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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11855 Posts |
 Posted - 15 Dec 2024 : 19:30:47
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Got a rough idea and just figured I'd throw it out for consumption and improvement.
I've long been interested in development of the ruined city of Peleverai as a city that was "reborn" by refugees from Toril while in Abeir. I've basically considered it a city built into the walls of a river canyon, with tunnels that lead into the surrounding underdark. This canyon then opens out into the landrise that separates the eastern and western Shar. So, I have pictured not one but multiple waterfalls along its length coming from different underground rivers that then make the river Shar that used to run across the plains of the Shar, giving it life.
So, I also started thinking about Imaskari magic being implemented to revitalize this city, and one thought came to mind.... Extradimensional spaces and what to do with them. So, what about an extradimensional water storage facility, that then periodically gets "opened" causing a rush of water into aqueducts, pipes, and out into farmlands? It then occurred to me that these might also go to water cannons that might be spread around to fight fires in the city, do light defense of the city, clean the city, etc.... Then I thought, what if these "water cannons" could apply an electrical charge to the water making it "mildly" electrified (i.e. maybe incurring a single point of damage a round). This makes if more effective as a crowd deterrent. Any other ideas come to mind? Any other uses? Opening the floor.
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Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31792 Posts |
Posted - 15 Dec 2024 : 23:42:43
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First of all… love this idea! It’s creatively wild. *thumbs up*
And secondly, while I can’t immediately generate any other ideas atm, I am intrigued by how you perceive the POVs of surrounding cities and towns that might come up with an eye for seeing the potential for the “military” application of such ‘magitech.’ |
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"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
Edited by - The Sage on 15 Dec 2024 23:43:24 |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11855 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2024 : 15:03:33
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
First of all… love this idea! It’s creatively wild. *thumbs up*
And secondly, while I can’t immediately generate any other ideas atm, I am intrigued by how you perceive the POVs of surrounding cities and towns that might come up with an eye for seeing the potential for the “military” application of such ‘magitech.’
Well, one thing I was also focusing on with my explorations of "what happened in Abeir", was that this other world seems ripe for exploration of "elementalists". So, having water elementalists in this city with "water cannons" would seem a potential for military applications as well. I was also picturing that the water may be shot out with inertia potential and THEN be insta frozen as "flying icicle" sprays. Not a giant ice lance per se (though.. possibility), but more of "a thousand icicles are shot in your direction". Moving in another direction, it could also be magically superheated such that it goes out as a water stream but then turns into an expanding cloud of hot steam. This could be used to do light burn damage, but more importantly it could serve as a quick way to turn an area into an area that's hard to see through (this could have cleaning applications as well). As another idea, transmuting "water" into another medium, like acid, flammable oil, non-flammable "petroleum jelly" to inhibit troop movement OR make a fun event for a festival (i.e. catch a greased animal), etc....
This particular city I would like to see exploration of all the elements, and it would be inhabited by refugees from Unther, Mulhorand, Chessenta, Thay (inhabitants living in enclaves due to the ongoing thayan civil war), the Shaar, and even Dambrath and Halruaan exiles/refugees. So, from Thay they would already have those with an eye towards fire, but they gain interests in earth, air and water while in Abeir. This would extend in many directions, with elemental oriented monks, eldritch knights, elementalist focused wizards/wu jen, even "sha'ir" warlocks, etc... |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
Edited by - sleyvas on 16 Dec 2024 15:54:53 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36812 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2024 : 03:00:43
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| Why an extradimensional space storing water, instead of just a portal to the plane of water? Sure, the latter runs the risk of something coming through, but that should be controllable with magic (it's never an issue with decanters of endless water) and cuts out the steps of creating an extradimensional space, finding a lot of water for that space, putting the water in that space, and then pressurizing it to come out rapidly. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36812 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2024 : 03:00:47
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| Why an extradimensional space storing water, instead of just a portal to the plane of water? Sure, the latter runs the risk of something coming through, but that should be controllable with magic (it's never an issue with decanters of endless water) and cuts out the steps of creating an extradimensional space, finding a lot of water for that space, putting the water in that space, and then pressurizing it to come out rapidly. |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11855 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2024 : 12:36:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Why an extradimensional space storing water, instead of just a portal to the plane of water? Sure, the latter runs the risk of something coming through, but that should be controllable with magic (it's never an issue with decanters of endless water) and cuts out the steps of creating an extradimensional space, finding a lot of water for that space, putting the water in that space, and then pressurizing it to come out rapidly.
Because the city I'm describing already naturally has multiple rivers coming to it (at least, that's what I'm picturing it as... ain't jack documented really about the city layout in canon other than its built into the wall of the landrise, and it has a well to another dimension that trapped Gargauth until the Cult of the Dragon released him, and the city was attacked/destroyed by dragonflights around 4 to 6 centuries ago). So, sometimes those rivers might be extremely rapid and deep, causing problems. Sometimes those rivers may be slow and placid. An extradimensional space can easily gather water when its fast, and let it out at later times when people are ready to use it. Plus, in theory an extradimensional space is much easier to create, control, and intrinsically less dangerous.
As an additional thought that I hadn't really been considering until you asked this question, there may be some advantages to having an extradimensional space filled with water. Essentially, it can become a big aquarium/hatchery for blind cave fish to serve as food for humanoid or servant animal consumption (in a similar way to how up in alaska the sled dogs are often fed the fish humans don't want that are caught in a fish wheel). You could easily "catch" these fish by placing a net around the exit and draining the space, then refill it with water and replenish it with fingerling fish.
Oh, and since you did mention decanters of endless water, I had been actually discussing their deployment in some of these places in Abeir in years past. Since they're extremely easy to create in 5e, but they require manual activation each round, I kind of pictured that some cities might create these and actually employ children for the simple but tedious task of standing there and activating them over and over. This could give children with no parents a way to support themselves (or the orphanage that takes them in). I actually see these things as being easier to create in Abeir, since the place seems to be "more elementally inclined". I can see this city using this option AS WELL at times, since its relatively cheap (i.e 5e, creating a decanter of endless water requires 20 days and 500 gold). There may even be merchants/guilds who keep a dozen of them on hand and "rent" them to individuals who need an emergency influx of water for whatever reason at a remote area without aqueducts or some other form that can divert river water to the location. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
Edited by - sleyvas on 18 Dec 2024 12:50:06 |
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AJA
Senior Scribe
USA
774 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2024 : 06:12:26
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If I may abbreviate from a Questions For Ed Greenwood answer on the availability of water in Waterdeep (NOV 17 2007)
quote:
Fourth: the same portal spells that hold the "unseen phantom walls" of the city dimensionally "otherwhere," to be summoned around the city when needed, also hold an opening to a huge lake, which would "pour water from the sky" into the statues around the walls of the Field of Triumph (arena), which contain pipes with various gigantic spigots and drain-holes accessible around the outside edges of the walls (so, into wagon-tanks), that drain on down into Undermountain, should drought, a siege, or other extraordinary conditions of water shortage arise. (This backup has never been needed, but did feature in an adventure Ed ran back in 1982, I think, wherein a Watch patrol got "washed down the street" and a group of PC adventurers managed to escape them.)
Hilather was from Imaskar. Perhaps ol' Aggy learned a trick or two from him?
Also, the answer to why you don't want a portal to the Plane of Water is exactly because you don't want something coming through. We can all agree that a bidet is a nice quality of life improvement. A water weird having its' way with your nether regions is a whole other playground.
As to your "crowd pacifiers," just attach a wand of lightning bolts to their nozzles instead. No half measures! That's what a real Imaskari would do.
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AJA
YAFRP
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11855 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2024 : 12:44:27
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quote:
Originally posted by AJA
If I may abbreviate from a Questions For Ed Greenwood answer on the availability of water in Waterdeep (NOV 17 2007)
quote:
Fourth: the same portal spells that hold the "unseen phantom walls" of the city dimensionally "otherwhere," to be summoned around the city when needed, also hold an opening to a huge lake, which would "pour water from the sky" into the statues around the walls of the Field of Triumph (arena), which contain pipes with various gigantic spigots and drain-holes accessible around the outside edges of the walls (so, into wagon-tanks), that drain on down into Undermountain, should drought, a siege, or other extraordinary conditions of water shortage arise. (This backup has never been needed, but did feature in an adventure Ed ran back in 1982, I think, wherein a Watch patrol got "washed down the street" and a group of PC adventurers managed to escape them.)
Hilather was from Imaskar. Perhaps ol' Aggy learned a trick or two from him?
Also, the answer to why you don't want a portal to the Plane of Water is exactly because you don't want something coming through. We can all agree that a bidet is a nice quality of life improvement. A water weird having its' way with your nether regions is a whole other playground.
As to your "crowd pacifiers," just attach a wand of lightning bolts to their nozzles instead. No half measures! That's what a real Imaskari would do.
I like the idea of being able to "slam in" a fireball, lightning bolt, etc... wand in an emergency (i.e. Abeiran dragons raid for example) and the water cannon turn into a platform weapon that anyone can activate without attunement (and even without water). That being said, this is a city with Imaskari secrets, but not Imaskari.
On Ed's notes, good to see where others have thought along same lines. An extradimensional storage is even safer, but it also falls into the problem of "what happens if the 3 rivers dry up". However, like mentioned above, it will probably never get to that extreme without some extensive underdark collapse (and to note, the source of at least one river was the great rift in the Shaar... and based on 4e maps, I picture that a portion of the great rift went to Abeir). Of course my whole theory is based on the idea that "the Underchasm" wasn't because the Eastern Shaar collapsed... but rather that it went to Abeir..... and that in and of itself could have affected some rivers.
After finding out that Ed had approved a generic map of what Abeir looks like based on his web presentation about Abeir (this map seemingly being post second sundering), I mocked up this to give an idea of where I pictured things fitting in
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1uJpsGQZ6Mokj0E_DtBCaGWvnmDCQlmw_/view?usp=sharing
Based on where Ed described Halruaa going in another web presentation, it definitely seems like there's no clear cut distinctions on WHERE things went to. Basically, it seems like Halruaa went into the far north. Lots of Unther, small portions of Chessenta and Chondath, seem to meanwhile have gone to the same continent ... but it would seem "lower" than Halruaa as opposed to "higher". So, I took the lands that me and Seethyr had been playing with and "flipped" them and used the "boiling sea" as a reason that the majority of the world hadn't interacted with them. I didn't show Nimbral or Lantan in my mockup, as I didn't have plans for them, but if I were to do so, I'd probably use Lhoraun, since its the "unknown place rumored to have flying ships".
Oh, and on that map... I SPECIFICALLY showed it with a reverse of what most people do (i.e. south is up top, north is at the bottom). This is because its from the perspective of the people of Toril who transferred to Abeir. Since they see the same sun, the same moon, and in theory the same stars.... I figured they'd realize that they were "flipped" but would keep things focused on themselves... which were more definite.
Oh, and so "how did the people get to the Shaaran Transfer from Karshaunt / Mistlands / Shyr" ?". One of the big things I did was take the Tower Terrible of Soorenar which was the mortal home of Velsharoon and transfer it in its entirety to Peleverai (long story there). I may have it that the portions of Soorenar that transferred to Abeir get transferred to the surface Shaar above Peleverai, and a portal existed for a short term between the two regions. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
Edited by - sleyvas on 21 Dec 2024 13:03:22 |
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Electrified Water Cannons of Peleverai
