| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
muir
Acolyte
Canada
41 Posts |
 Posted - 20 May 2019 : 15:34:50
|
From Mages and Sages Ep. 11 I think it was Eric Boyd speaking:
"The Ba'etith, they still exist. They don't really remember that they exist; they transformed into another, form, let me say, that has largely forgotten where it's come from but they are still existing and the greatest of the Ba'etith, there are 5 of them, they still have a hand in the Realms, including one of them may well have had a role (I'm going to be really obscure here) in the madness of a certain line of kings."
I am still working on assimilating the lore I have access to, and so while this intrigues me greatly, I cannot make any good guesses as to what it might refer to.
I take the "transformed into another form" as referring to the organization, rather than individuals, for they were not all the same species even by the end of the Days of Thunder. So, an organization that gathers lore of the Art, with members withdrawn from actively shaping the realms, except for the 5 'greatest.' Greatest by what measure? Political influence, magical might, depth of lore gathered?
Oh, so many mysteries...
I found myself thinking of both Iolaum and the Loretakers of Oryndoll, but the former is solitary, as far as I know. The latter, maybe, though I think they do not restrict themselves to lore of the Art, and are all one species.
Any suggestions, most worthy scribes?
|
|
|
The Arcanamach
Master of Realmslore
1879 Posts |
Posted - 20 May 2019 : 16:02:20
|
| Well I think the Terraseer is most certainly going to be one of them and I think he is in one of the 3e modules (the sundering of the weave I believe is the one). And I think 'greatest' will refer to both magical might and depth of lore gathered. |
I have a dream that one day, all game worlds will exist as one. |
 |
|
|
muir
Acolyte
Canada
41 Posts |
Posted - 20 May 2019 : 16:25:12
|
Gah! I did not forget about the Terraseer, but discounted it because it has certainly not forgotten where it came from. But perhaps it heads/steers an organization which has...
I am still learning not to discount modules as sources of lore. |
|
|
|
Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6382 Posts |
|
|
BrennonGoldeye
Learned Scribe
105 Posts |
Posted - 20 May 2019 : 18:02:40
|
| Might they be 'Weave Ghosts' or something elder to that? I've always wondered what were the incarnations of the Weave 'before' Mystral. As often as She has changed in the past 1000 years, what were Her turmoils before Humans called Her Mystral? |
Sam |
|
|
|
ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2089 Posts |
Posted - 20 May 2019 : 18:53:21
|
quote:
Originally posted by muir
From Mages and Sages Ep. 11 I think it was Eric Boyd speaking:
Yep. :-) |
--
http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
|
|
|
Sammael
Acolyte
27 Posts |
Posted - 20 May 2019 : 22:34:29
|
FFS just tell us who the 5 are :D
in all seriousness, I would say the organization as such no longer exists, only its legacies. Candlekeep may be one such legacy. Larloch may be another. Collecting and categorizing knowledge and ensuring it is never lost or forgotten - a noble goal and certainly one that's followed by many in modern Realms. |
|
|
|
George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6680 Posts |
Posted - 20 May 2019 : 23:10:58
|
Well the creation of the Nether Scrolls, as with all such potent magic, came at a ... cost.
— George Krashos |
"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
|
|
|
muir
Acolyte
Canada
41 Posts |
Posted - 22 May 2019 : 01:59:04
|
quote:
The Ba'etith are the Nether Scrolls, (in my version anyway)
quote:
Well the creation of the Nether Scrolls, as with all such potent magic, came at a ... cost.
I have sometimes wondered whether the Nether Scrolls have any sort of 'auto-update' function. Magical knowledge continues to increase, after all, and occasionally some of the ground rules change (see: Karsus' Folly.) Updating would be easier if a soul imprint, or soul, of the creators was present. |
|
|
|
TBeholder
Great Reader
2473 Posts |
Posted - 22 May 2019 : 03:00:33
|
quote:
Originally posted by muir
"The Ba'etith, they still exist. They don't really remember that they exist; they transformed into another, form, let me say, that has largely forgotten where it's come from but they are still existing and the greatest of the Ba'etith, there are 5 of them, they still have a hand in the Realms, including one of them may well have had a role (I'm going to be really obscure here) in the madness of a certain line of kings."
[...]
I take the "transformed into another form" as referring to the organization, rather than individuals, for they were not all the same species even by the end of the Days of Thunder.
Why not? It could refer to individuals too, seeing how they're ancient. Once tey start taking other forms, does it matter much what they were? There are many, many forms into which something can be transformed and "still exist".
Possibilities are so wide, speculation even about the known ones is not very fruitful. Minions of Mystril/Mystra alone have many forms - shadowstaves, souls-in-artifacts, wanderers without memories of their past and whatnot. And how many are there "plain old" undead creatures?
quote:
Originally posted by muir
I have sometimes wondered whether the Nether Scrolls have any sort of 'auto-update' function. Magical knowledge continues to increase, after all, and occasionally some of the ground rules change (see: Karsus' Folly.) Updating would be easier if a soul imprint, or soul, of the creators was present.
Updating would be a bit like trying to embrace the infinite, then cling on as it grows.
But it's clear that one can read from the scrolls more than the Sarrukh or anyone at that time could write into them.
And there were mentions of content changing when someone re-reads a scroll later.
My theory is that the scrolls are interactive, that is don't contain all the information they provide, but mostly derive it procedurally, building upon what they can get both from the user and their "reading" of the Weave at the moment, via different methods implemented in each individual scroll.
This allows practically unlimited complexity, but doesn't necessarily imply a sentience, because it would be superfluous if the current user is a part of the device (when it's active) anyway. From what we know, most likely they aren't thinking, because there were two duplicate sets. |
People never wonder How the world goes round -Helloween
And even I make no pretense Of having more than common sense -R.W.Wood
It's not good, Eric. It's a gazebo. -Ed Whitchurch |
|
|
|
Starshade
Learned Scribe
Norway
279 Posts |
Posted - 22 May 2019 : 15:32:32
|
| Line of Kings? Madness? That got to be Cormyr. |
|
|
|
Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36871 Posts |
Posted - 22 May 2019 : 20:55:28
|
quote:
Originally posted by Starshade
Line of Kings? Madness? That got to be Cormyr.
I don't have an alternative, but I don't think it's Cormyr. The place is not associated with mad kings. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
|
|
|
Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6382 Posts |
|
|
TBeholder
Great Reader
2473 Posts |
Posted - 27 May 2019 : 04:00:56
|
| Maybe Aryselmalyr? |
People never wonder How the world goes round -Helloween
And even I make no pretense Of having more than common sense -R.W.Wood
It's not good, Eric. It's a gazebo. -Ed Whitchurch |
|
|
|
sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11993 Posts |
Posted - 29 May 2019 : 22:29:47
|
quote:
Originally posted by Starshade
Line of Kings? Madness? That got to be Cormyr.
cou
I wouldn't make that assumption. We're talking a group that spans dozens of millennia since they were formed. The mad kings could have been in Narfell. They could have been amongst the elves during the crown wars. They could have been amongst the dragons or giants for that matter. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
|
|
|
Bragi
Seeker
USA
91 Posts |
Posted - 16 Apr 2025 : 05:35:47
|
| I'm guessing the Vyshaan Dynasty. |
In Pursuit of Better Worlds,
Bragi of Erin |
|
|
|
Seethyr
Master of Realmslore
USA
1226 Posts |
Posted - 16 Apr 2025 : 15:53:34
|
| I would love to think of the Ba’etith as still existing in the shadows, running things like many think of the Illuminati in Marvel or the real world. |
Follow the Maztica (Aztec/Maya) and Anchorome (Indigenous North America) Campaigns on DMsGuild!
The Maztica Campaign
The Anchorome Campaign |
|
|
|
sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11993 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2025 : 13:02:14
|
quote:
Originally posted by Seethyr
I would love to think of the Ba’etith as still existing in the shadows, running things like many think of the Illuminati in Marvel or the real world.
Same, and I'd expect their hands to some degree behind a lot of fallen empires. I mentioned Narfell above with the underground pit of Dun-Tharos, but prior to that the fall of the dark elves of Narathmault which was pretty much the same spot.... which may harken back to the strange material found beneath Thaymount taken back by the ba'etith .... and which may also have led to not necessarily "a line" but supposedly A MAD KING that slaughtered his kingdom in the form of Fastrin the Delver.
Of course, that same black metal material may have been a core to the material that made up the "black moon orb" which was also cursed and more than likely drove Szass Tam mad .... and said same material may have also been why a Netherese artificer had his flying citadel called Jiksidur in the region that would be Narfell (said same Netherese artificer supposedly being the creator of the black moon orb).
I also wouldn't be surprised if said same black metal material had been studied by the Imaskari, since for a time they had bases above Thaymount (again, a former ba'etith stronghold) ....... nor would I be surprised if said strange black metal material had ties to another world where a powerful primordial of destruction that some may know as Pandorym and others may know as Entropy the God Swallower .... and that they tried to tame this being and control it to use it as a weapon.... and that it MAY have called across the planes to the gods of another world, whose people were enslaved by the Imaskari, as a means to overthrow those who would subvert and enslave it .... and that it may have even swallowed one or more of these godly manifestations that came to free its people.
In the end, neither would I be surprised if this same black metal material can serve as some kind of focus to pull magic from another world, probably Abeir, to enhance one's power in the practice that may be called "worldfire" by some. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
Edited by - sleyvas on 17 Apr 2025 13:07:11 |
|
|
|
Marc
Senior Scribe
661 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2025 : 21:47:28
|
Missashak, is the only other sarrukh member I know, he/she discovered the dark metal artifact that became the Athora, what Sleyvas said, tough I don't know if he's alive like Arthindol
maybe some of the aeree members survived transformed like the nagpa |
. |
|
|
|
sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11993 Posts |
Posted - 19 Apr 2025 : 00:30:12
|
quote:
Originally posted by Marc
Missashak, is the only other sarrukh member I know, he/she discovered the dark metal artifact that became the Athora, what Sleyvas said, tough I don't know if he's alive like Arthindol
maybe some of the aeree members survived transformed like the nagpa
Over in Anchorome, we were posited that idea that there was a nagpa in the ruins of a former civilization. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
Current form of the Ba'etith
