!
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Edited by - Eilserus on 28 Dec 2014 16:36:41 |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6666 Posts |
Posted - 28 Dec 2014 : 04:45:40
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Sorry to butt in, but the phrase 'out of Miranatol' is an old way of saying Miranatol was the daddy dragon. It's not a place.
-- George Krashos |
"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Eilserus
Master of Realmslore
USA
1446 Posts |
Posted - 28 Dec 2014 : 16:35:04
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| Well don't I feel like a dingaling. hehe. Thanks George. ;) |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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Questions for Brian Cortijo
