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Crennen FaerieBane
Master of Realmslore
USA
1378 Posts |
 Posted - 01 Apr 2008 : 17:09:01
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I mean, I have asked many times - and I am not talking about just Drizzt.
They are a wonderful race for villians, have appeal in many aspects (yes, everyone knows I love Vierna), and I, personally, like them very much.
Is it that you think they're overexposed? Used to often? Don't like them killing all sorts of other races? Oppostion to an anti-mysogynistic race?
I just see a lot of hate at the race. It's almost like hating vanilla because it's the most popular flavor.
Plz tellz me y u haet drow, kk? I want to know, as I am positively curious.
C-Fb
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Still rockin' the Fey'ri style. |
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Mace Hammerhand
Great Reader
Germany
2296 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2008 : 17:30:51
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I don't hate them at all.
I hate caraway...with a passion, makes me wanna puke, caraway that is.
Drow are cool...no, wait, let me rephrase that since cool has become such an abomination of a word...
Drow are the meanest and most dangerous of villains there are. I like them.
Why should I hate them? |
Mace's not so gentle gamer's journal My rants were harmless compared to this, beware! |
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Aravine
Senior Scribe
USA
608 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2008 : 17:47:39
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| I have no hate for the Drow whatsoever. I don't even hate Drizzt. I do dislike the popularity of him, and all the fanboys who think drizzt is "the best spellcaster" in the Realms. I have no problem with people who can say "Drizzt is the coolest character in the realms and here's why"And actually give me a reason not just "he' s awesome" . Back to drow, they are cool villians. but I wouldn't say the coolest, or meanest. but that's just my opinion |
The brave don't live forever,the cautious don't live at all |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2008 : 18:13:37
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| I don't hate the drow, but I would agree that they are overexposed. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Mace Hammerhand
Great Reader
Germany
2296 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2008 : 19:42:51
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Overexposed...so is Brittney Spears...
that sounded funnier when I thought about it |
Mace's not so gentle gamer's journal My rants were harmless compared to this, beware! |
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riot the outsider
Learned Scribe
USA
121 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2008 : 20:21:44
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| I don't hate the drow either. In the realms everyone may the drow cause there known for killing everyone but most surface dwellers( sun elves) mostly. |
Those who fear the darkness have never seen what the light can do. http://s13.gladiatus.com/game/c.php?uid=67846
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AlorinDawn
Learned Scribe
USA
313 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2008 : 21:32:20
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I don't hate drow. I don't hate Drizzt. I actually loved the first six Drizzt books, but then got bored with them. I thought drow were kinda cool back in the Fiend Folio days when they had stats that made sense like diminished physical attributes and enhanced mental capabilities. I do however dislike the people who are all mental about Drow. When I say all mental, I mean the fanboys who seem to be single minded in their "drow are cooler than anything and all are adventures revolve around drow and Drizzt hangs out with our PCs all the time and that makes us all cool!" mentality
Now that I think about it, it's really me just being a dorky D&D snob. I am pretty attached to some characters, races, & locals (Hi Ed, it's me, bugging you about Loudwater again!). Folks who make fan pages about how much they love drow are no more or less dorky then me, who made a myspace page for his cat :)
Love the drow all ya want, I'll still look funny at ya, but you can just look funny at me too.
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Karzak
Learned Scribe
196 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2008 : 22:24:20
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| I don't think many people actually hate drow, as such. But as other people've said, it's the fanboys and the Drizzt clones that have soured drow by association. |
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sfdragon
Great Reader
2285 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2008 : 22:28:58
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dont hate them, played a drizzt's father clone once, then a drizt clone, got bored with them.
played an original and had more fun with it.
fanboy chars stink. |
why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power
My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234 |
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Mace Hammerhand
Great Reader
Germany
2296 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2008 : 22:31:45
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| I mean, seriously, when I read something like "This post is for all loyal to the drow", aside from that it is somewhat silly... come on "loyal" ... did anyone swear fealty, allegiance or their firstborn to a fictional race? If so, this action (the swearing thingy etc) is proof to me that I am actually quite sane. |
Mace's not so gentle gamer's journal My rants were harmless compared to this, beware! |
Edited by - Mace Hammerhand on 01 Apr 2008 22:42:38 |
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BARDOBARBAROS
Senior Scribe
Greece
581 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2008 : 22:39:54
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| I love drow race (as villains)..I love Drizzt...I love Eilistraee... |
BARDOBARBAROS DOES NOT KILL.
HE DECAPITATES!!!
"The city changes, but the fools within it remain always the same" (Edwin Odesseiron- Baldur's gate 2) |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2008 : 23:29:12
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quote:
Originally posted by Mace Hammerhand
I mean, seriously, when I read something like "This post is for all loyal to the drow", aside from that it is somewhat silly... come on "loyal" ... did anyone swear fealty, allegiance or their firstborn to a fictional race? If so, this action (the swearing thingy etc) is proof to me that I am actually quite sane.
It's entertaining if nothing else. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Caedwyr
Seeker
87 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 01:11:32
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i dohnt h8 teh drow butt i do feal they hve bean overxposed + bean inc0nsistently portrade things stop beeing specal or interesting if they r used two much. also R.A. Salvatore coms of as a bit of a hack fantasy riter who is always beeing pushed especially compared too other realms riters. As sum1 said, hes done whell fore a sword fight comentator.
;) If you can read that, it sums up most of my feelings on Salvatore. D&D books can be fun escapism but do come across as pulpy when compared to authors such as Robin Hobb, George R.R. Martin, Carol Berg, J.K. Rowlings, Jim Butcher, Ursula K. Leguin, Ian Irvine, Tolkien, and easily a dozen others I could name if I looked at my bookshelf. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31727 Posts |
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Karzak
Learned Scribe
196 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 01:56:05
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quote:
Originally posted by Mace Hammerhand
I mean, seriously, when I read something like "This post is for all loyal to the drow", aside from that it is somewhat silly... come on "loyal" ... did anyone swear fealty, allegiance or their firstborn to a fictional race? If so, this action (the swearing thingy etc) is proof to me that I am actually quite sane.
I see you're not familiar with Trekkies. ;D
quote:
Originally posted by Caedwyr
;) If you can read that, it sums up most of my feelings on Salvatore. D&D books can be fun escapism but do come across as pulpy when compared to authors such as Robin Hobb, George R.R. Martin, Carol Berg, J.K. Rowlings, Jim Butcher, Ursula K. Leguin, Ian Irvine, Tolkien, and easily a dozen others I could name if I looked at my bookshelf.
Some of those I can agree with, but come on, Jim Butcher and JK Rowling? Those are pulp and nothing but - they are pretty much shallow escapism defined. |
Edited by - Karzak on 02 Apr 2008 01:56:44 |
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scererar
Master of Realmslore
USA
1618 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 02:41:48
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CFB long time no post  I actually like the drow, even Drizzt..... Scererar ducks for cover  |
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Caedwyr
Seeker
87 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 03:50:54
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| @Karzak: For Jim Butcher I was refering to his Codex Alera series and not the Dresden series. With regards to J.K. Rowling her novels are widely considered some of the top children's fantasy literature in a long while, and they cover some deeper subject matter especially as the series gets towards the end. Either way, I'd still argue that they are better fantasy novels/series than most of what R.A. Salvatore has done. |
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Karzak
Learned Scribe
196 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 04:11:54
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quote:
Originally posted by Caedwyr
@Karzak: For Jim Butcher I was refering to his Codex Alera series and not the Dresden series.
Fair enough; I haven't read those. I picked up Storm Front, finished it, and tossed it away. Found it unbelievably bland.
quote:
With regards to J.K. Rowling her novels are widely considered some of the top children's fantasy literature in a long while, and they cover some deeper subject matter especially as the series gets towards the end. Either way, I'd still argue that they are better fantasy novels/series than most of what R.A. Salvatore has done.
Eh, I'd put them at roughly the same level. JK Rowling tries to tackle "deeper" subject matter, sure, but trying isn't enough, or you should think Salvatore's ham-fisted handling of racism is literary gold. In fact, as the HP series progresses, it goes steadily downhill: the themes may seem more mature, but I'd say the author doesn't have the skills to pull them off. I'd classify the series from book five onward as complete drivel, and its continuing popularity is only a triumph of commercial phenomenon, nothing more. (And if you think popularity is an indication of quality, well, Salvatore is a New York Times bestseller, and there're talentless hacks like Christopher Paolini...) |
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Alisttair
Great Reader
Canada
3054 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 04:32:34
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| Drow are overexposed but great |
Karsite Arcanar (Most Holy Servant of Karsus)
Anauria - Survivor State of Netheril as penned by me:
http://www.dmsguild.com/m/product/172023 |
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Edain Shadowstar
Senior Scribe
USA
455 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 11:24:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Karzak:
I see you're not familiar with Trekkies.
I am afraid my better angels have failed to prevent me from replying thusly: are you implying something negative about the almighty Trek? If so, I must challenge you to a duel, to be conducted in the traditional nerd manner: a slap fight.
In all seriousness, and addressing the point at had (i.e. hatred of the Drow), I think the vitrol spewed towards the Drow by certain elements of the RPG community is a by-product of an all-to-common cycle that seems to befall those things that become popular, especially when the internet is involved. First, something becomes popular, second as its fanbase grows it gains a particularly vocal and slavish segment of fans, often called fanboys or fanbois, who proceed to crow loudly and immaturely about that thing to which they have pledged their devotion, often in adversarial and illogical manners (i.e. Drow are cool because they are Drow, and therefore anything that isn't Drow cannot be cool or in any way superior). This rabid, yet vocal, minority then promptly generates a backlash resulting in the vocal haters who this thread seems to be concerned with, who promptly employ similarly immature, nonspecific, illogical and immature arguments to support their position that, in this case, Drow suck and they hate them.
This all too common cycle seems to be a natural evolution of the extremes of supporters and detractors, one typically developing as a result of the development of the other. Now one might complain I am being too general in saying that all who hate Drow fall into this extreme category of irrational haters, but it is my opinion that short of as a rhetorical flourish one cannot use hate to describe a rational dislike of the fictitious Drow race. Thus while some may dislike the concept or execution of the Drow, to hate them puts one into a category not unlike the extreme devoutees, one predicated not out of any particular reason but rather as a response to the fanbois one finds so annoying, hating what they adore not because you necessarily dislike it but because they in fact adore it, loudly and rudely, much as the fanbois like it not for any particular reason than it is popular or cool.
Of course the vast majority of people fall into the middle area liking and disliking things for various reasons they make apparant, disliking Drow perhaps because they find them one-dimensional pantomimes of evil or liking them for the same reason. In this respect one can find a myriad of reason too numerous to list here why one might not like the Drow. One might find their concept unappealing, their execution uninspired or the course taken with them by the designer and authors in contradiction to how you thought they should have been developed.
Perhaps I am mincing words with this, but I think its important to distinguish between those who like or dislike the Drow for reasons other than because they are popular. So, in my opinion, the Drow inspire this hate in large part due to the fact they are popular, because there will always be people who hate things that are popular. They will be hated for not being in keeping with one's mental vision of them, they will be hated for being developed too much or not enough. Pick a reason, it'll apply.
For my part, I harbor no ill will towards the Drow. Like practically every concept proffered by the D&D designers over these many years it has had its applications in my campaign and has inspired various adventures. Any distaste I have related to the Drow is directed, for my part, towards the way in which Wizards converted them int the sacred cash cow of Third Edition, a point I have made many times before, and the poor presentation and over-saturation this resulted in. Of course this view, not unlike this post, is an opinion, and one limited by both my own experience and perspective. |
Edain Shadowstar
Archwizard of Rel Astra and Waterdeep
"Mmm…pie…"
- Gaius Solarian, Captain General |
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Mace Hammerhand
Great Reader
Germany
2296 Posts |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 13:37:36
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| I don't care much about the drow one way or the other, good villains and interesting in Eds Drows of the Underdark, but nothing more than that. They are overexposed though; I prefer to keep them as a hidden half-mythical threat. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 14:43:16
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quote:
Originally posted by Caedwyr
i dohnt h8 teh drow butt i do feal they hve bean overxposed + bean inc0nsistently portrade things stop beeing specal or interesting if they r used two much. also R.A. Salvatore coms of as a bit of a hack fantasy riter who is always beeing pushed especially compared too other realms riters. As sum1 said, hes done whell fore a sword fight comentator.
I especially enjoy the Drizzt fans who don't even know how to spell the name "Drizzt" (and I really like it when they spell it several different ways in the same paragraph). |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Crennen FaerieBane
Master of Realmslore
USA
1378 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 15:34:22
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quote:
Originally posted by scererar
CFB long time no post I actually like the drow, even Drizzt..... Scererar ducks for cover
Well, I should be around here more often, as it has been a long time I've actually had the pleasure to discuss the Realms with fellow players. And, since my days of playing WoW have changed me in a good way, I shall write to you from that world:
jus cuz teh drow r liek teh best raece evar, iz no reazon 2 haet teh guiz. Driztt iz teh gratest!!!11!!one!!1!
Ow, that hurt to write.
As for the Drow, I just think a lot of people have this seething hatred for Salvatore and all of his works. I think it's a bit disturbing as Ed had no problem giving that allowance to him. I have also really enjoyed Lisa Smedmen's books with the deicide and The Lady Penitent.
I agree they have been a bit overexposed, but why would you ever shelf something if it continues to be gobbled up by the public?
And by this - I am not telling people they should like Drow. :) Just was curious as to why I find so much dislike, or annoyance, on this site.
C-Fb |
Still rockin' the Fey'ri style. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 16:00:13
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quote:
Originally posted by CrennenFaerieBane
I agree they have been a bit overexposed, but why would you ever shelf something if it continues to be gobbled up by the public?
I don't think people actually expect that, even if they are annoyed by drow overexposure. Also, some people believe that other races that they enjoy (like the "short" races) haven't been given enough of a chance. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Crennen FaerieBane
Master of Realmslore
USA
1378 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 16:59:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
quote:
Originally posted by CrennenFaerieBane
I agree they have been a bit overexposed, but why would you ever shelf something if it continues to be gobbled up by the public?
I don't think people actually expect that, even if they are annoyed by drow overexposure. Also, some people believe that other races that they enjoy (like the "short" races) haven't been given enough of a chance.
I totally understand what you are saying, and I know there is a lot to write about in each and everyone of those cultures. I just think if they have a limited slate, it hamstrings the other cultures, which are known not to be as popular.
I have always been a Drow enthusiast; back when they showed up in the FF. I think their evoluation has been particularly pushed by Mr. Salvatore. But I do respect all of your opinions on the matter. :)
C-Fb |
Still rockin' the Fey'ri style. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 17:03:58
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| Well, I like the drow myself--I'm fond of the Promenade of Eilistraee and I have a drow monk who I love very much. So, I'm not saying I don't like the drow as a race. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Crennen FaerieBane
Master of Realmslore
USA
1378 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 17:06:41
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I know. We've had many a discussion about them. About the only thing I know you *dislike* is The Last Mythal series - but we've had our tiffs about that. 
C-Fb |
Still rockin' the Fey'ri style. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 18:08:35
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quote:
Originally posted by CrennenFaerieBane
I know. We've had many a discussion about them. About the only thing I know you *dislike* is The Last Mythal series - but we've had our tiffs about that.
C-Fb
*laughs* Indeed. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Chosen of Moradin
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1120 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 18:19:27
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| I agree with RF. I don´t hate the drow (they make excellent antagonists ), but I think that they are overexposed. |
Dwarf, DM, husband, and proud of this! :P
twitter: @yuripeixoto
Facebook: yuri.peixoto |
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Mace Hammerhand
Great Reader
Germany
2296 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2008 : 18:22:34
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As I said before, I like the drow, Drizzt, Liriel, Pharaun (who is one of my most favorite characters!). What I don't like are people who come in here, make one stupid-arsed post referring to another website for those "loyal" to the drow, whatever that means, and leave again.
There is, however, the need to get back to other races as well, like dwarves, halflings and whatnot... too much of a good (in this case evil) thing and all that. |
Mace's not so gentle gamer's journal My rants were harmless compared to this, beware! |
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And now I ask: Why the hate at Drow?
