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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1632 Posts |
 Posted - 27 Sep 2025 : 03:01:10
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News from Magic Con Atlanta, the 3rd DLC for the Forgotten Realms Ultimate Bundle is that beloved part of the Forgotten Realms...Lorwyn-Shadowmoore?
It's called Lorwyn: First Light, they literally took a plane of MtG, turned it into a Feywild Domain of Delight and plopped a portal to it in the Moonshae Isles. To be far they share a Celtic Theme and fey theme.
All the DLCs are 32 pages. This one has 2 new species, advise for 8 more for the setting, a Gazeteer for Lorwyn-Shadowmoore, 2 feats, 2 backgrounds, 2 magic items, 2 example adventures which share 1 map, and 8 monsters (such as giants, fey tricksters, and Nature Incarnations).
Wtf they put this in the Forgotten Realms Ultimate Bundle eludes me honestly. They found a way to create a connection to FR by create a different version of Lorwyn.
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1587 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2025 : 04:13:19
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| I eagerly anticipate the inevitable day when Nicol Bolas turns out to be a son of Tiamat and Asmodeus. |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3822 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2025 : 06:40:17
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"They found a way"
Nah, they probably just said "random BS, go!" and were done with it. Also, what the hell is this "DLC" thing. Guess Hasbro is still on their quest to monetize D&D like a videogame after all. |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
8030 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2025 : 17:30:44
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"They found a way" ... no.
"Let's repackage and rebrand something we already made and we fully own, let's get some products on store shelves which won't require more money and more staff to develop in depth, let's see if we can get some of our separated customers to start buying into the other product lines" ... yes.
Perhaps you are enthusiastic and optimistic because you want to buy what they want to sell. More power to you if these new products make you and your table happy.
But a little bit of cautious objectivity is always warranted when WotC is involved. Their intentions are always suspect because their past record is too dirty. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4487 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2025 : 17:53:56
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Considering that the Magic: the Gathering setting(s) have already been established as Realms-adjacent, meaning portals and Planeswalking have been used to access Abeir-Toril from places like Ravnica, then jumping to different planes/spheres of different universes really isn't that far fetched.
Take into account that even Earth, the D&D Realm (80s cartoon), and Oerth, can trace elements to Abeir-Toril/Faerūn then im not that shocked or even surprised honestly. Its not like the company pilfered from another IP as their all WotC owned. And it doesn't even begin to scratch the surface of things like Spelljamming and how easily that would've also tied in far-flung planes like what we see in M:tG. Hell, the Skyship Weatherlight is basically a Spelljammer ship. |
Diffan's NPG Generator: FR NPC Generator
E6 Options: Epic 6 Campaign |
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Zeromaru X
Great Reader
Colombia
2529 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2025 : 19:53:01
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quote:
Originally posted by Irennan
"They found a way"
Nah, they probably just said "random BS, go!" and were done with it. Also, what the hell is this "DLC" thing. Guess Hasbro is still on their quest to monetize D&D like a videogame after all.
The new Realms books have certain booklets that are digital only. They call them "DLC" because of that. Technically, it's true. They are "download content". |
Instead of seeking change, you prefer a void, merciless abyss of a world... |
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Azar
Master of Realmslore
1463 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2025 : 22:07:41
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| I envy the people who mindlessly accept (or even wholeheartedly embrace) every official decision by this corporation. |
Stand with anybody that stands right. Stand with him while he is right and part with him when he goes wrong.
Earth names in the Realms are more common than you may think. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36965 Posts |
Posted - 28 Sep 2025 : 03:43:39
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quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
Considering that the Magic: the Gathering setting(s) have already been established as Realms-adjacent, meaning portals and Planeswalking have been used to access Abeir-Toril from places like Ravnica, then jumping to different planes/spheres of different universes really isn't that far fetched.
Take into account that even Earth, the D&D Realm (80s cartoon), and Oerth, can trace elements to Abeir-Toril/Faerūn then im not that shocked or even surprised honestly. Its not like the company pilfered from another IP as their all WotC owned. And it doesn't even begin to scratch the surface of things like Spelljamming and how easily that would've also tied in far-flung planes like what we see in M:tG. Hell, the Skyship Weatherlight is basically a Spelljammer ship.
I don't think anyone's complaining about that. I think the complaint is that part of the Forgotten Realms Bundle is literally another setting, and that it's more of WotC simply repackaging some existing thing rather than creating something entirely new. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
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Azar
Master of Realmslore
1463 Posts |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6445 Posts |
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Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4487 Posts |
Posted - 28 Sep 2025 : 13:07:01
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
Considering that the Magic: the Gathering setting(s) have already been established as Realms-adjacent, meaning portals and Planeswalking have been used to access Abeir-Toril from places like Ravnica, then jumping to different planes/spheres of different universes really isn't that far fetched.
Take into account that even Earth, the D&D Realm (80s cartoon), and Oerth, can trace elements to Abeir-Toril/Faerūn then im not that shocked or even surprised honestly. Its not like the company pilfered from another IP as their all WotC owned. And it doesn't even begin to scratch the surface of things like Spelljamming and how easily that would've also tied in far-flung planes like what we see in M:tG. Hell, the Skyship Weatherlight is basically a Spelljammer ship.
I don't think anyone's complaining about that. I think the complaint is that part of the Forgotten Realms Bundle is literally another setting, and that it's more of WotC simply repackaging some existing thing rather than creating something entirely new.
I do understand the ire of saying this is a specifically Forgotten Realms tie-in, because it really isn 't and just another portal to another world instead of using that opportunity to flesh out a different, less often visited area of the established setting. I don't know what we're going to get with the setting book or the other two DLCs for the Realms (I'm really hoping for anything outside the Sword Coast and Western continent) but I can only assume that'll be Realms-specific like Cormyr, the Dalelands, the Far East, the Shining South, Moonsea, something with Thay/Rasheman/Nar? But we've been disappointed before, so who knows?
As for the re-packaging, if their intent was to fill out the Moonshae Isles with similar themes and concepts and they already have a distinct - even well known - IP for that concept just in another medium, then I think it makes sense to use what's already there. No need to reinvent the wheel when the wheel can be fixed to a different wagon so to speak. I don't remember too much about Lorwyn and Shadowmore, it was a M:tG set that I didn't put much effort into but I do know it's very fey, faerie, bogkins, pixie, halfling/kithkin themed with a lot of that whimsy stuff. So it definitely fits a theme that seems well tailored to the Moonshae Isles.
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
I envy the people who mindlessly accept (or even wholeheartedly embrace) every official decision by this corporation.
Oof, as one of the only persons that haven't poo-pooed the news of this on this thread, I can only ascertain that this is directed towards me? While I'm not vexed by the decision to use Lorwyn/Shadowmoore in this context, I certainly don't embrace or accept every one of their [WotC/Hasbro] decisions. I tend to really like Magic: the Gathering as both a game and as story elements, so I guess I'm more inclined to enjoy the crossovers of two games that I love than someone who doesn't have attachments to the M:tG side.
Still, I'm not a fan of 5.5 and I'll probably never get the update. I don't like some of the directions of their other works - they're not bad, just not my cup of tea. I certainly don't like how Hasbro, and by extension WotC, treats people. And I found the whole 'micro-transactions' of D&D Beyond utterly stupid. Honestly, I can't remember the last official WotC thing I actually purchased? The last two Forgotten Realms supplements I got were Third Party (Ed's update to Rasheman and his update for the Border Kingdoms).
So me not being frustrated by a DLC with tie-ins to Lorwyn shouldn't be an indication that I'm happy-go-lucky with WotC in their entirety. |
Diffan's NPG Generator: FR NPC Generator
E6 Options: Epic 6 Campaign |
Edited by - Diffan on 28 Sep 2025 13:08:29 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36965 Posts |
Posted - 28 Sep 2025 : 19:57:15
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| I'm disappointed by the announcement, but since I wasn't going to buy it, anyway, it's not as big of a deal to me. I think it follows the trend I've pointed out, but that's not specific to the Realms. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Azar
Master of Realmslore
1463 Posts |
Posted - 28 Sep 2025 : 20:59:01
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| No, I was broadly speaking. There are people who hang onto WotC's every word; after realizing that little things such as "fidelity", "consistency" and "integrity" are the exceptions and not the norm, I cannot comprehend that level of loyalty/interest. |
Stand with anybody that stands right. Stand with him while he is right and part with him when he goes wrong.
Earth names in the Realms are more common than you may think. |
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paintphob
Acolyte
USA
17 Posts |
Posted - 29 Sep 2025 : 22:41:00
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quote:
I don't think anyone's complaining about that. I think the complaint is that part of the Forgotten Realms Bundle is literally another setting, and that it's more of WotC simply repackaging some existing thing rather than creating something entirely new.
Considering the part of the Realms that the DLC will connect to, I find that statement humorous. Let your mind wander back almost 40 years ago, and you can almost hear -
"I think the complaint is that part of the Forgotten Realms Bundle Campaign Box Set and FR2 are literally another setting, and that it's more of WotC TSR simply repackaging some existing thing rather than creating something entirely new using what was already there."
The more things change...
That said, I have no horse in this race. I have enough content to last me another 40 years, so I will not be buying it. Also, the Moonshae were never really a part of the Realms that I liked. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36965 Posts |
Posted - 29 Sep 2025 : 23:43:42
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quote:
Originally posted by paintphob
quote:
I don't think anyone's complaining about that. I think the complaint is that part of the Forgotten Realms Bundle is literally another setting, and that it's more of WotC simply repackaging some existing thing rather than creating something entirely new.
Considering the part of the Realms that the DLC will connect to, I find that statement humorous. Let your mind wander back almost 40 years ago, and you can almost hear -
"I think the complaint is that part of the Forgotten Realms Bundle Campaign Box Set and FR2 are literally another setting, and that it's more of WotC TSR simply repackaging some existing thing rather than creating something entirely new using what was already there."
The more things change...
That said, I have no horse in this race. I have enough content to last me another 40 years, so I will not be buying it. Also, the Moonshae were never really a part of the Realms that I liked.
FR2 wasn't sold as a part of the OGB, and when it was, it had been made a part of the Realms. That's not at all the same thing as "hey, this third part of a Forgotten Realms package isn't part of the Realms at all and we're not pretending that it is!" |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Azar
Master of Realmslore
1463 Posts |
Posted - 30 Sep 2025 : 01:37:54
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quote:
Originally posted by paintphob
quote:
I don't think anyone's complaining about that. I think the complaint is that part of the Forgotten Realms Bundle is literally another setting, and that it's more of WotC simply repackaging some existing thing rather than creating something entirely new.
Considering the part of the Realms that the DLC will connect to, I find that statement humorous. Let your mind wander back almost 40 years ago, and you can almost hear -
"I think the complaint is that part of the Forgotten Realms Bundle Campaign Box Set and FR2 are literally another setting, and that it's more of WotC TSR simply repackaging some existing thing rather than creating something entirely new using what was already there."
The more things change...
That said, I have no horse in this race. I have enough content to last me another 40 years, so I will not be buying it. Also, the Moonshae were never really a part of the Realms that I liked.
A poor comparison: that material was built/intended for a tabletop gaming setting from the very beginning. What Wizards of the Coast is doing is bolting on other products to D&D, in the manner of Victor Frankenstein. |
Stand with anybody that stands right. Stand with him while he is right and part with him when he goes wrong.
Earth names in the Realms are more common than you may think. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36965 Posts |
Posted - 30 Sep 2025 : 04:27:04
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| I don't mind them making Magic settings into D&D settings... What I have issue with, here, is a Magic setting being pushed as part of a Forgotten Realms bundle -- and especially them waiting to announce they were doing that. It seems like a deliberate bait and switch. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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paintphob
Acolyte
USA
17 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2025 : 17:42:27
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quote:
FR2 wasn't sold as a part of the OGB, and when it was, it had been made a part of the Realms.
I apologize, I may have been unclear. The Moonshae were wedged into the Realms, even thought they were not originally part of the Realms. They appears in the OGB large area map, and mentioned int the Cyclopedia.
quote:
That's not at all the same thing as "hey, this third part of a Forgotten Realms package isn't part of the Realms at all and we're not pretending that it is!"
I agree 100%. As you mentioned in a later post, it does feel like a bait and switch, as far as Realms content goes. |
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paintphob
Acolyte
USA
17 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2025 : 17:53:28
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quote:
A poor comparison: that material was built/intended for a tabletop gaming setting from the very beginning. What Wizards of the Coast is doing is bolting on other products to D&D, in the manner of Victor Frankenstein.
Would a better comparison have been the addition of the parody war game The Great Khan Game? |
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EltonRobb
Learned Scribe
USA
230 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2025 : 20:56:40
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| Another wasted opportunity for Wizards. They got a whole world they can fill out. |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
12189 Posts |
Posted - 03 Oct 2025 : 02:38:02
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| Well, let me first say "don't know jack about MTG Lorwyn" ..... but then let me add, "I don't much mind them creating a link between Lorwyn via some dimensional method to the Moonshaes". To that, I will add "as long as they don't make it that Lorwyn is the ONLY fey realm linked to the Moonshaes". I'm absolutely fine with the Moonshaes being some kind of Nexus to multiple fey realms.... or rather another way to say it might be "I'm fine with most fey realms having links to multiple OTHER fey realms". Tentatively, I'd even say I might not be upset if there's some link from Lorwyn to the Moonshaes at X point, there might also be a link from Lorwyn in another totally different area that might have a link to Rashemen, Nimbral, Selune, Anchorome, the Yuirwood, the High Forest, etc... or even other worlds in realmspace. By that I mean you might be able to cross to Lorwyn near some lake, travel some either short or long distance, and turn around and come out in some other area of the realms... and add to that that people on both sides may not realize that these entry/exit points lead to the same world. For instance, if some forest bound portal in Lorwyn exits into a giant forest in Anchorome and another portal at the bottom of a lake in Lorwyn comes out in a moonwell in the Moonshaes.... the people of Lorwyn may think that those are two different worlds with possibly only the moon in the night sky being a hint. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
Edited by - sleyvas on 03 Oct 2025 12:52:58 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36965 Posts |
Posted - 03 Oct 2025 : 03:59:26
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quote:
Originally posted by EltonRobb
Another wasted opportunity for Wizards. They got a whole world they can fill out.
THIS.
So very much THIS.
That's one of the things that's bugged for a while, and particularly since 5E has come out. Wizards has had so many opportunities to flex their creative muscles and show us what they're capable of... Instead we get adventures with barely enough lore to cover the adventure itself, reprinted settings with 5E rules slapped on top, and movie references that are so obvious they might as well put a sidebar in talking about the movie. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Azar
Master of Realmslore
1463 Posts |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
12189 Posts |
Posted - 03 Oct 2025 : 13:11:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by EltonRobb
Another wasted opportunity for Wizards. They got a whole world they can fill out.
THIS.
So very much THIS.
That's one of the things that's bugged for a while, and particularly since 5E has come out. Wizards has had so many opportunities to flex their creative muscles and show us what they're capable of... Instead we get adventures with barely enough lore to cover the adventure itself, reprinted settings with 5E rules slapped on top, and movie references that are so obvious they might as well put a sidebar in talking about the movie.
This I definitely agree with. That being said, I think partly they're just afraid to go into the rest of the world and revisit and fix things. The lashback on the changes over 4e were harsh (not undeserved mind you). I feel like it can be revisited with an eye towards incorporating a return of the old and keeping the new at the same time (i.e. PORTIONS of Abeir returning, but PORTIONS of Abeir remaining, while PORTIONS of the people and/or places of Toril returning). However, I may be one of the few who isn't polarized on this subject (i.e. go all one way or another). I even go so far as to say "let's make some changes to keep BOTH Maztica/Anchorome/Lopango AND Laerakond/Returned Abeir" by just making a simple assumption that people had it wrong and they weren't in exactly the same spot. I actually think putting Maztica/Lopango/"what we've been calling Katashaka" in between Faerun and Laerakond opens up a lot of opportunity for some development that people may find of interest. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Hermit
Acolyte
USA
2 Posts |
Posted - 27 Oct 2025 : 13:50:23
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quote:
Originally posted by Azar
I envy the people who mindlessly accept (or even wholeheartedly embrace) every official decision by this corporation.
You must...CONSUME |
So sayeth the Hermit
Castles & Crusades in the Forgotten Realms! |
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The Forgotten Realms ate another setting: Lorwyn
