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Neo2151
Learned Scribe
USA
118 Posts |
 Posted - 16 Feb 2025 : 04:29:54
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I can't recall but... was there a heavy connection between Spelljammer and the Realms for the history of the Tel'Quessir?
My brain is telling me that yes, native elves and Spelljammed elves co-mingled in the early days and eventually formed what became of the elven nations.
Is that correct? Am I delusional here?
I went looking through some 2e material and saw no mention of Spelljammer at all (in Cormanthyr: Empire of Elves for instance).
Is this Spelljammer specific lore and not considered usual canon?
Help?  
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"Come looking for me, and I will blast you to dust, and then lay waste to all your descendants, ancestors, and the realm you came from, every last tree and stone of it. Why? Well, it's what I usually do."
-Baerendra Riverhand on The Story of Spellfire |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2082 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2025 : 08:50:19
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There are scattered references to spelljamming in Cormanthyr, but not the direct ties you are looking for.
I am currently working on a re-write of Realmspace, which might answer your questions. |
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
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The Arcanamach
Master of Realmslore
1869 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2025 : 19:36:02
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My memory is fuzzy so I could be completely wrong here.
In Elves of Evermeet, I believe the original elves are transplants from another world. I believe they arrived via portal magic, but maybe it was via spelljammer? I really don't think so, though.
The only ties to spelljamming that I know of is they have a few starships guarding Evermeet. I don't think they have 'trade' ships or the ilk, just fortified vessels meant to protect the island. |
I have a dream that one day, all game worlds will exist as one. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36855 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2025 : 21:02:25
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quote:
Originally posted by The Arcanamach
My memory is fuzzy so I could be completely wrong here.
In Elves of Evermeet, I believe the original elves are transplants from another world. I believe they arrived via portal magic, but maybe it was via spelljammer? I really don't think so, though.
The only ties to spelljamming that I know of is they have a few starships guarding Evermeet. I don't think they have 'trade' ships or the ilk, just fortified vessels meant to protect the island.
It was a portal. It was quite a long time after that before spelljammers showed up. |
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EltonRobb
Learned Scribe
USA
125 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2025 : 22:40:16
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quote:
Originally posted by The Arcanamach
My memory is fuzzy so I could be completely wrong here.
In Elves of Evermeet, I believe the original elves are transplants from another world. I believe they arrived via portal magic, but maybe it was via spelljammer? I really don't think so, though.
The only ties to spelljamming that I know of is they have a few starships guarding Evermeet. I don't think they have 'trade' ships or the ilk, just fortified vessels meant to protect the island.
I like the spelljamming angle, but the elves arrived from another world via a portal. What particular world they came from is up to the GM, but it might be either Oerth or Krynn. |
Edited by - EltonRobb on 16 Feb 2025 22:41:48 |
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The Arcanamach
Master of Realmslore
1869 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2025 : 23:55:10
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| I'd say Oerth before Krynn but I don't think it was either world, tbh. I think it was more of an elven 'homeworld' thing. |
I have a dream that one day, all game worlds will exist as one. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36855 Posts |
Posted - 18 Feb 2025 : 22:27:26
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quote:
Originally posted by EltonRobb
quote:
Originally posted by The Arcanamach
My memory is fuzzy so I could be completely wrong here.
In Elves of Evermeet, I believe the original elves are transplants from another world. I believe they arrived via portal magic, but maybe it was via spelljammer? I really don't think so, though.
The only ties to spelljamming that I know of is they have a few starships guarding Evermeet. I don't think they have 'trade' ships or the ilk, just fortified vessels meant to protect the island.
I like the spelljamming angle, but the elves arrived from another world via a portal. What particular world they came from is up to the GM, but it might be either Oerth or Krynn.
They say they came from Faerie.
This is a bit problematic, though... The ones that came via the portal in the beginning of the Evermeet novel were fleeing the destruction of their homeland -- and rather than go elsewhere on the same world, they opted to go to a new world entirely. This suggests the destruction of their world...
But we know Faerie still exists.
My theory is that elves originally came from Faerie, the plane. They settled on a Prime world and named it Faerie, after their original home. The sun elves and moon elf that came to Toril were fleeing from that Prime world. Given the identical names and the passage of thousands of years, elves eventually conflated the two, forgetting the Prime world.
The real unanswered question, though... Did the elves already on Toril come from the same place as the sun and moon elves? |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Delnyn
Master of Realmslore
USA
1018 Posts |
Posted - 18 Feb 2025 : 23:39:37
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Wooly,
I have no proof, but I suspect only the sun and moon elves came from Tintageer. The other elves may still have come from Faerie-or at least from the same world, but not the island kingdom of Tintageer. And since the sun and moon elves were the last elves to arrive on Toril, the other elves logically arrived before the destruction of the home world. I hope this addresses your question. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36855 Posts |
Posted - 19 Feb 2025 : 01:13:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
Wooly,
I have no proof, but I suspect only the sun and moon elves came from Tintageer. The other elves may still have come from Faerie-or at least from the same world, but not the island kingdom of Tintageer. And since the sun and moon elves were the last elves to arrive on Toril, the other elves logically arrived before the destruction of the home world. I hope this addresses your question.
We can assume the other elves came from the same world, but it's also possible that the first diaspora was so long before the destruction of Tintageer that the other elves had come from elsewhere. Spelljammer has elves all over the place, so multiple waves of elves finding new worlds is certainly a possibility. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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TBeholder
Great Reader
2455 Posts |
Posted - 19 Feb 2025 : 22:03:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Neo2151
I can't recall but... was there a heavy connection between Spelljammer and the Realms for the history of the Tel'Quessir?
Well, Evermeet (novel) mentioned early contact, and some details.
quote:
I went looking through some 2e material and saw no mention of Spelljammer at all (in Cormanthyr: Empire of Elves for instance).
How?! A search for "spelljam" gives several examples even in the timeline alone.
quote:
-1114 The magic of spelljamming is discovered by the Netherese humans.
[...]
-1014 Netheril abandons spelljamming magic and technology as too costly and expensive; this is due, in part, to constant harrying within Realmspace by the Elven Imperial Navy.
[...]
512 Year of the Wyvernfall [...] The Coronal's Court receives the first of many visitations by spelljamming elves of the Elven Imperial Navy at Shadusk and Green Monarchs' Glade northeast of the city.
- Cormanthyr: Empire of Elves, p.40
. . .
The Coronals and Rysars of Cormanthyr
[...]
Fourth Rysar : -1338 to -791 : Coronal Miirphys Irithyl
- Cormanthyr: Empire of Elves, p.45
. . .
Miirphys Irithyl was a singular Coronal, as the only nongold elf Coronal of Cormanthyr. [...] he made himself an ally of the High Mages and the nobles alike by supporting their launching of a number of ships into Realmspace to prevent the expansion of abusive Netherese spelljammers during his rysar.
- Cormanthyr: Empire of Elves, p.46
. . .
Money
[...] Coins of the realm of Cormanthyr are a varied lot, depending on the traders. Spelljamming elves of the Imperial Navy Above bring coin from many far-flung realms and worlds, though these coins are rare as collecting them is an idle habit of many a noble elf of Cormanthyr.
- Cormanthyr: Empire of Elves, p.63
And some more mentions, including usage of High Magic to shape Monarch hulls (archaic version of Armada: a bit sturdier, a lot less armed, and looks goofy).
Fall of Myth Drannor: air support from EIN (Monarch Mordent).
Elves of Evermeet (FOR5 sourcebook): introduced Starwing ship (smaller, water-landing Man-o-War variant).
It's fairly obvious that as the only major elven polity left standing, Evermeet has to be the main friendly base in Realmspace for EIN. Likely at least from the time Cormanthyr was lost.
edit: added times for EIN vs Netheril altercations |
People never wonder How the world goes round -Helloween
And even I make no pretense Of having more than common sense -R.W.Wood
It's not good, Eric. It's a gazebo. -Ed Whitchurch |
Edited by - TBeholder on 21 Feb 2025 00:04:56 |
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Neo2151
Learned Scribe
USA
118 Posts |
Posted - 20 Feb 2025 : 06:42:32
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To be fair, I was looking for the origin of elves, and it was a super-lazy search with just page flips and eyeballs.
So if mentions are made after the establishment of Cormanthyr, that's long past the timelines I was scanning through. :) |
"Come looking for me, and I will blast you to dust, and then lay waste to all your descendants, ancestors, and the realm you came from, every last tree and stone of it. Why? Well, it's what I usually do."
-Baerendra Riverhand on The Story of Spellfire |
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Elven history and Spelljammer
