| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| The Sage |
Posted - 31 Mar 2006 : 16:22:17
I'm still not sure about this tome myself... but a poster over at EN World received his copy yesterday.
Here's the majority of his review -
quote:
Originally posted by EyeontheMountain at EN World
Overall, one comment: Flavor. Even if you have whole party full of psions(with multiples of the same new base classes) they will all seem very different. Saying 'I'm an ARdent' for example, will give you little idea of their powers. Nice
New Classes
The ardent: Kind of like a Divine Champion with more than 1 domain(called Mantles). The ardent starts with two mantles, get as third at 2nd level and then another at 5th 10th and 15th. A bit of a special ability with each 'domain'. 2/3 the number of powers of a psion but jsut as many power points. Also a medium BAB. Looks pretty good. Lot of differnt flavors for this class, for sure.
*
The Divine Mind: Not many powers to choose from and none till 5th level in any case, the big power is the divine aura. This can give bonueses to attack, AC and perception (initiative, spot, listen) They choose a diety (list provided for PHB, FR, Eberron and XPHB dieties) and get mantles likethe Ardent, but instead of a special ability, they get a new aura power for the domain they choose. You can manifest one aura at a time (2 at 10th and 3 at 20th) and it tkaes an hour to change it. Also the radius varies form 5' at 1st to 50 feet at 19th.You can also switch auras faster at higher levels (including a swift action at 18th) Very nice versatility.
The Lurk is a lot odder though. Medium BAB and good fort/will saves, it looks like a cleric (same as the Divine Mind) and has powers on par with a psychic warrior. Instead of feats he gets the 'Lurk's augment' instead, allowing attacks a variety of special abilities (extra sneak attack, ghost touch, aligned attack) and such including sneak attacks that affect undead nd constructs. Teh list is level dependent so each lurk is a lot like another (unlike the Argent and DDivine Mind) The lurk also gets some rogue abilities (sneak attack, evasion and slippery mind) though at later levels.
Prestige classes:
Well, full caster progressions are not here. Unfortunatley. Only one, in fact. But using a four page format, there are not a lot. Maybe you like the extended descriptions but I hate them. A lot.
Anarchite Initiate: Full progression(ten levels), must be chaotic, easy entry, a solid class.
Ebon Saint: 4/5 progression, 5 level class. for rogues/psion (or Lurks especially) Stab someone and alter self into them. Kinda cool, but no word on if changing types is fine.
Ectopic Adept 4/5 progression (Not first level, same as Saint above) Very similar to the Constructor class from Mind's eye, but shorter and (maybe) sweeter.
Flayerspawn Psychic Become a Mind flayer (at least menatally) over 10 levels 6/10 manifester improvement
Illumine Soul (For Soulknives) Basically add positive enrgy to your powers. Nice additions. No manifesting increase. 5 levels
Soulbow (Guess who this is for?) Yep, Soulknives. Nice change of knives for bows. (Well arrows shot like a bow, but no visual of a bow. Close combat shot and phase arrow add on nicely. Cool class.
Storm Disciple 3/5 manifesting. Some minor electricity powers and resistences. Not too impressive.
Zerth Cenobite. Own power progression, and a monk/-styled class. Most special abilities are time-related and could be nice. But I hate monks, so I'm not too impressed.
Feats
Many many many. Too many tyo list, some for psionic creatures (XPHB, Illithiads, and such) Nice stuff. Really nice stuff. Did I mention 15 paes of feats? I should have
Powers
Lurk power list Very similar tothe Psychic warrior's list.
Mantles 30 of them (With an Ardent getting ony 5(without feats) lots of variety.
Reprinted and augmented Psion (including subtypes) and Psychic warrior lists THANK YOU WOTC
THANK YOU WOTC
25 pages of powers (not looked over yet)
Psionic/Magic itmes
10 pages. Some nice stuff
Psionic Locations as Treasure: Some good ideas, only 3 pages
Psionic Monsters: Some, didn't look through yet.
Psionic Racial substitution: Basically for for LA +1 or higher races in the XPHB. Not too exciting. Kinda a waste of space.
And finally,
Varient Psion: The Erudite: Well, I never saw the first one, but I know a lot of people thought this was overpowered. I wil not comment, maybe someone else will. They can still learn every power inthe book eventually with little effort (jsut meditating 8 hours on each)
The limit on manifesting unique powers is interesting though (Assuming I understand it)
Unique powers: A erudite cna only manifest a certian number of unique powers per day (1 at first elvel). If I understand it, they may know tons of powers, but once they use a number of powers equal to their Unique powers per day (max 11 at 20th level) they cannot use new powers, though they can use the previous powers as many tiems as they want to. If so, and interesting blaancing mechanic.
I don't know if I will allow them or not. Have to think about it.
Final commentary
Overall this is an excellent addition to those of us who think the XPHB was one of the best 3.5 supplements ever. I am not going to regret my purchase.
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| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| EytanBernstein |
Posted - 14 Dec 2006 : 20:53:44
Did I say something funky? :) |
| Purple Dragon Knight |
Posted - 13 Dec 2006 : 23:49:08
wtf?  |
| EytanBernstein |
Posted - 13 Dec 2006 : 12:54:42
I wouldn't worry too much about ardents. They way I have them, they generally represent concepts, ideals, and philosophies, not gods themselves. So, if you are having trouble with reconcinciling them with the Faerunian religious structure, you might want to just separate them from it entirely. |
| Purple Dragon Knight |
Posted - 13 Dec 2006 : 05:30:25
So, hindsight 20/20, after a few months: what do you scribe think of this tome? should I add it to my collection? the art looks cool...  |
| Arivia |
Posted - 22 Apr 2006 : 20:53:34
quote:
Originally posted by Purple Dragon Knight
Thanks Arivia!
You just saved me some money! 
Heh. I wouldn't recommend it unless you're a supplement completist(like me) or are intensely in favor of psionics.
EDIT: Additionally, today, it's already on the shelf, after having been looked through for about 45 minutes yesterday. |
| Purple Dragon Knight |
Posted - 22 Apr 2006 : 20:46:26
quote:
Originally posted by Arivia
Finally got my copy of this yesterday.
The divine mind looks quite interesting; I can't wait to try playing one. I'm having difficulty reconciling the ardent with the divinity of the Realms; that'll need a bit of work.
Ultimately, the book will probably go into the category of "I'll randomly try to remember to use elements from it, while my players will be all over it like candy."
EDIT: I also want to shoot whoever came up with the racial levels system; it's adding more complications to an already crowded design space.
Thanks Arivia!
You just saved me some money! |
| Arivia |
Posted - 22 Apr 2006 : 17:24:51
Finally got my copy of this yesterday.
The divine mind looks quite interesting; I can't wait to try playing one. I'm having difficulty reconciling the ardent with the divinity of the Realms; that'll need a bit of work.
Ultimately, the book will probably go into the category of "I'll randomly try to remember to use elements from it, while my players will be all over it like candy."
EDIT: I also want to shoot whoever came up with the racial levels system; it's adding more complications to an already crowded design space.
|
| Arivia |
Posted - 18 Apr 2006 : 12:55:34
Interesting, thanks. |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 18 Apr 2006 : 02:50:31
It looks something like this:
Race Name
Racial Level_____Class Level_______Special
1st_____________________0______________________racial ability X, Y, Z
2nd_____________________0______________________racial ability A, B
3rd_____________________1st
4th_____________________2nd
5th_____________________2nd____________________feat
etc.
In a way, its like the Savage Species way of doing things, except that it lets you sneak in a few class levels before you finish your "monster class" progression.
In a way, it kind of makes sense for the level adjusted psi races that don't have a racial hit dice, like duergar, since it just gives them some of their abilities a little at a time, then lets them progress in a class as they gain the rest, but as I said, its yet another format for something similar that we already have.
Actually, had they just introduced this for the level adjusted races that have no racial hit dice, it would be a handy new format for that, but they also reworked races, like the Thri-kreen, into this as well. |
| Arivia |
Posted - 18 Apr 2006 : 02:36:33
quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
I have mixed feelings over the "racial levels" presented for some of the races from the XPHB. They are balanced and they make sense, allowing you to play some of the level adjusted races from that book from level one, but it also introduces yet another format for dealing with characters that are more powerful than the standard 1st level races, and I don't like things like this to proliferate without a kind of baseline standard. Still, its makes it a lot easier to start a campaign with a duergar or a thri-kreen.
I haven't received my copy of this myself, but is this a different system from the monster classes presented in Savage Species and other supplements? |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 18 Apr 2006 : 01:40:13
Got a chance to look through this, with a decent amount of depth today, though I could spend a lot more time disecting it before I really caught every nuance. In general I noticed the following:
If your campaign has only used a few psionic classes in the past, the extra classes likely won't do much for you, and are likely to make anyone who is interested in psions, but hasn't played them yet in 3rd/3.5, clutch their head in agony as the room spins. On the other hand, if your players, or at least one of two of them, have played psions, psychic warriors, and wilders to death, then these are some interesting variations on them.
The prestige classes have some interesting "specializations" in them that might be fun, and could appeal even to someone that hasn't run the Expanded Psionics Handbook into the ground. My daughter, for example, keeps wanting to play a mind flayer, but that never seems to be a good idea, but letting her play a flayerspawn psychic could be a fun compromise.
There are a lot of racial feats, and I like that. Racial feats are fun, as they give you more incentive to play a member of a given race than just what a 1st level character is going to get out of that race, and I think its a good way to flesh out the flavor of various races.
More psionic powers? Just like spells, as long as they make sense and are balanced, the more the merrier.
I liked the ton of phychic constructs in the monster chapter, since it give you a lot of variety if you choose to have someone able to deal with such things. I also have a soft spot for the larval flayers . . . especially considering my group may be starting a group in Skullport soon.
The new PC race didn't do much for me, nor did the secret houses or whatever they are called, because I have my own ideas on how psionics is going to fit into the Realms.
I have mixed feelings over the "racial levels" presented for some of the races from the XPHB. They are balanced and they make sense, allowing you to play some of the level adjusted races from that book from level one, but it also introduces yet another format for dealing with characters that are more powerful than the standard 1st level races, and I don't like things like this to proliferate without a kind of baseline standard. Still, its makes it a lot easier to start a campaign with a duergar or a thri-kreen.
Finally . . . while its just fleeting, I like that they made sure to include Realms deities in the mantles at the begining of the book. I know, they do it to hook we Realmsians into the purchase, but hey, its better than neglect.
Overall, definately beter than the other product I recently checked out (Races of the Dragon), though I would rank a few other books above in in the "need to have" catagory. Still, with Mysteries of the Moonsea and Dragons of Faerun still a bit off . . . I guess you could do worse than to pick this up. But only if you REALLY like to use psionics. |
| Arivia |
Posted - 16 Apr 2006 : 15:44:12
quote:
Originally posted by Kajehase
The "mantles"-list lists a number of deities, the ones appearing in the Forgotten Realms are these: Azuth, Bane, Chauntea, Corellon Larethian, Cyric, Eilistraee, Garl Glittergold, Gond, Gruumsh, Helm, Ilmater, Ilsensine, Kelemvor, Kossuth, Lathander, Lolth, Malar, Mask, Mielikki, Moradin, Mystra, Oghma, Selūne, Shar, Shaundakul, Silvanus, Sune, Talos, Tempus, Torm, Tymora, Tyr, Umberlee, Uthgar, Waukeen, and Yondalla.
Intriguing. I'm now looking forward to getting my hands on a copy of this much more. (Which, luckily, will be in the next 3-9 days!) |
| Kajehase |
Posted - 16 Apr 2006 : 15:24:12
The "mantles"-list lists a number of deities, the ones appearing in the Forgotten Realms are these: Azuth, Bane, Chauntea, Corellon Larethian, Cyric, Eilistraee, Garl Glittergold, Gond, Gruumsh, Helm, Ilmater, Ilsensine, Kelemvor, Kossuth, Lathander, Lolth, Malar, Mask, Mielikki, Moradin, Mystra, Oghma, Selūne, Shar, Shaundakul, Silvanus, Sune, Talos, Tempus, Torm, Tymora, Tyr, Umberlee, Uthgar, Waukeen, and Yondalla. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 16 Apr 2006 : 12:44:07
Neato. I just placed my order for it today.
What are the other gods listed BTW?
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| VonRaventheDaring |
Posted - 16 Apr 2006 : 11:52:43
I got the book and i have to say i love it. big contravery over at the wizard boards about it in the psionic section, but they seem to complain about everything there. I think it has some neat (yes golly gee wiz i used the word neat!) flavors to it i am a bit disapointed that other than a list of gods from which Auppenser was not listed btw the realms wasn't included but *sigh* i guess thats to be expected from a core product and all. however overall its a nice fit to my collection.  |
| Arivia |
Posted - 15 Apr 2006 : 22:43:03
Just ordered this; I should have it inside of 2 weeks from now. |
| Purple Dragon Knight |
Posted - 05 Apr 2006 : 16:42:53
Seeing I have not use my EXPH yet, I will not be picking this supplement, for the simple reason that I would probably never use it as part of my current FR campaign. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 05 Apr 2006 : 03:10:00
Okay, let's try and get back on topic fellow scribes  .
|
| Chosen of Bane |
Posted - 05 Apr 2006 : 03:01:56
Well, we're no longer in denial so at least we've taken the first steps toward getting help. |
| Kuje |
Posted - 05 Apr 2006 : 02:31:43
quote:
Originally posted by warlockco
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
quote:
Originally posted by Chosen of Bane
I'm not sure how much use I'll get out of this tome either but I have a disorder where I buy just about every Core or Realms sourcebook that gets published.
Me to, it's a bit of a annoyance. :)
I wonder if there is a cure for us? 
Maybe a twelve step WOTC withdrawl system? :) |
| warlockco |
Posted - 05 Apr 2006 : 02:21:18
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
quote:
Originally posted by Chosen of Bane
I'm not sure how much use I'll get out of this tome either but I have a disorder where I buy just about every Core or Realms sourcebook that gets published.
Me to, it's a bit of a annoyance. :)
I wonder if there is a cure for us? |
| EytanBernstein |
Posted - 04 Apr 2006 : 19:44:56
quote:
Originally posted by Archwizard
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by EyeontheMountain at EN World
Soulbow (Guess who this is for?) Yep, Soulknives. Nice change of knives for bows. (Well arrows shot like a bow, but no visual of a bow. Close combat shot and phase arrow add on nicely. Cool class.
It seems like every time I think of these psionic-based "Soul" classes I always think of Psylocke, from the X-Men. I wonder just how much inspiration her character formed in the initial design processes for such classes.
I get a strong Ishida Uryuu (the anime Bleach) vibe when I look at the Soulbow PrC, like a soul blade ... but a bow.
http://www.animegalleries.net/img/121571
http://www.animegalleries.net/img/121625
But the Complete Psionics image is just some lady tossing bolts, which is much more Psylocke like than even the Soulknife.
Having seen it, I can say that if you are a psionics fan, you will definitely find use with this book. It also helps considerably in expanding the integration of psionics into a campaign. If you don't like psionics, I doubt anything in this book will change that. While I did look most of the Complete Series, I think this one is more useful, simply because there is less Psionic content, thus the support is more crucial.
Mod edit: I just fixed your quote for you Eytan.
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| Archwizard |
Posted - 04 Apr 2006 : 08:57:40
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by EyeontheMountain at EN World
Soulbow (Guess who this is for?) Yep, Soulknives. Nice change of knives for bows. (Well arrows shot like a bow, but no visual of a bow. Close combat shot and phase arrow add on nicely. Cool class.
It seems like every time I think of these psionic-based "Soul" classes I always think of Psylocke, from the X-Men. I wonder just how much inspiration her character formed in the initial design processes for such classes.
I get a strong Ishida Uryuu (the anime Bleach) vibe when I look at the Soulbow PrC, like a soul blade ... but a bow.
http://www.animegalleries.net/img/121571
http://www.animegalleries.net/img/121625
But the Complete Psionics image is just some lady tossing bolts, which is much more Psylocke like than even the Soulknife. |
| Dargoth |
Posted - 04 Apr 2006 : 08:39:24
Excerpts from CP are now up
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20060403a&page=2 |
| The Sage |
Posted - 01 Apr 2006 : 01:54:29
quote:
Originally posted by EyeontheMountain at EN World
Soulbow (Guess who this is for?) Yep, Soulknives. Nice change of knives for bows. (Well arrows shot like a bow, but no visual of a bow. Close combat shot and phase arrow add on nicely. Cool class.
It seems like every time I think of these psionic-based "Soul" classes I always think of Psylocke, from the X-Men. I wonder just how much inspiration her character formed in the initial design processes for such classes.
quote:
Storm Disciple 3/5 manifesting. Some minor electricity powers and resistences. Not too impressive.
While it may seem a little too obvious... this might be the perfect way fans of both Talos and psionics can bring the two together into a neat little character concept.
|
| Dargoth |
Posted - 01 Apr 2006 : 00:58:01
Hmm a couple of interesting ideas
The Ardent might be a good class for the Bladelords of Jhaamdath
Anarchite Initiate might be a good PrC for Clerics of Valigan Third Born
Zerth Cenobite might be handy an Auppenser worshiping monk order |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 31 Mar 2006 : 22:58:43
I've used psionics in my campaign, and for the most part it hasn't caused me problems (granted, so far its been psychic warriors or lower level psions). My players really like them, so this will be a buy. |
| Arivia |
Posted - 31 Mar 2006 : 18:58:57
I will be picking this up, although maybe not this coming week; there's a very good-looking sourcebook coming out for that other game I've been babbling about around the library(*dodges staff reflexively*) that might/will probably take up my cash for this month. |
| Kajehase |
Posted - 31 Mar 2006 : 17:57:48
Gah...I'm beginning to regret buying the "I Claudius" DVD-box... This seems like one I'll end up purchasing. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 31 Mar 2006 : 17:12:40
Even though I've only gotten to play a psionicist for a couple of 2E sessions, I am still fascinated by them. This book is one I will acquire. |
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