| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| the lost drow |
Posted - 15 Sep 2003 : 22:08:37
Now this may be a spolier to same.
Now I've heard a lot of rumers about the end of the Hunters Blades triligy (by R.A. Salvator). One of the rumers that concerns me is that some people say that Drizzit is going to die. Has anyone elese heard about this? |
| 26 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| William of Waterdeep |
Posted - 06 Oct 2003 : 05:05:01
quote:
Originally posted by the lost drow
I've read some of Greenwoods work and though I must thank him for making FR, his work is way to slow for me.
This is still a nice comment. I haven't read any novels that Ed has
written just material for the game,I have no bad remarks myself but I
have heard him called the thief and the copycat.I don't have enough facts to agree or disagree.But regardless, I as yourself thank him for
the FR. |
| the lost drow |
Posted - 05 Oct 2003 : 20:57:49
I've read some of Greenwoods work and though I must thank him for making FR, his work is way to slow for me.
|
| William of Waterdeep |
Posted - 02 Oct 2003 : 00:00:59
 Okay,okay.....
I knew you had a reason,If I caused you to repeat a post then Its my
fault for not looking for it.I guess Ed had a couple of good ideas
then but no real imagination or writing skills needed work.
Wait that sounds like me!!!!
No,really I have respect for your opinion and believe me you were nice
compared to what I have read before.
Thanks Arion!!! |
| Arion Elenim |
Posted - 01 Oct 2003 : 23:23:19
Gauntlet thrown, William of Waterdeep? Duel accepted.
I will indeed thank Mr. Greenwood for giving us Faerun - but his contributions seem to be limited to the name, a little geography, a smattering of wizard characters and a slew of very bad fantasy novels.
I find his work VERY trite. In particular, the Hand of Fire series gets my goad. His plot lines are EXTEMELY sprawling and meandering - it seems that not even Greenwood has any idea where he is going until the final page. His "surprise endings" are rarely more than "out-of-left-field" drivel that has NO bearing on the previous three hundred pages. There is rarely any character development beyond a great deal of stereotyping, and there is even less dialogue at all...limited to "TIME TO DIE!" and "I'LL GET YOU FOR THIS" as a few of my favorite Greenwood-isms.
Then we come to Elminster.
Beyond the fact that he is a CLEAR facsimile of Tolkein's Gandalf, Elminster is incredibly dull and predictable. He will always pull the answer out of his hat, after running out of the picture to "deal with things elsewhere" or some other LOTR excuse for leaving the main characters to do the fighting.
If you look at him from a gaming standpoint...ugh. The character is UNKILLABLE. Not a wish spell. Not -10 hp. Not a giant moon falling on his head. Nothing. Thus, there is no conflict. There is no threat. Going to hell didn't phase him in the least. That's just unbelievable...even for a mythos chock-full of dragons and elves.
Elminster outdoes EVERY other character as far as CR goes, by a long shot....(2nd place goes to the Simbul...who is 5 CRs behind). He is NEVER challenged by any strech of the imagination, never runs across any sort of creature that impresses him or makes him afraid. He has no emotion beyond a base crochety-ness that is incredibly overused.
Its great to have a "symbol" for Faerun, it's just that Greenwood's Elminster is so cliche' it is scary. The rest of his characters are the same...bad guys who are nothing but monolithic (as in, evil for the sake of evil (Manshoon, etc.)), and when you add all of that up you have a pretty mediocre writer.
And so the question is: Arion, you ego-driven bastard, do you think you can do better? I don't know...but I do know that there are a MILLION other writers in the world with tons more imagination and talent than Master Greenwood.
Okay Arion...shut up.(wipes sweat off brow).
Oh, and Alaundo...sorry about the repeat post...I couldn't help it....
|
| The Cardinal |
Posted - 01 Oct 2003 : 06:01:56
Mwa ha ha ha ha!
Excellent, granted you are correct ArionElenim. Were I a wise man, I would have done my research but alas It is easier to speak then deal with the fall out than have to trek through 5000+ pages, not that it would be so hard, I would rather welcome the challenge, only three things hold me back from making a detailed arguement:
1 The nearest bookstore that MAY carry anthing from the FR universe is at least 300km away
2 I work graveyards at the local sawmill so... I usually sleep all day,and
3 If I don't get intrested in a book right away I tend to not read it, or on the reverse side, should I enjoy a book too much I coninually put it down ( don't want it too end cause it's too good).
Anyways, I will not defend myself against the alligations and proof that I am an uneducated fool ( when it comes to Drizzt) but my opinion is out there, and my own research is complete. I have a general idea of how many:
Like Drizzt and the books,
Hate the books but like Drizzt,
Like the books but hate Drizzt  ,
and Hate both books and Drizzt.
But I will ( at the next chance I get) see about getting more Drizzt material then provide some solid proof, mkay? Still it's funner to BS, I will humbly bow out of this scroll defeated 
Congrats all |
| William of Waterdeep |
Posted - 01 Oct 2003 : 00:11:00
quote:
Originally posted by ArionElenim
I am impressed that the good Cardinal had no compunctions about speaking such an unpopular thought...I just wish he had done his research first...
You simply cannot judge a character whose story spans 5000+ pages by a few quick glances at 15 or so of them....I personally cannot STAND the works of Ed Greenwood (with the exception of "Elminster at the Mage Fair" an admittedly charming short story), but I have read several of his novels, and can thusly form educated opinions. If one wishes to have such strong, inflammatory thoughts about a thing, it would best serve him to know the ins and outs of it...
Yeah Cardinal,take that...(I've picked on you enough to know that you are at least a good sport.)
But to try and avoid such myself.I will ask a question rather than make a comment.My friend ArionElenim, I know Ed isn't Bob Salvatore
but is he that bad?I know you don't want to write a letter explaining
but can you give me the short version.I am not saying you are wrong
to feel this way but I am not as well read in the Realms as you and I
don't understand at least not yet.I know you will at least give me your honest opinion! |
| Arion Elenim |
Posted - 30 Sep 2003 : 17:45:59
I am impressed that the good Cardinal had no compunctions about speaking such an unpopular thought...I just wish he had done his research first...
You simply cannot judge a character whose story spans 5000+ pages by a few quick glances at 15 or so of them....I personally cannot STAND the works of Ed Greenwood (with the exception of "Elminster at the Mage Fair" an admittedly charming short story), but I have read several of his novels, and can thusly form educated opinions. If one wishes to have such strong, inflammatory thoughts about a thing, it would best serve him to know the ins and outs of it... |
| The Cardinal |
Posted - 30 Sep 2003 : 07:23:54
True while unaware of most of Drizzt's actions I know a few things.
1 Drizzt Turned against Lolth
2 Vhaeraun is evil while Drizzt is good thus provides more good drow gods and Eilistraee and I doubt Eilistraee would object too much than be happy for another of her brethren to help against Lolth
3 Drizzt should be down on his knees thanking Lolth for continued existence. She had appeared before him in .... Ah, realms of the Underdark in the tale 'Fires of Narbondel'.
4 Drizzt is now a force of... good but selective good ( at least in Dark Mirror, now I think I've heard it said he's just plain good). Too good. Of course I think Drizzt is over rated and to me ( it seems) there are too many Drizzt likers than haters. Thus I must hate Drizzt to keep balence. Woe to me should I have a change of heart, mostly because he's just too damn good.... * glances around for Alaundo* I'm aloud to say damn right? |
| Arivia |
Posted - 30 Sep 2003 : 07:05:23
The obligatory action: *Smacks Deimos with a copy of Drizzt Do'Urden's Guide to the Underdark.*
If you've only read Dark Mirror, I suggest you pick up a copy of The Crystal Shard-the first book Drizzt appearead in(in terms of publication dates). With it being the first book with Drizzt as a character, there is some introductory information that you might find interesting. If Drizzt did ascend to godhood, as you say, he would quickly come into conflict with Vhaeraun over the drow males. Most drow on the surface worship Vhaeraun or Eilistraee, and his portfolio as described below would place him in direct conflict with Vhaeraun... |
| The Cardinal |
Posted - 30 Sep 2003 : 06:55:35
Well Since after doing some reading of this scroll and a few various other things, I've decided to put my two cents in, aren't you all lucky * Avoids being pelted by rotten fruit and vegies*
Well I'm shocked actually to see so many people view Drizzt as a cash cow or anything eles, personally I don't like him, and wouldn't view his death as any marker... except may a victory for the beloved Lolth . Still I don't know that much about him ( ashamed as I am to admit it). I have read the Dark Mirror and to speak the truth I felt that Drizzt was arrogant and well cowardly. * avoids being pelted with scrolls and books* IF R.A. Salvator did kill him off it would be a chance at a new beginning though. I think ( should he Kill Drizzt off, a feat in itself) several things could occur, First he's free of Drizzt ( I mean come on, he most well known for Drizzt in FR, I assume), second Drizzt may get a shot as Godhood and therefore not really be dead but... retired. A god to protect male drow elves on the surface or the poor hard working people on the frontier. This of course would infuriate Lolth to no end, being even further from her rage and wrath than now. I must admit this is an uneducated guess at what could happen and while I admire all things drowish I disdain all things uhhh Drizztish well There's my two bits. HA! * It promptly knocked out by a copy of 'Volo's guide to all things Magical' that he didn't avoid* |
| Arion Elenim |
Posted - 30 Sep 2003 : 06:05:44
The bad news is that I don't know when "Dark Mirror" occurs...I think it happens after Seige of Darkness...
However, technically, Zak's story in Realms of the Underdark ocurrs before ANY of the Drizzt books (well...I guess it really happens about four chapters into Homeland), so you may want to pick it up now... |
| William of Waterdeep |
Posted - 30 Sep 2003 : 01:41:49
quote:
Originally posted by ArionElenim
Said prequel about Zak can be found in Realms of the Underdark...it has a VERY young Drizzt as a cameo and explains how Zak came to defy the Spider Queen...
Salvatore's short stories are amazing. Sharper focus on spirituality, and a less sprawling, more first-person POV (some things that I feel are sometimes lacking in his full length novels), really show up in his shorter workds, and more completely showcase Salvatore's skill...
I also recommend his "Dark Mirror" story (featuring Drizzt coming to terms with his "racial enemy" as a ranger) in Realms of Valor....ah....good stuff.....
Well,I know you know your novels bard.I have Realms of Valor but I am
so far behind and I would like to read them (Drizzt books)in order
this time.Maybe I'll catch up someday. |
| Arion Elenim |
Posted - 30 Sep 2003 : 01:00:59
Said prequel about Zak can be found in Realms of the Underdark...it has a VERY young Drizzt as a cameo and explains how Zak came to defy the Spider Queen...
Salvatore's short stories are amazing. Sharper focus on spirituality, and a less sprawling, more first-person POV (some things that I feel are sometimes lacking in his full length novels), really show up in his shorter workds, and more completely showcase Salvatore's skill...
I also recommend his "Dark Mirror" story (featuring Drizzt coming to terms with his "racial enemy" as a ranger) in Realms of Valor....ah....good stuff..... |
| William of Waterdeep |
Posted - 28 Sep 2003 : 17:06:05
quote:
Originally posted by DrizzitFan
Well met
Drizzt getting killed off would be long odds. Personally, I suspect one of the party may get done in by end of Hunters Blade Trilogy. Could be Bruenor or Cattbrie. 
WotC would unlikely allow that Dark Elf (money-making, cash-cow, *insert appropriate $$$ scheme*) to be written out.
I do agree that its time for him to take a break, RAS has so many other interesting chars to develop, Jarlaxle n Entreri, the Bouldershoulder brothers, etc. He could even do a prequel on Zaknafein (spelling), that'd be cool.
William:
Please don't kill Cattie-brie,She is a favorite.It didn't like it that
she is a "minor charactor" in the "Hall of Heroes" 2e but so are many
others.I hope he doesn't kill anyone off.They could take a vacation
while he worked on something else.No need to kill somebody. |
| the lost drow |
Posted - 19 Sep 2003 : 02:37:42
quote:
Originally posted by Yasraena
Yes, no doubt. I think Wizards would string 'ol Bob up by his thumbs if he did that.
Although, if he did it right, it could be a great story. Just look at the Star Trek series. Both movies where Spock and Data die have to be two of the best in the series.
I'd be interested in learning where you heard these rumors from Lost Drow. The second book hasn't even come out yet, but you're hearing about the third one already?
Well you see, a coupoul of months ago I was searching the web for info on the Hunters Blade triligy. I searched for "forgotten realms" and a page about rumers came up. I looked on it and found this rumer. I forgot to add it to my favs. and the next time I went on I could not find it at all. It didn't really bother me until about 3 weeks ago when a few freinds of mine were talking and a couple of them said that they heard Salv. was planing to kill Drizzt. |
| Trafaldi |
Posted - 18 Sep 2003 : 17:51:32
RAS may kill of Drizzt but it is very doubtful he cares about his characters. But Drizzt needs some rest soon. RAS needs to work on different characters Artemis and Jaraxle would be great for his next book, i would alos be impressed if he pulled Caderly of the shelf again and do another book with him. |
| Bellua Aeneus Lacerta |
Posted - 18 Sep 2003 : 13:09:49
Probably going to battle Lloth in one of the last two War of the Spider Queen books |
| DrizzitFan |
Posted - 18 Sep 2003 : 04:09:13
Well met
Drizzt getting killed off would be long odds. Personally, I suspect one of the party may get done in by end of Hunters Blade Trilogy. Could be Bruenor or Cattbrie.
WotC would unlikely allow that Dark Elf (money-making, cash-cow, *insert appropriate $$$ scheme*) to be written out.
I do agree that its time for him to take a break, RAS has so many other interesting chars to develop, Jarlaxle n Entreri, the Bouldershoulder brothers, etc. He could even do a prequel on Zaknafein (spelling), that'd be cool. |
| Arion Elenim |
Posted - 18 Sep 2003 : 04:03:35
I have a bit of reminescing to do.......if my fellow scribes don't mind.....
When first I picked up the Legacy, I had a theory that Lloth did not really exist - that she was actually a great lie propogated by the drow in order to keep their society thriving, the males in line, the spells coming, etc. I was a little broken-hearted to see Lloth running around in the flesh....but oh well....
That said...I know that I am not exactly batting a thousand with my Salvatore predictions, but I do know that Salvatore has gone to great lengths to separate Drizzt from the "Companions of the Hall" - so much in fact that even setting aside from the series' title (the Lone Drow),the distributor's synopsis of the Lone Drow novels reads something like - "Drizzt's adventures without his normal companions." This is a clear indication to me that Salvatore is doing one of two things...
Either he is really going out of his way to take Drizzt in a new direction (something that I would not mind in the least...I'm getting sick of chasing Wulfgar around), or he is setting us up for something big - which would not surprise me at all to include the death of Drizzt.....his fame and "cash cow" status thrown to the wind....
(wow that was a lengthy way to say that I agree with Lost Drow's thinking...) |
| mikhel |
Posted - 18 Sep 2003 : 03:19:35
Is the third book titled "Drizzt in Hell"? I wouldn't believe that Drizzt would be rubbed out unless he dies, goes to hell, battles the fiends of the nine hells, then finds his way back to Faerun. Could be a good story, but sounds to me like someone is just making up the rumor to scare people.  |
| Arivia |
Posted - 16 Sep 2003 : 19:57:20
That's what I figured he'd do after the Hunter's Blades. Seems like a good series...and having Drizzt out of the picture for a while(except for his musings) should make things interesting. |
| Lord Rad |
Posted - 16 Sep 2003 : 18:19:29
Not really helping much, but I heard that Salvatores next set of novels is to be a trilogy based on Artemis and Jarlaxle. Should be good if Servant of the Shard is anything to go by.
It was nice to read about Drizzt and the companions in The Thousand Orcs after it being some time since the previous novel, but I think after Hunters Blades Trilogy that he should stay out of it for a while. Too much of a good thing... |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 16 Sep 2003 : 07:17:19
quote:
Originally posted by the lost drow
Now I've heard a lot of rumers about the end of the Hunters Blades triligy (by R.A. Salvator). One of the rumers that concerns me is that some people say that Drizzit is going to die. Has anyone elese heard about this?
LOL! Kill the cash cow?? Are you mad??
There was a recent discussion along this line at the WOTC board. Nothing factual was given. However, the consenus opinion was that Drizzt is going to stay very much on the mortal plane, brooding, one book at a time. |
| William of Waterdeep |
Posted - 16 Sep 2003 : 06:38:03
quote:
Originally posted by Yasraena
Yes, no doubt. I think Wizards would string 'ol Bob up by his thumbs if he did that.
Although, if he did it right, it could be a great story. Just look at the Star Trek series. Both movies where Spock and Data die have to be two of the best in the series.
I'd be interested in learning where you heard these rumors from Lost Drow. The second book hasn't even come out yet, but you're hearing about the third one already?
The Wizards would have to get in line!!!!! But you are right about Star Trek and the did the same with Kirk in the books.just as long as he has nine lives!!! |
| Yasraena |
Posted - 16 Sep 2003 : 04:04:36
Yes, no doubt. I think Wizards would string 'ol Bob up by his thumbs if he did that.
Although, if he did it right, it could be a great story. Just look at the Star Trek series. Both movies where Spock and Data die have to be two of the best in the series.
I'd be interested in learning where you heard these rumors from Lost Drow. The second book hasn't even come out yet, but you're hearing about the third one already? |
| Arivia |
Posted - 15 Sep 2003 : 22:16:35
I haven't heard about it before, but I'd be extremely surprised if that was the case. R.A has spent so much time developing the characters of Drizzt and his companions that he'd be ruining a hundred possible books if he did that. The only possible explanation could be if he was going to write some sort of "resurrect Drizzt" novel/trilogy/whatever after the Hunter's Blades. Besides, Drizzt is now considered to be one of the Realms' iconic characters (like the Seven Sisters, Elminster, or anyone of quite a few others). WotC would probably have many problems with that kind of result. |
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