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Charles Phipps
Master of Realmslore

1425 Posts

Posted - 08 Oct 2007 :  13:03:09  Show Profile  Visit Charles Phipps's Homepage Send Charles Phipps a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Topic
What changes have you made from canon in your games and why? How did they turn out in your games.

Some of the Changes I've made to my game are as follows...

Elminster: I've reduced his level to 20th and have removed Epic Levels from my Realms with it recognized the "human limit" for all intents and purposes. Elminster's Alignment is also True Neutral now with his job to support Magic in all of its form, irregardless of the measure. Furthermore, Elminster has a patholical phobia of directly intervening in affairs with a Prime Directive that he's only broken twice and both when the entire world of Toril was about to be destroyed. He, nevertheless, indirectly interferes by mentoring PCs and providing advice on pretty much every subject in the world. He also indirectly protects Shadowdale, and not other locale, by the fact that he will protect himself.

Fzoul: Has the odd quirk in our games of being genuinely honorable. He's still an evil madman obsessed with world domination but he always abides by the spirit of his word (unless ordered directly not to by Bane), respects worthy adversaries, and is a genuinely good leader with a loathing of wasting life.

Simbul: Is a straight 20th level Sorceress. She's also still CN with the people of her country viewing her as a "Necessary Evil." The Simbul routinely causes widespread misery and havoc by turning people into toads, burning down houses, and killing people who annoy her. This mixed with acts of equal good and decency. She's extremely petulant, selfish, and a little insane.

Manshoon is pretty much the opposite, being the treacherous rattlesnake we all know and love. He, however, is a cultured Doctor Doom style villain and is also a sincere worshipper of the goddess Mystra (which puts him at odds with Fzoul for other reasons). He's 19th level and one of the most powerful magicians in the world that could take Elminster in a fight on the right day. He's smart enough to never try something so stupid.

Kelemvor: Kelemvor's origins are far different in our game with him being chosen as the God of Death by Ao immediately afterwards (and he's a different person as well but that's immaterial). Kelemvor is True Neutral and the God of Balance in addition to his other crafts. He attempts to keep all races of Faerun from exterminating one another which results in the more powerful members of his church brokering odd peaces.

Cyric: Cyric is, simply put, a genius. He's eight steps ahead of every other God except Savras and Shar and he's even able to put a few over them on occasion. Cyric's Church is one of the most widely accepted and respected in the Realms, up there with Lathander and Chaunteau. This is because the Dark Sun's priests have free license to make up whatever dogma they want so long as they pilfer the locals of coin, sacrifice, and fearful veneration. He's the god of Politics and Betrayal while also being perfectly sane. The Knights of the Shield serve him rather than Gargauth (whose just an archfiend).

Selune: Selune is the Greater Goddess of Ascension, Healing, and Enlightenment in the Realms. She's also the Goddess of Primordial Good.

Shar: Is the Goddess of Primordial Evil.

My Blog: http://unitedfederationofcharles.blogspot.com/

Edited by - Charles Phipps on 08 Oct 2007 13:09:17

Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15724 Posts

Posted - 08 Oct 2007 :  18:14:11  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I made way too many changes (additions, mostly) to list here, but the most major thing I did was move Thay into the NW corner of the Shaar.

And I did it and still stayed true to canon lore up until the GHotR came out.

I had an RSE around 1380 DR that pretty much erased much of the outcome of the ToT, and something bizarre occurred in the region of Thay at that time - the land was slowing transforming into what it was back in the days of the Centaur tribes, and vast forests were appearing out of nowhere, erasing the newer stuff.

Bane, Kossuth, ans Set all made plays to help the Red Wizards evacuate, but Bane got the majority to follow him when he re-created the Thayan Plateau in the Shaar (as part of the Landrise). Large groups also followed Set and Kosuth, effectively breaking the Red Wizards into three factions. The ones that followed Set became the Black Wizards (yes, and named their own region Stygia), and the third group set-up in Chult following Kossuth (mostly priests of Kossuth). A small fourth group set-up in some newly-formed swamps, so there is also a Yuan-ti controlled group as well (ala the kingdom of Nyissa from the Belgariad). This places Thay in a better dynamic, IMHO, because it is just north of Halrua, and has to tend with Calimshan somewhat. I figure something like Thay really needed stronger magical nations around it to keep it in check. I prefer Aglarond to be more rural and Rashemen to be more 'primitive' (for lack of a better word). It creates all sorts of interesting possibilities with Red Wizards seeking to control the Border Kingdoms, and dealings with the Dambrathi Drow and priestesses of Loviatar.

So you see, I already did MY 'points of light' thing way before it became popular.

And, of course, I wound up with the Centaurian Kingdom I always wanted.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 10 Oct 2007 05:14:09
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Snotlord
Senior Scribe

Norway
476 Posts

Posted - 08 Oct 2007 :  18:55:27  Show Profile  Visit Snotlord's Homepage Send Snotlord a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I don't recall doing any changes at all, but there is a number of things I never mention. Ao, Spelljammers and the Mansoon clones comes to mind.

My own additions includes a number of dungeons, a host of mid-level npcs and Dawngleam in Cormyr may increase in importance very soon.

The Seven Sisters show up now and again, but Elminster or Drizzt has yet to make an appearance. I did introduce a new scribe for Elminster.
If I were to bother with iconic stats, I would have changed the Simbul to a single-class sorcerer.

Edited by - Snotlord on 08 Oct 2007 18:59:03
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Darkmeer
Senior Scribe

USA
505 Posts

Posted - 09 Oct 2007 :  00:39:23  Show Profile  Visit Darkmeer's Homepage Send Darkmeer a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I usually choose regions that don't have a lot of built up lore. If I run something where there is a lot of lore, I ask. If there's something that I feel won't fit the story, I try to curb around it (without saying it's not there).

Outside of that, the only thing I directly have in my realms that isn't canon is something that KnightErrantJR wrote here at the 'keep. Bane is still dead, and Xvim is still alive (And Xvim is playing everyone as a fool for a little while longer).

There are also some "orders" that know this, and they are trying desperately to revive Bane, Bhaal, and Myrkul (even though they don't know Myrkul's alive) into one much more powerful deity.

The other part of my realms is that not all the Bhaalspawn are dead (thank you Dragon Magazine), and those that are left are angry and work together, but I won't say where yet.

And, the last thing that I change in the 3.x and Beyond Realms is the inclusion of the ENTIRE Great Wheel by utilizing Yggdrasil as the "World Tree" cosmology that they came up with.

Hmm, I'm sure there's more, but I can't think of it right at this moment.

/d

"These people are my family, not just friends, and if you want to get to them you gotta go through ME."
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader

USA
7106 Posts

Posted - 09 Oct 2007 :  02:02:06  Show Profile  Visit Rinonalyrna Fathomlin's Homepage Send Rinonalyrna Fathomlin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Reposted from the WotC boards:

I'll make this quick and simply state which novels and adventures I'm ignoring in my Realms. That means I don't consider the events therein to have taken place. Novels denoted with "(undecided)" means it's up in the air if I'll ignore them in part or entirely:

--The Last Mythal series
--The Lady Penitent series
--The Haunted Land series
--The Watercourse series
--The Baldur's Gate series (novels, not the games)
--The Empryan Odysee (sp?) series
--War of the Spider Queen series (undecided)
--The Hunter's Blades series (undecided)
--Transitions series (most likely)
--The Twilight War (undecided)
--recent Undermountain adventure (because of the infamous prelude)
--recent super-adventure series: Cormyr, Shadowdale, Anauroch
--pretty much everything after the beginning of the year 1375 DR in the GHotR...and some stuff before it, too.

Just because I'm ignoring a novel or adventure doesn't mean it's not a good novel to read or has no merit as a playable adventure, it just means it doesn't fit it well (if at all) with my personal version of the Realms. This list may be incomplete and is also subject to change, although I can say without doubt that there are things I will never accept in my Realms, period (such as the events in the Last Mythal series--which, by the way, I disliked as novels as well as dispensers of Realmslore). As you can see, I have a history of renouncing certain FR products--this is nothing new for me, and it did not start only recently.


"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time)
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scererar
Master of Realmslore

USA
1618 Posts

Posted - 10 Oct 2007 :  03:46:30  Show Profile Send scererar a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I don't make many changes, but I do make the realms around my characters and leave the powers of Faerun in the background of my campaigns
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MerrikCale
Senior Scribe

USA
947 Posts

Posted - 10 Oct 2007 :  04:04:09  Show Profile  Visit MerrikCale's Homepage Send MerrikCale a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Usually its little things like so

1. Neverwinter has grown 25-30% from trade with the Silver Marches and opened a caravan road through Neverwinter Wood.

2. With the growth, additional temples like a large lighthouse-like temple to Selune as well as small temples to Shandakaul and Azuth.

3. The Dhorgal Nath, a order of knights who are all vampires (and a previous thorn in the PCs sides) have taken control of Nesme where they are seen as saviors from the giants and trolls that ravages the city. The townsfolk have chalked up their odd habit of holding court at night to their supposed dedication to the Moonmaiden and the occassional missing person to the trolls.

4. Another behind the scenes set of baddies is the Brethren, a small cabal of warlocks. They currently control Rauthyn and have a high ranking member of the Arcane Brotherhood. Plus, they control a Pirate captain who runs rampant on the sword coast and is moving in on underworld of Neverwinter. Their leader is slowly trying to become a Lord of Waterdeep and is getting close.




When hinges creak in doorless chambers and strange and frightening sounds echo through the halls, whenever candlelights flicker where the air is deathly still, that is the time when ghosts are present, practicing their terror with ghoulish delight.
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader

USA
4213 Posts

Posted - 10 Oct 2007 :  05:48:56  Show Profile Send Dalor Darden a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The changes to "My Realms" would freak out most "Canon" loyalists; but it is my campaign; so...

The primary things I allowed to change were in the Moonsea area. I've allowed a dwarven character of my group to re-found Tethyamar, which has actually expanded to include Daggerdale now too. Tethyamar is a very stout ally of Cormyr and the other Dales. Daggerdale was annexed after the death of Randal Morn by Zhent agents left the land leaderless, and the Kingdom has also expanded down the Desertsmouth Mountains (loose control really) to the Spiderhaunt Woods (VERY loosely claimed). Phlan has actually become a more powerful City-State since the half-elven wizard of the party claimed the Silver Pyramid as his own and spent vast sums on securing Phlan's military. He also invited Red Wizards into Phlan to set up shop and uses them secretly in a loose agreement against the Zhentarim. The wizard has went on to actually try and obtain godhood by way of Azuth's patronage: he wants to be the Demi-God of War Wizards.

An Elven ranger has set up a strong holding in the Border Forest, and through agreement with the Fey has made that wood very dangerous indeed. His wild and wood elf followers essentially assassinate anyone that doesn't have the permission of the Fey to be in the wilderness.

Something else that has come to pass is an Orcish Kingdom of Thar, ruled by a Grey Orc Werewolf and his elite Dire Wolf riding orcish werewolf thanes. These guys are really nasty and have repeatedly attacked the cities of Phlan, Melvaunt and Thentia (the three are now allied against the orcs; an unsteady peace has resulted but skirmishes on caravans happen too often).

The Drow thief/wizard of the party squirmed her way into the Zhentarim as a double-agent. Using her own forces she actually managed to replace ol' Sem. on the Inner Circle. Speaking of the Zhents: Manshoon is still in charge (no Manshoon "Wars") and has been the new nemesis of the party (he knows what the Drow is up to...but she is an asset to him for now). Fzoul IS the chosen of Bane, but he has not been able to exert his power over the Zhents. He has managed to secure Darkhold as his own though...and is waging a Holy War against the "usurper" Cyricists (there are none in the Zhentarim). Hillsfar is already ruled by the Zhents, the Red Plumes long ago being bought out by Zhent gold. Mulmaster is also part of the Zhentarim's holdings, the Highblade also sits on the Inner Circle of: Manshoon, Selfaril, Fzoul and the Drow Myste.

All of this came after a wanna-be Demi-God named Barak conquered Glister and used it as his capital. He once held Phlan as well and the other north-coast cities were vassals to his dragon-riding (from Vaasa which he also held loosely) Knights. The Orcish Werewolf King of Thar was one of his generals the party narrowly escaped encountering in their war against Barak; but now they wish they had. The party initially crushed this fella and his "Empire" before fracturing into individual interests.

The other addition to my campaign is that I have another Chosen (of Shar) named Darkflame (yeah, my old character that I turned into a villain) that still works at odds and sometimes with the party for unknown goals.

The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me!
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BlackAce
Senior Scribe

United Kingdom
358 Posts

Posted - 10 Oct 2007 :  14:22:32  Show Profile Send BlackAce a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I've stayed pretty canon in my version though like Rinona, I've Been ignoring the Pantheon slaying that's currently going on. The main pre-1372 changes being:

* Bane didn't die in the ToT. Though Fzoul still went on to topple Manshoon and oust Semmenon.

* No Shadow Weave. But Shade still came back from the Plane of Shadow and Tilverton was just burned to the ground in the fighting between Cormyr and Shade.

* Iakhovas didn't attack Waterdeep, just Baldur's Gate and Murann.

* I fully canonised both BG games. But moved Suldanessellar to Shilmista cause the Moon elf style settlement didn't fit the Wood/Wild Elf vibe of Tethyr too well.

Apart from that it's pretty much as is.

Though I have two big non canon events that could fit in here....

* An Orc hoard streamed out of South Kyrpt and attacked Waterdeep in 1367. Waterdeep beat the attack off comfortably but trade was disrupted most of the year, Amphail was sacked ("Mmm, horsemeat,") and the guilds demanded that Piergieron build a strong series of towers in outlying areas. These have come to be called the Guildsman's Folleys and are dotted about the foothills of the Sword Mountains.

* In 1370, Elturel, Berdusk and Iriaebor formed the small realm of 'Elthar'. The Zhents, Shadow Thieves, Harpers and Yuan- ti are all busily machinating behind the scenes.

Edited by - BlackAce on 10 Oct 2007 14:25:11
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader

USA
4213 Posts

Posted - 10 Oct 2007 :  14:39:48  Show Profile Send Dalor Darden a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Out of curiosity, exactly how to people maintain a "Canon" realms? I mean, how do you allow your parties to be the heroes WHEREVER they go if they simply can't conflict with what "must be" in the Realms?

I mean, what if you have a wizard that wants to take over a prominent city...or a Paladin/Fighter that raises a large army and takes many colonists to Phlan and turns the place into a fortified stronghold? What if, instead, the wizard wants to live in Shadowdale and work with the Lord of that Dale as his court wizard...making himself available any time?

Is there really any such thing as a Canon Realms in truth?

The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me!
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Sian
Senior Scribe

Denmark
596 Posts

Posted - 10 Oct 2007 :  14:46:27  Show Profile  Visit Sian's Homepage Send Sian a Private Message  Reply with Quote
well ... in the game i'm DM'ing is the only diffence that i don't use the great wheel but rather the great tree in terms of planes :P

what happened to the queen? she's much more hysterical than usual
She's a women, it happens once a month
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Aravine
Senior Scribe

USA
608 Posts

Posted - 10 Oct 2007 :  14:50:04  Show Profile  Visit Aravine's Homepage Send Aravine a Private Message  Reply with Quote
klauth was killed. thats about it

The brave don't live forever,the cautious don't live at all
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
36906 Posts

Posted - 10 Oct 2007 :  16:34:51  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by dalor_darden

Out of curiosity, exactly how to people maintain a "Canon" realms?


By not changing anything from the published setting, save for things the PCs do.

quote:
Originally posted by dalor_darden

I mean, how do you allow your parties to be the heroes WHEREVER they go if they simply can't conflict with what "must be" in the Realms?


Just because there is a considerable amount written about the Realms, it doesn't mean that anything a PC does will violate canon. There are endless possibilities that don't change what is published... Having the PCs talk to an important, published NPC doesn't mean canon just flew out the window. Ditto, the cleansing of a particular dungeon.

Depending on your players, I don't see any reason why you can't be the most dedicated "canon nazi" and still have the PCs doing as they wish.

quote:
Originally posted by dalor_darden

Is there really any such thing as a Canon Realms in truth?



Yeah, what WotC publishes.

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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
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Jorkens
Great Reader

Norway
2950 Posts

Posted - 10 Oct 2007 :  19:42:32  Show Profile Send Jorkens a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Well, the list is long.

Mostly the Realms as presented in the 1ed. campaign setting, with later additions.
-No Time of Troubles, the same goes for most of the later realms shaking events.
-Slightly more primitive Realms, think late Dark Ages.
-Human cultures more diverse and prominent. Less earth influences.
-Slightly less magic heavy.
-No Lords Alliance.
-Evermeet is a pocket dimension tied to faerie, the Realm to the west is a myth. This makes the elves into more of a mysterious "underground" people in the manner of the Irish sidhe.
-The planes are not as defined and the demons/devils more of a mystery.
-The ancient history is changed as I need it. Netherill and the ancient elves are mysteries to be used as needed.
-Drow more evil.
-The Uthgar are gone. mysterious barbarians living far from the lands of civilization are still in use.

There's much more, but that will give you an impression.
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Zorro
Seeker

Germany
82 Posts

Posted - 11 Oct 2007 :  20:15:46  Show Profile  Visit Zorro's Homepage Send Zorro a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Sounds like we're playing in adjacent Realms, Jorkens

Zorro

I think that God in creating Man somewhat overestimated his ability. - Oscar Wilde
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Halidan
Senior Scribe

USA
470 Posts

Posted - 13 Oct 2007 :  23:45:37  Show Profile  Visit Halidan's Homepage Send Halidan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Probably the biggest change I've made is the destruction of Turmish by a coalition of humanoid tribes lead by the son of a blue dragon who once ruled the area. This gave me a Greyhawk-style Wild Coast area on the Sea of Fallen Stars that I set a Realms version of the Slavelords campaign in.

Other changes are mostly local. I've added a lot of custom villages and towns to the map, added the presence of different humanoid races to different locations, put in gates and portals where I needed them, etc.

The other change I make is that all of the SSI Gold Box computer games are canon in my Realms. So I have added New Verdigris to the Dragonspine Mountains and other such details from those games.

"Over the Mountains
Of the Moon
Down the Valley of the Shadow,
Ride, boldly ride,"
The shade replied,
"If you seek for Eldorado!"

Edgar Allen Poe - 1849
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Jamallo Kreen
Master of Realmslore

USA
1537 Posts

Posted - 20 Oct 2007 :  19:31:03  Show Profile  Visit Jamallo Kreen's Homepage Send Jamallo Kreen a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Isn't there another scroll on this topic? I remember having posted recently that the biggest change I made was having Azoun IV die the night of the First Battle of the Golden Way and the Alliance Army defeated in the Second Battle, from whence they were forced to make a fighting retreat to Telflamm, where Yamun Khahan, Illustrious Emperor of All Peoples was blown to smithereens by a Lantanese canonball.

It seemed like a good idea at the time, but ...

I have been intending to steer the PCs to Solon (it's still 1360 in my campaign), while I was slowly acquiring the Troy Denning adventure modules, Storm Riders, Black Courser, and Blood Charge from eBay. I have them all now, and ... DOH! ... part of the logic of the adventure path is that Yamun Khahan is still in the process of invading Shou Lung. It's 1358 or 1359 in those adventures, not 1360! Oy!

Having deviated from the canon (with cannon, I pun), I must now explain Hubadai's presence in the Unapproachable East and work around Kojah, the Grand Historian, whom the PCs have already seen, and who will have no reason to help them after Yamun's death.

Sometimes following canon is the safest way to go. *sigh*




I have a mouth, but I am in a library and must not scream.


Feed the poor and stroke your ego, too: http://www.freerice.com/index.php.

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Charles Phipps
Master of Realmslore

1425 Posts

Posted - 20 Oct 2007 :  19:35:34  Show Profile  Visit Charles Phipps's Homepage Send Charles Phipps a Private Message  Reply with Quote
1) The Black Network replaces the Thayan Enclaves

The Black Network has diplomatic immunity just like the Thayans had in the Lord of Darkness. They wield just too much authority as a merchantale Empire to actively prosecute them. Manshoon is the guy who started mass manufacturing magical items and you go to the Zhents and their wizards if you want something created. I had a very fun situation where the party actually bought some healing potions and other materials from the very people whom had been shooting at them the night before. They also KNEW that they were guilty but the prices were too good.

The Zhents sell everything from exotic spices to poisons to magical items to bulk goods. Their knowledge of portals is only matched by the Elves and they control a lot of private ones that they use to force other merchants to pay homage. Manshoon may only control much of the Moonsea area but he's one of the most powerful monarchs in all of Faerun.

2) The Black Network makes an effort to appear legitimate

Yes, the Zhents are trying to steal every magical item in the kingdom and overthrow your land. They're like SPECTRE in my games with all the various threats and terrorist activities, however, it's always activities that are removed from 90% of their dealings that are entirely legitimate and vital to a nation's success. So while they have ties with The Night Masks, Cult of Dragon, and even Elaith Craulnobler's gangs.....they prefer to mostly let THEM provide the canon fodder while the genuine agents keep a short distance.

Any agent found out by the Zhents usually is dead before anything can be gleened from him or easily discarded.

3) Helm is Heimdale

Just a little nod, Helm is the Guardian of the Rainbow bridge and the last of Tyr's Pantheon that survived the journey into Faerun. Thus, the 4E stuff in my games is even more ironic.

He still guards the Rainbow Bridge into Mount Celesti....err the House of the Triad.

4) Helm is the Bank God

I rule that Helm's Paladins are sort of like the Knights Templars in that you store your credit with them and you can damn well expect that they will back you up with rigid honesty.

5) Mask and Vhaerun are the same

The similiarities were just too much for me too ignore. Vhaerun started out his career as Mask when he recognized that Lolth was too powerful to challenge directly. Thus, he is a much more powerful God than he lets on.

6) Eilistraee is a Demigoddess

The number of Good Drow on the surface is absolutely ridiculous and low in my campaigns. Eilistraee lives only because she's a member of the Seldarine in my games, rather than because of her worshippers ability to stay alive. She's also a far less reactionary goddess in gender relationships with male and female equality being another of her teachings. Her priests are known as her consorts while her priestesses are her sisters.

She's actually worshipped by a substantial number of Half-Elves and Seldarine loving humans who are at odds with their own culture.

7) Evermeet is still the psychotically hostile place from the Complete Book of Elves

You might be Christ amongst Half-Elves but you can't visit the Elven Homeworld. It's a place for elves and people just don't go there. They don't murder people out of hand but anyone trying to go there without permission is laid to waste before they can get within a league.

8) The Eldreth Veluuthra is also Kymil Nemsin's organization

While no one knows he's the founder of it, after the attack on Evermeet, he realized that his credibility was eternally screwed. In our game, he used a Magic Jar spell (with a wizard's help) to move his soul into an unsuspecting Gold Elf before murdering his old body in cold blood.

Kymil still wants a Gold Elf monarchy but he figured out that he's only made the Moonflowers more popular than ever. His new goal is to undermine them and her initiatives of peace by playing on elven hatred for humans.

My Blog: http://unitedfederationofcharles.blogspot.com/

Edited by - Charles Phipps on 20 Oct 2007 19:37:10
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Charles Phipps
Master of Realmslore

1425 Posts

Posted - 20 Oct 2007 :  19:48:51  Show Profile  Visit Charles Phipps's Homepage Send Charles Phipps a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Kelemvor Facts

1. Kelemvor offers a Final Appeal

The Final Appeal is where a judged soul is allowed to change his god worship before his soul is sentenced to be treated faithless or false. Then that god has the option of allowing him into his world or not. Kelemvor provides a lawyer, a Arcanoloth usually, to provide recommendations for the condemned.

2. Kelemvor claims the souls of all Faithless and False for himself

They are judged according to Kelemvor's criteria, which generally punishes individuals whom caused death as part of their activities in life and rewards those whom defended life as long as they existed. The exception being if those souls that were slain were killers themselves.

Kelemvor is known to pardon the souls of certain murderers seemingly indiscriminately as well. These are transformed into his demons.

3. Kelemvor offers a Challenge to Killers

Warriors whom have caused a great number of deaths in life, whether for good or evil, can wager their eternal soul against Kelemvor's skill to get a second chance at life. Kelemvor names the contest depending on whether it suits him or not.

A subject is Raised to 1 HP if they win, moments after their death. This can be invoked only once.

4. Kelemvor heads a Small Pantheon

Hoar, Jergal, Talona, and Anubis are all gods underneath Kelemvor. Also, I state that Kelemvor is a god of Medicine as well. After Velsharoon was destroyed, Kelemvor ascended his mortal daughter Wee Jas as goddess of Necromancy.

5. Some sentences are not eternal

Kelemvor sentences many to punishments that are finite in nature, often befitting their crimes in life and ironic. The unrepentent are known to have their sentences reknewed but they may chose to be reborn with no memories of their life or serve Kelemvor.

6. There is no Wall of the Faithless

Instead, the Faithless are forced to live in the city of Eternal Twilight as shadows of their former selves because they never took a stand for anything. The False are sent to various Hell like torments.

My Blog: http://unitedfederationofcharles.blogspot.com/
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IronHammer
Acolyte

USA
28 Posts

Posted - 20 Oct 2007 :  21:23:21  Show Profile  Visit IronHammer's Homepage Send IronHammer a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I change whateve suits me for the most part. We "usally" allow pretty much anything from a core rule book as far as prestige classes and spells.We use templates for monsters from other realms such as the "Van Richtans guides".We use much of the "Norse" pantheon in northern Toril. Many of the Norse gods have gained influence right along with Tyr. The Viking "Beserk" is fun to play by the way,LOL..I am actually fairly liberal as a DM because the name of the game is still fun. I never used a level cap for demi humans in the basic,1E and 2E games either. I could never swallow that. We dont run power games but we allow for a lot of diversity. The realms are perfect for that..

I remember playing Dwarves and Elves as a character class...

Edited by - IronHammer on 20 Oct 2007 21:26:29
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Skeptic
Master of Realmslore

Canada
1273 Posts

Posted - 20 Oct 2007 :  21:36:16  Show Profile Send Skeptic a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The main purpose of a campaign setting is to have an detailled shared imagined universe before the actual play begins.

If you change it much, you ruin that main purpose (of course, you keep some building blocks like cities, gods, etc.)

However, if the players don't know the campaign setting, the main thing is already not there, so you don't loose anything.

What I have learn with my DM experience in FR is to avoid asking to the players to fake ignoring FR lore. eg. If I plan to have the PCs going to Westgate, I won't ask the players to forgot the secret nature of the Night masks. (The PCs will also know/learn it)

Why? Because that's the basic fun of an established setting, players excited to meet something they have read about.

That's why I would not customize FR with players who read FR novels / game products.

Edited by - Skeptic on 20 Oct 2007 21:40:04
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader

USA
7106 Posts

Posted - 21 Oct 2007 :  02:41:16  Show Profile  Visit Rinonalyrna Fathomlin's Homepage Send Rinonalyrna Fathomlin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Charles Phipps


6. There is no Wall of the Faithless

Instead, the Faithless are forced to live in the city of Eternal Twilight as shadows of their former selves because they never took a stand for anything. The False are sent to various Hell like torments.



Not saying you can't do things your way in your own game, but I will point out that not being a god-worshiper doesn't mean you don't stand for anything.

"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time)
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Charles Phipps
Master of Realmslore

1425 Posts

Posted - 21 Oct 2007 :  04:06:45  Show Profile  Visit Charles Phipps's Homepage Send Charles Phipps a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:


Not saying you can't do things your way in your own game, but I will point out that not being a god-worshiper doesn't mean you don't stand for anything.



My definition of worship is one distinct from religious practices. Quite bluntly, if in the Faerun pantheon you can't find one thing worth revering then you're a waste of existence.

My Blog: http://unitedfederationofcharles.blogspot.com/
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader

USA
7106 Posts

Posted - 21 Oct 2007 :  04:43:29  Show Profile  Visit Rinonalyrna Fathomlin's Homepage Send Rinonalyrna Fathomlin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Charles Phipps

quote:


Not saying you can't do things your way in your own game, but I will point out that not being a god-worshiper doesn't mean you don't stand for anything.



My definition of worship is one distinct from religious practices. Quite bluntly, if in the Faerun pantheon you can't find one thing worth revering then you're a waste of existence.




Talked about this on the WotC thread. I tend to think that the person who doesn't revere anything at all is rare to nonexistant.

"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time)
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
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Posted - 21 Oct 2007 :  04:50:10  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
And let's bring this back to the topic, before we go too far afield, shall we?

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Charles Phipps
Master of Realmslore

1425 Posts

Posted - 21 Oct 2007 :  04:53:08  Show Profile  Visit Charles Phipps's Homepage Send Charles Phipps a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Well it's discussing the customization I made to my Realms, Wooly. But yeah, I talked about it on the FR boards.

My Blog: http://unitedfederationofcharles.blogspot.com/
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Jorkens
Great Reader

Norway
2950 Posts

Posted - 21 Oct 2007 :  07:34:31  Show Profile Send Jorkens a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Skeptic

The main purpose of a campaign setting is to have an detailled shared imagined universe before the actual play begins.

If you change it much, you ruin that main purpose (of course, you keep some building blocks like cities, gods, etc.)

However, if the players don't know the campaign setting, the main thing is already not there, so you don't loose anything.

What I have learn with my DM experience in FR is to avoid asking to the players to fake ignoring FR lore. eg. If I plan to have the PCs going to Westgate, I won't ask the players to forgot the secret nature of the Night masks. (The PCs will also know/learn it)

Why? Because that's the basic fun of an established setting, players excited to meet something they have read about.

That's why I would not customize FR with players who read FR novels / game products.



I agree to a point, but as I have players that don't read novels I am generally OK. As for changes, it is more a case of me not changing than the opposite. And the fun of a published setting is also to let things inspire you and give you new ideas. To me a published setting is a background you make your own, but that is a matter of taste and judgement.
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader

USA
7106 Posts

Posted - 22 Oct 2007 :  00:35:53  Show Profile  Visit Rinonalyrna Fathomlin's Homepage Send Rinonalyrna Fathomlin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Besides, the sourcebooks themselves tell people to make the setting their own.

"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time)
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Charles Phipps
Master of Realmslore

1425 Posts

Posted - 22 Oct 2007 :  04:06:32  Show Profile  Visit Charles Phipps's Homepage Send Charles Phipps a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I stick by the Knights of the Dinner Table definition.

There's an infinite number of Forgotten Realms with FR-Prime being the official one. FR-2 is Ed Greenwood's Campaign setting.

Mine is FR-616.

Baldur's Gate games is FR-111.

Reserve your number today!

My Blog: http://unitedfederationofcharles.blogspot.com/
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Hawkins
Great Reader

USA
2131 Posts

Posted - 22 Oct 2007 :  19:02:59  Show Profile  Visit Hawkins's Homepage Send Hawkins a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Charles Phipps

I stick by the Knights of the Dinner Table definition.

There's an infinite number of Forgotten Realms with FR-Prime being the official one. FR-2 is Ed Greenwood's Campaign setting.

Mine is FR-616.

Baldur's Gate games is FR-111.

Reserve your number today!




That sounds very Marvel Mulitverse to me. Earth-616 is the main setting for the Marvel comics, then you have Earth-1610 for the setting for the Ultimate series of comics...

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Charles Phipps
Master of Realmslore

1425 Posts

Posted - 22 Oct 2007 :  19:58:12  Show Profile  Visit Charles Phipps's Homepage Send Charles Phipps a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Yes, I was making a joke by reserving the MU's number for me.

;-)

My Blog: http://unitedfederationofcharles.blogspot.com/
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