| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| The Sage |
Posted - 07 Feb 2009 : 13:22:06
Well met
This is a Book Club thread for Unholy (Book 3 of The Haunted Lands), by Richard Lee Byers. Please discuss chapters 13 - 16 the epilogue herein. |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Dennis |
Posted - 06 Dec 2012 : 06:39:27
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Hah! You forgot about that plant that made him quite an idiot. Literally.
But why should Wynter be faulted for that?
What, now?! Should I blame Jean Rabe instead?
Seriously, though, it hardly matters how he became an idiot---born as, or made to. What matters is that for most of the time he 'regaled' the world with his ungulate presence in Red Magic, he WAS a total dimwit. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 06 Dec 2012 : 06:27:18
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Well, Rabe expanded on Tam somewhat with the short story "Red Ambition" in the Realms of Magic anothology. [And later reprinted in Book I of The Best of the Realms.]
Yes, and I liked that story. But compared to a novel, a short story is...well, short. While said piece of fiction did indeed flesh out Tam somewhat, revealing facets of his personality very few in and out of his circle know, it's still nothing compared to how Richard did his magic on Tam. But of course, he had a trilogy to work on. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 06 Dec 2012 : 04:15:39
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Thauranil
I haven't read that one but its that does not sound very ideal to be sure.
I've not read it in a long time, myself (prolly 10 or 15 years!), but when I last read it, I did not have the issues with it that Dennis had. I rather enjoyed it, myself.
My issues are with the Harpers. A doddering idiot with hooves, a vain sorceress who hadn't learn the value of shutting her mouth up, and an immensely irritating love-struck yokel. Buuuuut, as I mentioned above, for the most part, I rather enjoyed the book, too.
Why is Wynter a "doddering idiot with hooves?" I rather like the fact that he accomplished some of his Harper-objectives without resorting to the usual lot of violence.
Hah! You forgot about that plant that made him quite an idiot. Literally.
But why should Wynter be faulted for that? |
| The Sage |
Posted - 06 Dec 2012 : 04:14:40
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
I suppose Jean Rabe could have fleshed him out more and well, too, given the chance. As she had to focus on Maligor instead, have Szass Tam work behind the scenes, feature a bunch of irritating Harpers, and had to squeeze them all in just one 300-something book, the result is not as ideal...
Szass was a secondary character. To expect Rabe to fully flesh him out for her story, is a little unusual.
Well, I did say given the chance, right?! Szass Tam would have been given equal novel time as Maligor if said novel were longer (or if it branched out into its own self-contained series/trilogy, like Spellfire, which was originally a Harper novel turned Shandril Saga), and if the idiotic Harpers were working on the background than in plain sight.
Well, Rabe expanded on Tam somewhat with the short story "Red Ambition" in the Realms of Magic anothology. [And later reprinted in Book I of The Best of the Realms.] |
| Dennis |
Posted - 06 Dec 2012 : 02:35:16
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Thauranil
I haven't read that one but its that does not sound very ideal to be sure.
I've not read it in a long time, myself (prolly 10 or 15 years!), but when I last read it, I did not have the issues with it that Dennis had. I rather enjoyed it, myself.
My issues are with the Harpers. A doddering idiot with hooves, a vain sorceress who hadn't learn the value of shutting her mouth up, and an immensely irritating love-struck yokel. Buuuuut, as I mentioned above, for the most part, I rather enjoyed the book, too.
Why is Wynter a "doddering idiot with hooves?" I rather like the fact that he accomplished some of his Harper-objectives without resorting to the usual lot of violence.
Hah! You forgot about that plant that made him quite an idiot. Literally. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 06 Dec 2012 : 02:32:12
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
I suppose Jean Rabe could have fleshed him out more and well, too, given the chance. As she had to focus on Maligor instead, have Szass Tam work behind the scenes, feature a bunch of irritating Harpers, and had to squeeze them all in just one 300-something book, the result is not as ideal...
Szass was a secondary character. To expect Rabe to fully flesh him out for her story, is a little unusual.
Well, I did say given the chance, right?! Szass Tam would have been given equal novel time as Maligor if said novel were longer (or if it branched out into its own self-contained series/trilogy, like Spellfire, which was originally a Harper novel turned Shandril Saga), and if the idiotic Harpers were working on the background than in plain sight. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 06 Dec 2012 : 02:03:14
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Thauranil
I haven't read that one but its that does not sound very ideal to be sure.
I've not read it in a long time, myself (prolly 10 or 15 years!), but when I last read it, I did not have the issues with it that Dennis had. I rather enjoyed it, myself.
My issues are with the Harpers. A doddering idiot with hooves, a vain sorceress who hadn't learn the value of shutting her mouth up, and an immensely irritating love-struck yokel. Buuuuut, as I mentioned above, for the most part, I rather enjoyed the book, too.
Why is Wynter a "doddering idiot with hooves?" I rather like the fact that he accomplished some of his Harper-objectives without resorting to the usual lot of violence. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 06 Dec 2012 : 01:58:40
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
I suppose Jean Rabe could have fleshed him out more and well, too, given the chance. As she had to focus on Maligor instead, have Szass Tam work behind the scenes, feature a bunch of irritating Harpers, and had to squeeze them all in just one 300-something book, the result is not as ideal...
Szass was a secondary character. To expect Rabe to fully flesh him out for her story, is a little unusual.
|
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 05 Dec 2012 : 22:55:01
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Thauranil
I haven't read that one but its that does not sound very ideal to be sure.
I've not read it in a long time, myself (prolly 10 or 15 years!), but when I last read it, I did not have the issues with it that Dennis had. I rather enjoyed it, myself.
My issues are with the Harpers. A doddering idiot with hooves, a vain sorceress who hadn't learn the value of shutting her mouth up, and an immensely irritating love-struck yokel. Buuuuut, as I mentioned above, for the most part, I rather enjoyed the book, too.
I did not feel the same way about those characters... But I don't think you and I agree oft on things like that. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 05 Dec 2012 : 22:23:40
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Thauranil
I haven't read that one but its that does not sound very ideal to be sure.
I've not read it in a long time, myself (prolly 10 or 15 years!), but when I last read it, I did not have the issues with it that Dennis had. I rather enjoyed it, myself.
My issues are with the Harpers. A doddering idiot with hooves, a vain sorceress who hadn't learn the value of shutting her mouth up, and an immensely irritating love-struck yokel. Buuuuut, as I mentioned above, for the most part, I rather enjoyed the book, too. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 05 Dec 2012 : 22:20:23
quote:
Originally posted by Thauranil
I haven't read that one but its that does not sound very ideal to be sure.
Ironically, despite my many issues with it, it's one of the few FR novels that I re-read almost every other year. Rabe captured the feel of Thay, and understood the workings of the realm's politics. AND most importantly, he treated Maligor so well---a 'classic' villain in 3D---except during the last part. [Maligor's treatment to a certain elf is a bonus. If you know how I feel about FR elves, you should know why. ] |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 05 Dec 2012 : 16:56:57
quote:
Originally posted by Thauranil
I haven't read that one but its that does not sound very ideal to be sure.
I've not read it in a long time, myself (prolly 10 or 15 years!), but when I last read it, I did not have the issues with it that Dennis had. I rather enjoyed it, myself. |
| Thauranil |
Posted - 05 Dec 2012 : 11:32:29
I haven't read that one but its that does not sound very ideal to be sure. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 04 Dec 2012 : 01:30:45
I suppose Jean Rabe could have fleshed him out more and well, too, given the chance. As she had to focus on Maligor instead, have Szass Tam work behind the scenes, feature a bunch of irritating Harpers, and had to squeeze them all in just one 300-something book, the result is not as ideal... |
| Thauranil |
Posted - 03 Dec 2012 : 13:25:05
Yeah, I just barely knew his name and that was just as the undead Zulkir. Not the world destroying villain he has become today. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 02 Dec 2012 : 19:44:43
Agreed. Szass Tam was never truly fleshed out until Richard came along. |
| Neo2151 |
Posted - 02 Dec 2012 : 11:37:59
Not my favorite Realms novels, but not the worst I've read either. (The good guys in this one just didn't do it for me. Too much D&D in my "D&D Fantasy" these days I think, which is totally unavoidable and totally a personal problem. :P )
I do feel the need to say I think you may be my favorite realms author when it comes to a villain though. The way you portrayed Tam was a breath of fresh air. In a literary world full of mustache-twirling villains, yours actually have personality and, dare I say it, can come off as likable!
|
| Dennis |
Posted - 26 Jun 2011 : 02:14:39
quote:
Originally posted by Iandyan
Loved the trilogy!
One of my favorite parts, like many others who have posted, is the fact that some of the Zulkirs may still live.
I can totally picture Nevron trying to work his way up the hierarchy in the abyss while desperately trying to avoid some of the more powerful demons (the balor, the huge water one from Undead which name i cant remember, etc.) who may be pissed due to previous servitude.
Agreed. Who knows, considering that among all the Zulkirs, he's the one that harbored the greatest animosity towards Szass Tam, he'd also be the one to lead the rise of the New Zulkirate. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 25 Jun 2011 : 15:45:53
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lee Byers
Glad you enjoyed it.
I don't yet have my hands on any of the three new books I'm eager to read (the Martin book you mentioned, Max Allan Collins's new Nate Heller novel, and Jim Butcher's new Dresden book), so at the moment, I am indeed hard at work.
Eager to read that Dresden book when it comes out, myself. The first two chapters, at least, are online. And I just got done reading all of the books and short stories, in order, to be ready for this one.
I still have to catch-up on the last two "Dresden Files" releases... but I'm going to look into those two chapters of the new book as well.  |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 25 Jun 2011 : 14:57:40
quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lee Byers
Glad you enjoyed it.
I don't yet have my hands on any of the three new books I'm eager to read (the Martin book you mentioned, Max Allan Collins's new Nate Heller novel, and Jim Butcher's new Dresden book), so at the moment, I am indeed hard at work.
Eager to read that Dresden book when it comes out, myself. The first two chapters, at least, are online. And I just got done reading all of the books and short stories, in order, to be ready for this one. |
| Richard Lee Byers |
Posted - 25 Jun 2011 : 14:31:15
Glad you enjoyed it.
I don't yet have my hands on any of the three new books I'm eager to read (the Martin book you mentioned, Max Allan Collins's new Nate Heller novel, and Jim Butcher's new Dresden book), so at the moment, I am indeed hard at work. |
| Iandyan |
Posted - 25 Jun 2011 : 03:21:18
Loved the trilogy!
One of my favorite parts, like many others who have posted, is the fact that some of the Zulkirs may still live.
I can totally picture Nevron trying to work his way up the hierarchy in the abyss while desperately trying to avoid some of the more powerful demons (the balor, the huge water one from Undead which name i cant remember, etc.) who may be pissed due to previous servitude.
Another thing I really liked was when Mirror became his former self and remembered a not-so-righteous past which may have caused him to turn into a ghost instead of his soul going straight to his god after he died at the hands of the ancient wizard.
The 100 year jump was definitely interesting. Especially due to Salvatore writing a trilogy in the middle of that span which includes some characters from this trilogy (Sylora Sam, Szass Tam being the ones ive seen so far). Course that doesnt guarantee their survival in the other trilogy due to being undead and all but i guess that's a topic for another post.
Anyways I'm continuing to enjoy the current Brotherhood of the Griffon series so please keep up the good work if you can tear away from A Dance with Dragons! |
| Dennis |
Posted - 13 Apr 2011 : 08:45:15
I first found Mirror a 2D character. But as the story progressed, I saw more details of his personality that passed him as well-fleshed out as his companions. |
| Richard Lee Byers |
Posted - 22 Feb 2011 : 18:19:17
Mirror served the god of the sun. What makes this tricky, of course, is that in the Forgotten Realms, the sun god goes through different incarnations. To know the specifics of Mirror's faith, we would have to know which incarnation of the sun god was active during the age in which his ancient culture existed. And since we know almost nothing about his culture, we don't have that information. |
| nytstyck |
Posted - 22 Feb 2011 : 06:13:48
Hi Richard,
Did you decide on which God it was that Mirror worshipped? And if so, did you leave any clues in the books that would help us guess. |
| Richard Lee Byers |
Posted - 22 Feb 2011 : 03:51:11
Glad you liked it, nytstyck. My thought was that Szass Tam did indeed deliberately turn Nevron into a mane. |
| nytstyck |
Posted - 22 Feb 2011 : 03:09:12
Just finished the trilogy. Heart still pumping from that finish. Bareris and Mirror both got great, suitable deaths. I liked the irony of Nevron becoming a mane. Was that something Szass Tam caused or were we just getting a reflection of his fate in the abyss? While i will miss many of the main characters that died i think they all got appropriate deaths. I hope Mirror is happy at the right hand side of Torm?
Malark was definitely my favourite villain of the series. That final fight i could only picture him as Jet Li.
Looking forward to the Brotherhood of the Griffon book. Aoth must be a very powerful warmage by now.
|
| Dennis |
Posted - 12 Jan 2011 : 19:21:32
quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lee Byers
Hi, Elsenrail, Simbul, and all.
I'm not sure i'd call the new trilogy an RSE, but it does deal with big events in at least one portion of the Realms.
If I'm not mistaken, majority of the readers call it an RSE. As do I. In this trilogy, the "R" in RSE could simply mean Realm, instead of Realms. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 12 Jan 2011 : 19:17:15
quote:
Originally posted by The Simbul
With regard to Lallara, Lauzoril, and Nevron...
...I truly loved the fact that the reader does not actually see them die. This narrowed focus on the narrative point of view--regardless if it was intentional or otherwise--serves to keep the door open for Dungeon Masters and future authors to bring them back into their stories if they so choose.
While I have many positive and critical reactions to this series as a whole, I must say the above was most certainly a worthy positive.
Agreed. I'd like to think them alive. |
| Richard Lee Byers |
Posted - 21 Apr 2010 : 17:56:46
Glad you liked it, Dennis. |
|
|
