| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Alaundo |
Posted - 31 May 2006 : 21:23:51
Well met
This is a Book Club thread for Final Gate (Book 3 of The Last Mythal Trilogy), by Richard Baker. Please discuss the prologue and chapters 1 - 4 herein.
Richard Baker will be here to answer any questions and respond to comments  |
| 28 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Copper Elven Vampire |
Posted - 08 Apr 2010 : 04:22:06
This was one of the best three books I've ever read in FR, and I've read over 100 of them. |
| Rinonalyrna Fathomlin |
Posted - 06 Jul 2006 : 00:03:33
Well, I finally picked this book up myself (having just finished The Lost Library of Cormanthyr), and I've gotten about 62 pages in so far. Granted, I haven't read that much yet, but I don't think Final Gate is--at this point--significantly better or worse than the previous two books. I am very much hoping this book surprises me and turns out to be really good (I have to say Farthest Reach was hard to put down after while), but right now I am very...underwhelmed by the setup of this book.
I think my number one complaint so far that really does not bode so well for me is just how similar the Araevin sections are to his sections in Forsaken House. In Book 3, Araevin is right back to leading a party of adventurers (who, by the way, still aren't all that distinguishable from each other in terms of dialogue, with the possible exception of Maresa) to locate several scattered pieces of an artifact in order to snap it back together somehow and use it. This sense of deja vu wouldn't be a bad thing at all if I had been impressed by the search for the loregems back in book 1...but I wasn't. I've always found the sections featuring Araevin's search--in each book--to be the least interesting of all the sub-plots, mainly because the prose has a very routine, "novelized D&D campaign" feel to them, along with the everpresent gem McGuffins. It just feels a bit forced to me.
My other serious complaint is with the main characters and how they characterized. I agree with Simbul that we haven't seen the "rotating clerics" this time around, and that's great. Yes, the characters are ostentibly very diverse--we have a sun elf from Evermeet, an air genasi from Waterdeep, a human knight of Lathander, a star elf from the Sildeyuir, a half-elven ranger of the Yuirwood, and in the beginning, the wood elf ranger who made an appearance in Book 1. However, for all their apparent difference, these characters are...strangely interchangable when they actually speak. These characters--with the exception of Maresa--all basically speak in the same way, and if you changed the names around during long stretches of dialogue, odds are the reader would not be able to tell the difference. It's rare that a character will say something that helps the reader actually learn more about them, rather than simply advance the plot. I have also wondered at times if Rich Baker simply had too many characters to juggle around--when you are writing a novel instead of playing a game, keeping track of such a large party probably isn't an easy task--one that I don't envy.
Maybe I should discuss the things about the book that I did like so far. Firstly, I really liked the prologue. Seeing the Srinshee was wonderful, and I actually think the prologue (unlike the "dungeon crawl" sections later to come) actually had some emotional impact on the reader. The prologue made me sad, even though it's a story I've heard before--good job with that. Also, even though I still feel that Ilsevele has that same "interchangable" quality to her--you could probably replace her with any other beautiful but capable elven lady with a streak of independance and nothing would be lost to the story--I really enjoyed her scenes so far. Her "goodbye" to Araevin actually meant something to me (unlike when she just tagged along with him), and her talking with Fflar was pretty sweet.
All right, that's all for now, we'll see how the rest of the novel shapes up...
--RF
|
| Lord Rad |
Posted - 18 Jun 2006 : 11:09:30
quote:
Originally posted by Arkhaedun
Its interesting that the Gatekeeper's Crystal, which has been around forever, actually ties into this current story, the Mythal we never knew about, and how it functions. And all this time we thought the main use of that thing was to screw up magical fields, not interface with them.
I'm hoping the drow and the Zhentarim play a big role in the resolution of this story, as the forshadowing in this section seems to portend.
My thoughts too. This book is riddled with so many exciting elements and I can't wait to see how they all pan out (I haven't had time to read any this weekend however  ).
I've always been a fan of Hellgate Keep and was quite happy when it first popped up in this trilogy. I'm learning quite a bit more than I expected about the Gatekeeper Crystal too.
Back to the Zhentarim element... as i've mentioend before, this is just my cup of tea  What an introduction! |
| Arkhaedun |
Posted - 18 Jun 2006 : 01:39:38
Just got the book a few days ago, and tore through the first to "sections" as defined here in the book club. I have to say that I really was compelled to keep reading it. At the risk of sounding cliche, I honestly couldn't put it down.
The flashback to Myth Drannor, Fflar, and the Shrinshee taking the Ruler's Blade away was a great tie in, especially to anyone that only knows that Myth Drannor is "that old elf city in ruins."
Its interesting that the Gatekeeper's Crystal, which has been around forever, actually ties into this current story, the Mythal we never knew about, and how it functions. And all this time we thought the main use of that thing was to screw up magical fields, not interface with them.
I'm hoping the drow and the Zhentarim play a big role in the resolution of this story, as the forshadowing in this section seems to portend. |
| Mkhaiwati |
Posted - 17 Jun 2006 : 19:55:49
quote:
And I actually feel like Araevin, Ilsevle, and Fflar are starting to really develop as characters.
I agree. The characters didn't really interest me very much in the first two books, and I feel that Richard Baker has done a better job of it in this last book. It is almost as if the first two books were just a large prologue and setting up for this last book.
I also like the way that the Zhentarim are worked into the story. In the other discussions, others may have thought that it was a distraction, but I also remember that in the discussions for other books (the Ruin for example) other people were desiring to see what affect the frenzy had on other parts of Faerun. In this case, we are seeing an outcome of the war on the Moonsea regions, to see that this is having a strong effect among the political forces in that region, not just who rules Myth Drannor.
I also like the pacing of the story and the amount of Realmslore that is worked in without just sorta being there just to be there. I feel that this could be his best book of the series.
Mkhaiwati |
| The Simbul |
Posted - 17 Jun 2006 : 17:41:49
I think it is nice that we've gone four chapters and the party cleric hasnt been killed or otherwise explained out of the story yet. I am still trying to remember just how many cleric companions Araevin has gone through... |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 16 Jun 2006 : 17:39:43
Actually, thinking about this, I liked the whole scene, because it actually gave us some insight into a religion based on tyranny, fear, and dominance. A lot of that scene wasn't just typical evil posturing, it was Tharxul, trying to press his importance subtly, which if Scyulla hadn't reacted, would have essentially given Tharxul a degree of dominance over Scyulla. Plus I liked the whole Scyulla calling for a cleric for Tharxul, since he is obviously useful, but had to be put in his place, for the glory of Bane and the preservation of her own status. |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 16 Jun 2006 : 17:30:00
Yes, Tharxul is definately a domesticated eye tyrant . . . |
| Lord Rad |
Posted - 16 Jun 2006 : 17:24:37
On to chapter 4.... perfect! I'm a huge fan of the Zhentarim and loved every bit of this section.
Scyllua's introduction was fantastic!! I can't believe what she did to Tharxul, and he just took it and submitted to her! 
She's just someone I love to hate  |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 16 Jun 2006 : 17:13:40
I have to say, I'm a sucker for the political tension of the region. For a long time we have known that Cormyr, the Moonsea powers, Sembia, and the Dales were all in a sort of tenuous peace, waiting for one or the other to weaken or make a misstep. With the damage to Cormyr, and the introduction of the Fey'ri and the Crusade into the mix, its good to see all of the hypothetical "what if" about he various factions turn into a reality.
Now, in the end, I don't want to see the Dales too radically altered, but I think its always good to see something happen, as long as it happens logically, rather than having stagnation. |
| Lord Rad |
Posted - 16 Jun 2006 : 17:11:38
The trek through the Nameless Dungeon was great. An excellent feel of the vastness and grand design of the place. The construct was pretty damn meaty too and loved how it described Donnor being hit across the room by lightning etc. I really for the feel of the power of this thing. And then to ear of the 88 alcoves of them too
Ophidians! Cool! I have loved this things since the old AD&D days and now they finally turn up  The remnants of the battle in the hall between the ophidians and fey'ri was quite eerie, and then the hall beyond where they were was great. The description of silence except for the "sound of the rasp of scales" sure put me on edge.
Clever idea of Marosa to put the shard in the pouch too to avoid that cartoon-style bobbing item being carried by an invisible person |
| Lord Rad |
Posted - 16 Jun 2006 : 17:07:18
quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
But now that the fast forward feeling of the second book is over, I feel like we have arrived at the real "point" of the trilogy. A lot of what I was worried about seems to be a non-issue now. The drow are starting to figure into the story, pretty much as I would expect them to. The Zhentarim are plotting behind the scenes in a manner that I like very much, and hopefully will pan out with them accomplishing something that might be a BIG coup for them. And I actually feel like Araevin, Ilsevle, and Fflar are starting to really develop as characters.
This part really grabbed me too. The drow appearance and Zhentarim focus suddenly opened it right up for me. I'm excited to see more developments on this side of the story |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 16 Jun 2006 : 08:18:06
Finally, I managed to find a copy of this, after burning my lunch break for about two weeks running out and checking Borders . . .
And it was worth it. If the rest of the book holds up with what started in this section, I have to say I will be pretty happy.
To be honest, between the spoiler in Power of Faerun, and reading some threads that I should have known better than to peek into, I started to think that I wouldn't like this book. I'll mark this down as a lesson in how context is VERY important outside of just raw facts.
I liked the first book of this trilogy, but the second book felt very rushed to me, so I was concerned with this one. The first book was fun and filled with action, but the characterisation was a bit lacking, but I chalked that up to a quick start to a LARGE series. The second book seemed so rushed that while I liked the overall plot, I felt like it was a 300 page outline of what could have been a trilogy in and of itself.
But now that the fast forward feeling of the second book is over, I feel like we have arrived at the real "point" of the trilogy. A lot of what I was worried about seems to be a non-issue now. The drow are starting to figure into the story, pretty much as I would expect them to. The Zhentarim are plotting behind the scenes in a manner that I like very much, and hopefully will pan out with them accomplishing something that might be a BIG coup for them. And I actually feel like Araevin, Ilsevle, and Fflar are starting to really develop as characters.
One question I did have is the idea of the Waymeet as a Mythal, in and of itself. It was mentioned as essentially a demi-plane, and it is said the ancient elven portals use it to traverse Toril. Am I right in seeing this as its own transitive plane for the purposes of any portal that accesses it? For example, if somehow an area were to be cut off from the normal transitive planes, a portal that uses the Waymeet would still function? |
| Hoondatha |
Posted - 16 Jun 2006 : 00:36:22
Eaerlann has always been in somewhat of a lore black hole, which is disappointing to me, since it was around for nearly 5000 years, and actually fell 150 years AFTER Myth Drannor (and the setting for a long-running campaign of mine). There are mentions of it in Cormanthyr's timeline, but nothing within the past thousand years. LEoF at least gives us the names of some cities and their locations in the the High Forest. There are also mentions of the Seven Citadels War in Hellgate Keep.
Overall, canon is conflicted about exactly how powerful Eaerlann actually was. One sourcebook (Netheril) simultaneously describes it as anemic and a magical powerhouse. For my own campaign, I made it a very militaristic nation, as I didn't see how it could have survived so long as a primary orc horde target otherwise, but that's all homebrew. There's just not much about Eaerlann, even less about Siluvanaede, and virtually nothing on Sharrven.
Edit: A better place for info is Cloak and Dagger, which takes everything from Hellgate Keep (often block copies) and expands it. There were at least five secret armories of Vyshaanti artifacts gathered together by the Dlardrageths, which they then hinted about to the nobles who followed them. After the Dlardrageths were imprisoned, those families went searching for them, hoping to turn the tide of battle (they were losing, badly). They found four of the five, but when they came out of the fifth they ran headlong into the Eaerlanni army. Those who weren't killed were imprisoned, along with everything Vyshaanti that couldn't be destroyed, and then the dungeon's name was never spoken of again (becoming the Nameless Dungeon). I'm not sure what the other two citadels were, or it could also have been a mistake, and Steven meant to say seven instead of five. Doesn't matter much. I highly recommend Cloak and Dagger, it laid the entire foundation for the Last Mythal. |
| Lord Rad |
Posted - 15 Jun 2006 : 22:21:10
Just finished chapter two and had to come on to say i've learnt quite a lot about the ancient elven lore from this chapter
The history lesson on Eaerlann, Siluvanede and Sharrven was excellent! Where can i read more on this?
Richard, what are the other six of the seven Citadels in addition to Nar Keryh, Kerm..the Nameless Dungeon? I'm quite excited to read more of this. |
| Lord Rad |
Posted - 15 Jun 2006 : 19:22:00
Highmoon eh?! Nice to visit an old location from nostalgic Realms fiction. Poor old Shandril.
Well this opening in the town and the Oak and Spear was great. A beautiful Dales feel and the kind of place i'd like to sit down for a few pints. Great job and painting an atmosphere here, Richard (if you're reading this).
Again it all comes flooding back to me as Araevin meets Maresa Rost (one of may fav. characters from the trilogy) and the companions. It's all come back together again and gives a good feeling of novel continuity which is the reason i'd like to read them all back to back).
The arrival (and departure) of Ilsevele was well done, and kinda sad... I wonder what her fate will be.
So far, great start. This has all the great elements which made me enjoy the first two books and I can't wait to delve in further |
| Lord Rad |
Posted - 15 Jun 2006 : 19:17:22
Finally got the novel
I've only read the prologue, chapter 1 and part of chapter 2, but wanted to post anyway....
Nice flashback to the time of Fflar in the prologue and had a good feel of the chaos at the time.
That good old familiar feeling came back when Araevin was introduced again in chapter one  The meeting with the high mages was very atmospheric and gave a nice refresh of the tale and laying out Sarya's plans etc. (Just reading this first chapter brought back a lot of scenes and memories from the first two books and i'm quite excited about reading the whole trilogy back to back again).
I see things haven't changed with the elven mages mistrust of Araevin either I liked how the Shadovar attack on Evereska was mentioned. It's little points like this and similar elements which I also recall from Farthest Reach which really make this feel like the Realms. They just ooze Realms-flavor
Good scene with Selveril (sp?) when he finds Adresin in the tower. Those vrock spores sound NASTY! EEk!
So now the plot is getting laid out with Araevin needing to seek the shards of the Gatekeeper Crystal. Excellent, i'm looking forward to this.
I liked how the Dalesman (sorry, i don't remember his name) refused to have anything to do with a collaboration with Sembia, based on their sitution with Battledale etc. Again, another nice Realms feel. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 14 Jun 2006 : 17:07:38
Here's the URL:- http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dnd/downloads
Also, see Fall of Myth Drannor, available freely at the URL above.
|
| Kuje |
Posted - 14 Jun 2006 : 17:00:43
quote:
Originally posted by Mace Hammerhand
The prologue is very intriguing in terms of the enmity between the noble houses of Myth Drannor and the general unrest...um...who is the Ssrinshee? I read the name several times but I'm still not sure who she is...
The gold/moon/un elf that took the Ruler's Blade after the Coronal and his daughter died. See Elminster in Myth Drannor. Cormanthyr: Empire of the Elves. Lost Empires of Faerun. Elminster in Hell, where she only has a small scene at the end. Tears So White in the Realms of the Elves anthology.
Cormanthyr is a free download on the wotc site. |
| Mace Hammerhand |
Posted - 14 Jun 2006 : 13:40:33
Well met,
just started reading it today, taking a break from Halls of Stormweather, and am barely into the first chapter.
The prologue is very intriguing in terms of the enmity between the noble houses of Myth Drannor and the general unrest...um...who is the Ssrinshee? I read the name several times but I'm still not sure who she is...
I've only read very little of ch 1 so far, but it seems to me that Evermeet's high mages are kinda scared of Aen(whatshisname)'s power. Their reasoning seems correct, but then again they do not truly know what they are dealing with...
need to read more |
| Hoondatha |
Posted - 14 Jun 2006 : 00:22:30
Huh. And here, for once, my local Borders has it in stock. Amazing. I'll finally get to participate in one of these debates.
I haven't read beyond chapter 4, but already I'm getting the feeling that this might be a book that should have been two books. It seems like an *awful* lot is going to have to happen to resolve even most things, and that's not even dealing with Araevin's new artifact-hunt. We'll have to see. |
| Aginor37 |
Posted - 11 Jun 2006 : 01:49:01
quote:
I would be rereading and reading this trilogy, if, you know, I could find the damn third book locally! It's not like I live overseas, USA stores should have this damn book but no!
I know that feeling, I had been checking all the local bookstores for a while with no luck at all. Finally scored a couple hours ago at a Books-A-Million in the next town over. Might be worth checking if you have one nearby.
Other than that, not much to say yet except the prologue was excellent and things seem to be moving along from where they left off without any interruption at all.
More to come later. |
| Kuje |
Posted - 11 Jun 2006 : 01:42:48
quote:
Originally posted by hammer of Moradin
Anyone else reading this one? I know many of you out there have read the other two books based on reactions, all good, to them in other posts.
I would be rereading and reading this trilogy, if, you know, I could find the damn third book locally! It's not like I live overseas, USA stores should have this damn book but no!
Am I ranting, yes, a bit. :) |
| hammer of Moradin |
Posted - 11 Jun 2006 : 01:19:40
Interesting reading on the mythals, and the Nexus. Won't spoil it yet, but it does have another, sinister, purpose.
This is a great continuation of the story, just like it never ended. I see romance brewing between two unexpected characters. I'll escort her indeed!
Anyone else reading this one? I know many of you out there have read the other two books based on reactions, all good, to them in other posts. |
| Alaundo |
Posted - 03 Jun 2006 : 22:55:35
Well met
Although I like to see activity in the book club threads, could we please leave this area for discussions of the prologue and chapters 1 - 4 of the novel, rather than availability. Thank ye |
| dannyfu |
Posted - 03 Jun 2006 : 21:41:26
that's awesome Hammer, but i thought this book didn't come out until the 13th of june. i hope it is this coming wednesday instead! |
| hammer of Moradin |
Posted - 03 Jun 2006 : 15:51:15
quote:
Originally posted by dannyfu
I've been waiting for what seems like forever for this book to come out.I can't wait to read it. I am posting now to vent my anger at the fact that wizards is barely promoting this book on their website. that dragon book which spans the wizards "universes" is the only book with a spotlight on it. this book represents a realms changing event and i can't believe it's not getting more recognition
I usually know what is coming out when, especially working in a book store, but did not even realize this was out! I will be here for this one as I've read and loved the series so far. Should have it by Wednesday, along with another Realms goodie due out. |
| dannyfu |
Posted - 02 Jun 2006 : 18:07:07
I've been waiting for what seems like forever for this book to come out.I can't wait to read it. I am posting now to vent my anger at the fact that wizards is barely promoting this book on their website. that dragon book which spans the wizards "universes" is the only book with a spotlight on it. this book represents a realms changing event and i can't believe it's not getting more recognition |
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