| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Alaundo |
Posted - 30 Oct 2005 : 15:40:21
Well met
This is a Book Club thread for Midnight's Mask. Please discuss Chapters 8 - 11 herein: |
| 25 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Jhoebryn |
Posted - 11 May 2006 : 16:29:21
As noted above, we are pretty sure at this point that Vhostym's plans are very close to fruition, but we don't really know what he is trying to do. What is the Crown of Flame and why does he want it? I actually find this makes the story much more interesting (one further unknown)...
Vhostym's assault on the tower was simply awesome! His very strategic approach to wiping out the tower required a great deal of preparation and thought. It shows him to be quite meticulous in what he does, very patient in his execution, and yet so very powerful. A great scene! Kostikus was a perfect addition - brutal yet funny (if that is at all possible)...
Also, the fact that Cale does have limits to his powers makes them yet more "believable", in that he is not omnipotent. The scene when he moves the ship actually gives us a good feel for how his powers work and his limits.
I agree it is good to see the halfling helping out and showing substantial powers himself (elementals are always fun to see in action)!
Cale's struggle with Mask is quite well written. How easy it would be to just give in and let the shadows take the slaadi (and the rest of the ship). To hold himself back and not fully embrace his "powers" shows his strength of character and will.
|
| PaulSKemp |
Posted - 05 Feb 2006 : 18:35:38
quote:
Originally posted by Lameth
Vhostym is so very powerful and the Crown of flame must be so great in power, I wonder what it will be.
What can be so powerful that Vhostym will kill thousands/millions of people to get it? *brrrrr*
*He glanced skyward, to the stars, to Selune, to her tears. He already knew which of them he would use.*
Use?! A tear of Selune!?
I shivered at that part of the story. What is Vhostym up to? I`ll be prepared for the worst. 
I'll be interested in hearing your thoughts as things unfold further, Lameth.
Paul |
| Lameth |
Posted - 04 Feb 2006 : 21:13:08
Vhostym is so very powerful and the Crown of flame must be so great in power, I wonder what it will be.
What can be so powerful that Vhostym will kill thousands/millions of people to get it? *brrrrr*
*He glanced skyward, to the stars, to Selune, to her tears. He already knew which of them he would use.*
Use?! A tear of Selune!?
I shivered at that part of the story. What is Vhostym up to? I`ll be prepared for the worst. |
| scererar |
Posted - 18 Dec 2005 : 01:27:35
Mr. Kemp, I started a thread on the FR novels section, about my last post here and your response to it, pertaining to Olna the High Priestess of Cyric. I would be very interested in your thoughts on the subject.
|
| PaulSKemp |
Posted - 17 Dec 2005 : 15:02:36
quote:
Originally posted by scererar
I almost felt sorry for the priestess of cyric, in her last moments on toril, when she felt confident that she would die with her gods favor. When Vhostym brought the sphere to within killing distance and her fear of death came with an almost understanding of oblivion, it did not matter which god she worshipped, she knew she was done. I started to think that this priestess had a bigger role in the book and I felt kind of drawn to her story (any way to flesh this character out Paul, prior to her death).
Scererar,
No one else has mentioned Olna (the priestess of Cyric) before and you have an interesting response to her. Thanks.
Paul |
| scererar |
Posted - 17 Dec 2005 : 04:44:35
I agree Kejr, this book really, in my opinion, gets into the nothing is as black and white as society thinks. Vhostym and Riven both have a soft spot and "good" natures, when it comes to something they hold dear. With Riven and his "girls" the dogs he takes in and continues to have his room rented with food provided, even upon pain of death to the propriator. Then with Vhostym and the Slaadi, he said something to the effect about his "children" and their never ending need to improve, or further themselves as slaad. I got the feeling that he would advance their transformation to death Slaad, but only if they did not fail him, and at this point in the book he is thinking everything is going well. it almost seemed as if he cared about their happiness, but I think if they fail it won't happen. I don't get the impression that "love" or caring for, is unconditional with Vhostym. |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 17 Dec 2005 : 04:19:49
All I can say is Paul is a talented man if he can make a cleric of Cyric sympathetic, if only for a few seconds.
Vhostym is certainly a force of nature, though it is interesting to contrast this "I am above it all, everyone else is insects, I can do what I want when I want to because no one can stop me," attitude with his paternal feelings for his "children." I guess these two examples show us that no one is 100% evil . . . though I bet Vhostym comes it at 99.999999999999999999999999999999%, being a bit generous. |
| scererar |
Posted - 17 Dec 2005 : 03:51:00
these chapters really start to pick things up. I feel that Cale is having to make some serious choices and I am not so sure the choice is his to make. His transformation into ( I guess more of a shade) seems to take a twist, once they come back out of the Plane of Shadow. I think if it was not for jak's "good" tendancies, Cale would be wholly consumed by Mask's temptations. What's with Vhostym, it looks like he has almost completed whatever his grand quest is. Reading the part in the book about the millions of people he has killed and the many worlds laid waste by this being, over thousands of years of "life", makes me to want to know what and who he is. I almost felt sorry for the priestess of cyric, in her last moments on toril, when she felt confident that she would die with her gods favor. When Vhostym brought the sphere to within killing distance and her fear of death came with an almost understanding of oblivion, it did not matter which god she worshipped, she knew she was done. I started to think that this priestess had a bigger role in the book and I felt kind of drawn to her story (any way to flesh this character out Paul, prior to her death). I really liked Jak's abilities being shown more, his level of control and "level of experience" start to show through here, when he was able to summon the water elementals to put out the fires on the ship and then propel them through the sea. I look forward to any additional comments and the conclusion of this great, in my opinion, trilogy. |
| Malarick |
Posted - 11 Nov 2005 : 11:33:08
quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
I was glad to see Jak getting to weild some more formidable priestly powers.
I was thinking this also. Jak has come a LONG way since events in Shadows Witness. I guess the events in that novel really changed him, and made him a LOT stronger. |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 11 Nov 2005 : 01:15:50
I really like the pacing in this series. We are well into the thrid book of the series, and we still really don't know the specifics fo Vhostym's plan, yet we have a definate sense that he has nearly completed his goal. The other point that I would make about pacing is that Cale and company have also seemed to make headway, without doing too much damage to Vhostym's overall plan. Cale and his friends have managed to find out where Vhostym's agents are going, but not what they are doing, but not why, and they have eliminated two of his "children" as well. Progress all around, but we still have enough tension to keep everything interesting and moving forward.
I wonder how human Cale would remain if Jak wasn't around to keep him "human." I get the distinct feeling that Mask is waiting on a time when Jak isn't around to temp Cale into doing something major. Cale has a lot of pent up frustration and anger, and it seems like during the shadow incident he was pretty close to the edge of just cutting loose on anyone in his way.
I like how Paul has handled godly intervention in this series. It has been subtle (well, okay, a pact of shadows isn't that subtle) compared to other series and their godly interventions, but you can see Mask's fingerprints on various events.
Vhostym's internal monologue when he is preparing the tower is interesting, as it not only gives us insight into Vhostym, but I think, also foreshadow what Cale could become if he gives in to too many temptations, and ebraces Mask's gifts too much. The thing that really got me to thinking about this was when Vhostym used Sephris' favorite pronouncement . . . two and two is four. Vhostym is not sadistic or even overly arrogant. He knows what he is capable of and what he wants to accomplish, and he will do anything to find the path of least resistance while proceeding toward that goal, very much as I would picture Cale if he fell completely. For a moment I almost thought that Vhostym might have a "softer" side when reading about his desire to evolve his sons, until I thought about it. I don't think its affection, so much as whim. Especially considering that he didn't seem overly phased when his other "children" fell to Cale and his friends.
I was glad to see Jak getting to weild some more formidable priestly powers. Its nice to see that a halfling can be portrayed enjoyably, like a halfling "should" be, but also with a good deal of power. Maybe I just read too many older "edition" novels, but it seems like with the exception of elves other races are often downplayed when it comes to divine or arcane might. |
| PaulSKemp |
Posted - 10 Nov 2005 : 17:00:45
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Rad
Paul, is Kostikus a particular species of devil (other than ice devil i mean). Does his type go by any other name from planar creature books?
Rad,
As you observed, Kostikus is an Ice Devil, and Ice Devils are also called Gelugons.
Paul |
| PaulSKemp |
Posted - 10 Nov 2005 : 13:58:41
quote:
Originally posted by Ashork
Celebrant: I believe that following are all the Slaad type. From Weakest to Strongest...Red, Blue, Green, Grey and Death. (Taken from the Planescape Source Book, Planes of Chaos...So it might be different in FR)
ashork
CM,
Ashork has the right of it. Also, I believe the Manual of the Planes (or maybe the Fiend Folio?) introduced a white slaad and one other type of slaad, both of which were higher on the slaad evolutionary ladder than death slaadi. |
| Ashork |
Posted - 10 Nov 2005 : 13:57:20
Celebrant: I believe that following are all the Slaad type. From Weakest to Strongest...Red, Blue, Green, Grey and Death. (Taken from the Planescape Source Book, Planes of Chaos...So it might be different in FR)
ashork |
| Beezy |
Posted - 10 Nov 2005 : 13:13:44
I think Vhostyn was so ill and wrecked because he was something like a millenia old. I think it was just old age had destroyed his body almost completely. He could barely move his body and it caused him great pain to even lift his arms fairly high. Throughout the novel you see him always levitating and using his mental powers to do things so as not to have to move his body and cause himself pain. |
| Celebrant Moonflower |
Posted - 10 Nov 2005 : 07:58:37
Chapter 11
 The sights and sounds from the storm were very eerie. The stuff that nightmares are made from. Very well done. Then the calmness... spooky!
Mr Kemp, Vhostyn mentions the transition through the slaad (green to grey and then to "death"). Is that the full path of the slaad race? What are the specifics of each type? Is this listed anywhere in any accessory book?
Oh, and what IS wrong with Vhostyn? Why is he so ill and wrecked? |
| Celebrant Moonflower |
Posted - 10 Nov 2005 : 07:52:40
quote:
Originally posted by Beezy
I also felt that when Cale took the ship through the Plane of Shadow that it was very affective at showing the price Cale is paying for Mask's "gift". Everytime Cale's powers grow it seems he pays a price and does not even recognize what is happening to him. He is becomign less human and less humane and basically has to rely on Jak to keep his actions and inhibitions inline.
Vhostyn summoning the demon without wards or a summoning circle or anything showed his immense power. The demon did not even attempt to attack him or even deny his request, that was a very powerful display of his power.
My thoughts exactly, Beezy  I think without Jak there, Cale would have succumbed to the power and the shadow. I see a definate difference in Cale the more the book goes on. |
| Beezy |
Posted - 10 Nov 2005 : 03:27:18
I also felt that when Cale took the ship through the Plane of Shadow that it was very affective at showing the price Cale is paying for Mask's "gift". Everytime Cale's powers grow it seems he pays a price and does not even recognize what is happening to him. He is becomign less human and less humane and basically has to rely on Jak to keep his actions and inhibitions inline.
Vhostyn summoning the demon without wards or a summoning circle or anything showed his immense power. The demon did not even attempt to attack him or even deny his request, that was a very powerful display of his power. |
| Lord Rad |
Posted - 10 Nov 2005 : 00:21:05
quote:
Originally posted by Malarick
Fantastic writing in this section. In fact fantastic throughout!
This has to be the all time best FR trilogy I have ever read!
And I still have about 100 pages to go!
Well i'll second that! 
That's right. I'm at roughly the same point. They're just about to go under the waves by the looks of things and to the ultimate destination of the story (I assume). With 100 pages or so still to go, I can't imagine what a rollercoaster ride it's going to be and where it's all going to go  |
| Malarick |
Posted - 10 Nov 2005 : 00:15:37
quote:
Originally posted by Celebrant Moonflower
Wow that Vhostyn is really kicking some butt! The part of this chapter where is "clears out" the tower is amazing.
Aye, I was totally immersed in the novel at this point and could not stop reading.
I enjoyed how we had the introduction to Vhostym, and then it came back to him later where he is in full on action mode!
Fantastic writing in this section. In fact fantastic throughout!
This has to be the all time best FR trilogy I have ever read!
And I still have about 100 pages to go! |
| Lord Rad |
Posted - 10 Nov 2005 : 00:07:32
Oh and another chuckle was where Vhostyn was killing everything in his path and Vhostyn saw a couple of guards "trying and failing to escape through an arrow slit". HAHAHAHAHHHAH  I can just picture it! |
| Lord Rad |
Posted - 10 Nov 2005 : 00:04:48
quote:
Originally posted by Celebrant Moonflower
Wow that Vhostyn is really kicking some butt! The part of this chapter where is "clears out" the tower is amazing. He is SO powerful and takes it all in his stride. I noticed a couple of high powered spells from the Players Handbook being used here (and the next chapter), which was a nice touch.
He sure did!! Vhostyn really comes across here as been completely different to his sons. There was no stopping him.
Kostikus was great too. I had a fantastic mental image of him heading down that corridor slaying the guards. This also showed how powerful Vhostyn is, for a devil to be summoned, fear him and obey straight away. Normally summoned demons\devils just give you lip and backchat (well they do me, anyway  )
Paul, is Kostikus a particular species of devil (other than ice devil i mean). Does his type go by any other name from planar creature books? |
| Celebrant Moonflower |
Posted - 09 Nov 2005 : 20:44:59
Chapter 9
I liked the quick trip into the plane of shadows in this chapter. The shadows circling overhead were very nice (well not "nice", par se  ). I felt that this chapter really showed that Cale is beginning to loose control. He is so much more powerful now, but his reasoning is suffering a little. Does anyone else feel that also? Maybe it's just me
On other scene to strengthen my point, is where Cale wants to send the shadows to the Dolphin and kill all on board. Jak has to halt Cale and explain to him about how wrong it is, due to the innocent crew onboard.
It's these little things that really seal this story for me 
Wow that Vhostyn is really kicking some butt! The part of this chapter where is "clears out" the tower is amazing. He is SO powerful and takes it all in his stride. I noticed a couple of high powered spells from the Players Handbook being used here (and the next chapter), which was a nice touch.
Chapter 10
I loved this chapter. The whole of the sea traveling part was just what I like. I was surprised that the crew threw offerings to Talos though, rather than Umberlee. Although, if I were on deck, i'd probably through as many coins over as i could at both gods Is that the norm for offerings to be made to Talos in a storm, rather than the Bitch Queen?
A couple of other humorous points in this chapter again:
When there appears to be trouble on the ship and Azriim mentions the posibility of a mutiny - Riven says "just kill a few and the rest will fall back into line" LOL!
Another one is when Dolgan says, refering to the Captain on how to get the crew to follow orders and obey (i think), "I can just eat him and take his form".
|
| Celebrant Moonflower |
Posted - 09 Nov 2005 : 20:30:46
quote:
Originally posted by PaulSKemp
CM,
The Towers of the Eternal Eclipse are part of Realmslore and I believe the most recent write up of the towers is in "Lords of Darkness," which I referenced when writing these chapters.
Paul
Thank you. Typical, this is the only Forgotten Realms sourcebook i don't have I will try to find a copy online though after reading about them in your book.
|
| PaulSKemp |
Posted - 09 Nov 2005 : 14:40:32
quote:
Originally posted by Celebrant Moonflower
Looks like i'm first into this part.
Chapter 8
A liked the start to this chapter - some good background and history of Vhostyn and the Towers of the Eternal Eclipse (nice name). What on earth is he up to though
Mr Kemp, are these towers detailed anywhere in any products or are they your own creation?
CM,
The Towers of the Eternal Eclipse are part of Realmslore and I believe the most recent write up of the towers is in "Lords of Darkness," which I used as a reference when writing these chapters.
Paul |
| Celebrant Moonflower |
Posted - 08 Nov 2005 : 23:22:54
Looks like i'm first into this part.
Chapter 8
A liked the start to this chapter - some good background and history of Vhostyn and the Towers of the Eternal Eclipse (nice name). What on earth is he up to though
Mr Kemp, are these towers detailed anywhere in any products or are they your own creation?
I liked the scene on the boat with the slaves\crew and Cale. I smiled at the point where Gorse spoke his concerns to the captain, in Chondathan and Cale replied that he knows 9 languages and stated that he once killed for coin, serves Mask, and is more shadow than man. LOL. The look on the crews faces
|
|
|
