| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Diffan |
Posted - 09 Apr 2020 : 05:45:29
Copper Elven Vampire made me look a lot at 3.5 material over the last few weeks and I've been re-reading and going over the contents in this book. Even over a decade later, I find myself absorbed by the lore and mechanics this tome provides. I understand the level of controversial aspects its created but honestest to goodness that was well needed in a system wrought with a level of brokenness that D&D really ever witnessed before.
Often referred to, usually with distain, the Book of Weeaboo Fightan Magic the ToB tried to bridge the significant gap between those of Martial abilities and ones who could do magic by creating a sub-system of maneuvers and stances that could usually do extraordinary things. Now I know I'm biased because I love warriors and I love this book, but understand that roughly 2/3 of the content can easily be attributed to Extraordinary abilities (as seen in a HUGH portion of feats and feature throughout 3.5 labeled [Ex] in their descriptions.
Another aspect that I truly admired was their attempts to make credible Warrior base classes that simply were better than their PHB counterparts. The Crusader, Swordsage, and Warblade could have easily replaced the Paladin, Monk, and Fighter (respectively) in any campaign and it would have fit thematically just fine. This was made even easier with the amazing work of Eytan Bernstein and his Class Chronicles that gave these classes and prestige classes of the book more Realms-life.
So tell me, how has this supplement enhanced your Gaming table? Any fun or interesting ways it affected your story? I do have a character, Sir Ivan Brightflame with a few levels of Crusader and a Purple Knight of Cormyr that utilizes his maneuvers as supplications to Helm in his fight against the Netherese. |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Delnyn |
Posted - 22 Mar 2022 : 00:00:12
This is exactly the feedback I need about potential abuse. Fortunately, nothing urgent has come up yet. |
| Diffan |
Posted - 21 Mar 2022 : 01:54:19
quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
I propose a house rule for paladin orders that allow certain multiclassing. If a paladin order allows multiclassing as clerics, I would allow free multiclassing as a crusader. If the order allows multiclassing as a fighter, I would allow free multiclassing as a crusader or warblade. If the order allows multiclassing as a monk or rogue, I would allow free multiclassing as a swordsage.
If someone detects potential abuses, I would appreciate any heads up.
Because we're talking about the Paladin, I'm not sure there can be much discussion about abuse - considering how poorly designed the 3.5 version is. That said, I don't think there's any issues with freely allowing the multiclassing between Martial Adept classes and the Paladin in general.
Going back over my Min/Max & Character Optimization ideas for 3.5 the only real "abuse" I can see with allows free mixing between Martial Adept characters and the Paladin is this...
Paladin 4/ Knight of the Raven 5/ Swordsage 1/ Shadow Sun Ninja 10. Three significant feats really helps bring this together. The first being Serenity (from Dragon Compendium) which allows paladins to use Wisdom for their Lay on Hands, Divine Grace, Smite Evil, and Turn Undead. Second is Intuitive Attack (Book of Exalted Deeds) which uses Wisdom instead of Strength with simple attacks (including Unarmed Strike). Third and final is Shadow Blade (Tome of Battle) that *ADDS* your Dexterity modifier to damage rolls with Weapons from the Shadow Hand discipline (including...you guessed it, Unarmed Strike) when in a Shadow Hand stance. If you apply the Swordsage Unarmed Strike adaptation (Tome of Battle, pg. 20) it gives you Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat and progresses like a Monk.
So what does all this mean? In Short, you're basing AC (from Swordsage), Attack rolls, Smite, Paladin Spells, Divine Grace, many Maneuver DCs, Lay on Hands, and Turn Undead all off of Wisdom. It takes the Paladin, often a MAD (Multiple Attribute Dependent) class into a one to two stat class easily. You'll have +16 BAB, 8th level maneuvers, Spellcasting of a 8th level Paladin, AMAZING saving throws, and the features of the Shadow Sun ninja (which mimic the monk including AC and Unarmed Strike progression).
Now, is this *broken*? Hard to say because so much is based round group composition, campaign style, what level are other player's min/maxing and optimizing, and how much focus combat and skills privy to the Swordsage/Ninja are going to be used? I'd say in a game with Wizards, core Druids, Clerics who use Nightsticks and spam Divine Metamagic then it'll be fine and probably underpowered. In a game with a bunch of tier 3 and 4 classes with maybe a "healing" cleric and a druid who doesn't try....it'll see like he'll have an answer for everything outside the Druid. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 20 Mar 2022 : 19:42:06
quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
I propose a house rule for paladin orders that allow certain multiclassing. If a paladin order allows multiclassing as clerics, I would allow free multiclassing as a crusader. If the order allows multiclassing as a fighter, I would allow free multiclassing as a crusader or warblade. If the order allows multiclassing as a monk or rogue, I would allow free multiclassing as a swordsage.
If someone detects potential abuses, I would appreciate any heads up.
If I still played 3.5e (which I would if I had a group that wanted to mind you), I think this would be a good rule. I could, for instance, see a paladinic order of the Red Knight or Helm that allows leveling as crusader or warblade. Tyr and Torm could both fit the crusader/paladin option.
Along similar lines, monk orders might allow for combining with swordsage freely, going back and forth between the two classes (bypassing the normal rules that if you leave the monk class you can't keep leveling it). |
| Delnyn |
Posted - 20 Mar 2022 : 14:58:24
I propose a house rule for paladin orders that allow certain multiclassing. If a paladin order allows multiclassing as clerics, I would allow free multiclassing as a crusader. If the order allows multiclassing as a fighter, I would allow free multiclassing as a crusader or warblade. If the order allows multiclassing as a monk or rogue, I would allow free multiclassing as a swordsage.
If someone detects potential abuses, I would appreciate any heads up. |
| Diffan |
Posted - 06 Sep 2021 : 00:23:52
Looking at a possible build, it helps to know what level, approximately, we're look at? So, if I were to use him as I intend - an NPC to help find/Bind the Everlasting Wyurm to guard against Eltab, he's gonna need to be about 16th+ level.
So, maybe Human (half-Mulan/half-Nar) crusader (Kossuth) 2/ battle sorcerer 4/ jade phoenix mage 5/ raumathari battlemage 7 for a CR 18. He'd have a BaB +15, CL 14th, and an IL 12th. Feats: EWP (Bastard sword), Combat Casting, Quicken Spell, Rapid Metamagic, Power Attack, Battle Caster, Arcane Strike. Pretty nasty!! |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 04 Sep 2021 : 17:45:17
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
Diffan,
I know its been a while since we had this conversation, but I really enjoyed the general story we were making up, and I felt like just making a picture of a bastard sword for this Jade Phoenix battlemage. To note, its not meant to be Hadryllis, but rather another bastard sword, just because I was thinking it might be interesting if the Jade Phoenix mage has one sword tied to the Jade Phoenix and then has to use Hadryllis as a weapon tied to binding "the Everlasting Wyrm" and Eltab. The idea came to me kind o like the two swords of power having to be combined by He-Man and Skeletor as a way to just make things a little more complex.
Bastard Sword of the Jade Phoenix Battlemage https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4541158 by sleyvas is licensed under the Creative Commons - Attribution license.
That's a pretty cool looking sword design. I like the bird emblem etched into the blade. With it being a bastard sword, does that mean a bigger focus on Disciplines that use that weapon: Diamond Mind and Iron Heart?
Well, I picked bastard sword just because that's a requirement to enter the Raumathari Battlemage prestige class, so I figured Raumathar had a lot of people using it. However, the diamond mind discipline is definitely "my type of style" since it seems very defense oriented as well as having nice attack options, all while focusing on intellect, and it can be warblade OR swordsage. Iron Heart would seem to fit as well, and the name fits Raumathar, since this was when humanity in that region was discovering the use of iron versus the bronze weapons of Mulan manufacture, but its purely warblade.
The Jade Phoenix class though seems to make you NEED to focus on desert wind and devoted spirit, one of which is crusader and the other is swordsage. That of course could be modified for THIS jade phoenix mage (i.e. perhaps he can choose between desert wind and diamond mind). I will add, I don't think I realized this part until the reread (i.e. I didn't realize it was tying you to certain disciplines).
BTW: I could see this character possibly spending some levels in Raumathari battlemage as well, using Jade Phoenix to level his mage levels first. Not many levels mind you. Raumathari battlemage also needs a little service to make it comparable to most 3.5 stuff that came later (like spellsword and eldritch knight, etc...).... thinking one thing that that class should have is a free feat at first level that's somatic weaponry. It kind of hints around that you can use your sword as a focus and replace material components, etc...
Thinking on a build... Just looking at the rules, think you could mix in some spellsword, abjurant champion, or raumathari battlemage levels into it as well. I like the idea of him having levels in both crusader and swordsage as well (crusader of Kossuth, but swordsage opens the desert wind discipline plus AC bonus with light armor based on wisdom). Of course the key, as always is how to get started in spellcasting AND getting your BAB up at the same time. Maybe doing 3 levels crusader, 2 levels swordsage, 2 level wizard, 2 levels abjurant champion, 10 levels jade phoenix, 1 level maybe spellsword or ajburant champion... lessee at level 20 ... +18 bab, and a decent spread of saves of which reflex is probably your worst (but if you have diamond mind's action before thought...) |
| Diffan |
Posted - 03 Sep 2021 : 16:05:38
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
Diffan,
I know its been a while since we had this conversation, but I really enjoyed the general story we were making up, and I felt like just making a picture of a bastard sword for this Jade Phoenix battlemage. To note, its not meant to be Hadryllis, but rather another bastard sword, just because I was thinking it might be interesting if the Jade Phoenix mage has one sword tied to the Jade Phoenix and then has to use Hadryllis as a weapon tied to binding "the Everlasting Wyrm" and Eltab. The idea came to me kind o like the two swords of power having to be combined by He-Man and Skeletor as a way to just make things a little more complex.
Bastard Sword of the Jade Phoenix Battlemage https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4541158 by sleyvas is licensed under the Creative Commons - Attribution license.
That's a pretty cool looking sword design. I like the bird emblem etched into the blade. With it being a bastard sword, does that mean a bigger focus on Disciplines that use that weapon: Diamond Mind and Iron Heart? |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 13 Jul 2020 : 18:11:35
Diffan,
I know its been a while since we had this conversation, but I really enjoyed the general story we were making up, and I felt like just making a picture of a bastard sword for this Jade Phoenix battlemage. To note, its not meant to be Hadryllis, but rather another bastard sword, just because I was thinking it might be interesting if the Jade Phoenix mage has one sword tied to the Jade Phoenix and then has to use Hadryllis as a weapon tied to binding "the Everlasting Wyrm" and Eltab. The idea came to me kind o like the two swords of power having to be combined by He-Man and Skeletor as a way to just make things a little more complex.
Bastard Sword of the Jade Phoenix Battlemage https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4541158 by sleyvas is licensed under the Creative Commons - Attribution license.
|
| Delnyn |
Posted - 14 May 2020 : 23:46:45
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
As do I, lol. I couldn't see someone in full-plate being "like a leaf" and flowing air around him nimbly-bimbly.
Hmm, that gives me a sick idea of a helmed horror with swordsage maneuvers and a monk's unarmed combat abilities. Trained skill in Acrobatics. 
Not sure about the monk part (just personal preference), but the idea of a helmed horror that's leveled in Book of Nine Swords type styles is interesting.
Furthermore, YOUR idea just spawned an idea for me for Maztica/Katashaka/Anchorome areas. One of the things I'd been playing with at one point was constructs made using the magic of the area. So, for instance, Hishnahide armor constructs similar to a Helmed horror wherein the animated armor is like a thicker hide armor with say a jaguar, wolf, bear, lion, or something like a shark or komodo dragon skull as the head. More intelligent versions could be made that could "command" legions of these Hishnahide with human or other intelligent being skulls. From another perspective, Plumafeather constructs could also be made from feather and bone over hide armor from giant parrots, giant eagles, giant owls, giant ravens, giant vultures, griffons, hippogriffs, pegasi, etc...
These various constructs that I'm talking about could be focused in various fighting styles that I definitely see mirroring monks, swordsages, etc... and the plumafeather ones would fit the "wind" stuff that Diffan was developing.
That's a pretty good idea! Helmed Horrors always is seen as metallic hunks of animated armor. But having a bone-skulled, jaguar hide warrior using Tiger Claw maneuvers or an animated wispy cloth-armored - huge bat skulled - creature using Celestial Typhoon maneuvers would be horrifying and awesome!
And throw in a dash of hishna magic as practiced in Maztica. |
| Diffan |
Posted - 09 May 2020 : 20:11:24
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
As do I, lol. I couldn't see someone in full-plate being "like a leaf" and flowing air around him nimbly-bimbly.
Hmm, that gives me a sick idea of a helmed horror with swordsage maneuvers and a monk's unarmed combat abilities. Trained skill in Acrobatics.
Not sure about the monk part (just personal preference), but the idea of a helmed horror that's leveled in Book of Nine Swords type styles is interesting.
Furthermore, YOUR idea just spawned an idea for me for Maztica/Katashaka/Anchorome areas. One of the things I'd been playing with at one point was constructs made using the magic of the area. So, for instance, Hishnahide armor constructs similar to a Helmed horror wherein the animated armor is like a thicker hide armor with say a jaguar, wolf, bear, lion, or something like a shark or komodo dragon skull as the head. More intelligent versions could be made that could "command" legions of these Hishnahide with human or other intelligent being skulls. From another perspective, Plumafeather constructs could also be made from feather and bone over hide armor from giant parrots, giant eagles, giant owls, giant ravens, giant vultures, griffons, hippogriffs, pegasi, etc...
These various constructs that I'm talking about could be focused in various fighting styles that I definitely see mirroring monks, swordsages, etc... and the plumafeather ones would fit the "wind" stuff that Diffan was developing.
That's a pretty good idea! Helmed Horrors always is seen as metallic hunks of animated armor. But having a bone-skulled, jaguar hide warrior using Tiger Claw maneuvers or an animated wispy cloth-armored - huge bat skulled - creature using Celestial Typhoon maneuvers would be horrifying and awesome! |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 05 May 2020 : 16:06:12
quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
As do I, lol. I couldn't see someone in full-plate being "like a leaf" and flowing air around him nimbly-bimbly.
Hmm, that gives me a sick idea of a helmed horror with swordsage maneuvers and a monk's unarmed combat abilities. Trained skill in Acrobatics.
Not sure about the monk part (just personal preference), but the idea of a helmed horror that's leveled in Book of Nine Swords type styles is interesting.
Furthermore, YOUR idea just spawned an idea for me for Maztica/Katashaka/Anchorome areas. One of the things I'd been playing with at one point was constructs made using the magic of the area. So, for instance, Hishnahide armor constructs similar to a Helmed horror wherein the animated armor is like a thicker hide armor with say a jaguar, wolf, bear, lion, or something like a shark or komodo dragon skull as the head. More intelligent versions could be made that could "command" legions of these Hishnahide with human or other intelligent being skulls. From another perspective, Plumafeather constructs could also be made from feather and bone over hide armor from giant parrots, giant eagles, giant owls, giant ravens, giant vultures, griffons, hippogriffs, pegasi, etc...
These various constructs that I'm talking about could be focused in various fighting styles that I definitely see mirroring monks, swordsages, etc... and the plumafeather ones would fit the "wind" stuff that Diffan was developing. |
| Delnyn |
Posted - 05 May 2020 : 01:09:24
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
As do I, lol. I couldn't see someone in full-plate being "like a leaf" and flowing air around him nimbly-bimbly.
Hmm, that gives me a sick idea of a helmed horror with swordsage maneuvers and a monk's unarmed combat abilities. Trained skill in Acrobatics. |
| Diffan |
Posted - 26 Apr 2020 : 21:56:18
As do I, lol. I couldn't see someone in full-plate being "like a leaf" and flowing air around him nimbly-bimbly. |
| Delnyn |
Posted - 25 Apr 2020 : 14:01:43
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
[quote]
Well what I mean, not bending specifically like we see in Avatar: the Last Airbender but maneuvers, stances, and the like to what we see with the Desert Wind discipline. One could take the powers from that and almost mimic the effects of a Firebender already. Of course you're still limited by class (only Swordsages get access to the Celestial Typhoon) and you're probably not being glued only to that style but it just has similar flavor.
I got the concept after re-watching Avatar Korra and the main antagonist of Season 3 (Zaheer, a new air bender) and this guy and powers are just cool as all hell.
This is better. I have a hard time picturing crusaders airbending. |
| Diffan |
Posted - 24 Apr 2020 : 22:39:28
quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
I am not sure airbending or any kind of bending should be a discipline as much as its own core class, or at least a prestige class for swordsages.
Blood bending should be a dark art like the flavor of the Shadow hand discipline.
Well what I mean, not bending specifically like we see in Avatar: the Last Airbender but maneuvers, stances, and the like to what we see with the Desert Wind discipline. One could take the powers from that and almost mimic the effects of a Firebender already. Of course you're still limited by class (only Swordsages get access to the Celestial Typhoon) and you're probably not being glued only to that style but it just has similar flavor.
I got the concept after re-watching Avatar Korra and the main antagonist of Season 3 (Zaheer, a new air bender) and this guy and powers are just cool as all hell. |
| Delnyn |
Posted - 24 Apr 2020 : 19:55:33
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
Getting back to the main topic at hand - the Tome of Battle - I was wondering if there was a desire by the community at large to have additional Disciplines made that work with the Tome? I ask because I'm currently working on a Discipline that focuses on using Air and Sonic attacks in a similar vein as Airbending.
I am not sure airbending or any kind of bending should be a discipline as much as its own core class, or at least a prestige class for swordsages.
Blood bending should be a dark art like the flavor of the Shadow hand discipline. |
| Diffan |
Posted - 24 Apr 2020 : 17:26:23
Getting back to the main topic at hand - the Tome of Battle - I was wondering if there was a desire by the community at large to have additional Disciplines made that work with the Tome? I ask because I'm currently working on a Discipline that focuses on using Air and Sonic attacks in a similar vein as Airbending. |
| Diffan |
Posted - 23 Apr 2020 : 15:14:23
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
Hmmm, so on the idea that the dracolich spurned Myrkul somehow... maybe he stole the ritual that created himself as a dracolich from the church of Myrkul (to note, this is before the Cult of the Dragon came about that this being became a dracolich)?
That's the idea I was toying with honestly. It ties in why the Crusaders would want to help lock away the Souldrake and why they might look for the Jade Phoenix NPC, who's currently fighting the incursion of Warduke and the Durthans in Rasheman. |
| Diffan |
Posted - 23 Apr 2020 : 15:12:00
quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
As a side adventure, have the party retrieve the golden hammer and return it to Strongheart the paladin. Maybe he can give the party the intel on Warduke.
Ohhh man....that's an idea! I thought Strong heart wielded a magical intelligent longsword though? Or was retrieving his hammer a part of the Episode of D&D he was in?
Otherwise, I absolutely might include that.
EDIT: on a side note - how would you stat Strongheart? Human Paladin 18? Maybe with a strong devotion to the Fists of Valor knighthood!
The hammer was indeed from the cartoon. The action figure had the longsword. If Warduke is an 18th level fighter, making Strongheart an 18th level paladin is reasonable. Fist of Valor knighthood works.
So I started him up, human paladin 18. I used his same stats he had in 1e and kept to as much as the lore as I could. Look for his stats in the Forgotten Realms NPC Generator thread. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 23 Apr 2020 : 12:20:00
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
I admit I struggle with the same. However, canonically they DO go in and fight the dragon and kill it every century. Since Myrkul was NE, I picture these crusaders as LE. Thus, maybe they have a code of honor and maybe there is some reason why they need it bound. As to Eltab, one thing to recall is that they just happened across him the first time. They then "lured" him into servitude and ended up his servants instead. They then were led on an ill-advised raid of Mulhorand. I'm not actually picturing a lot of love lost in that relationship at the end. They may have followed him out of fear.
Yeah, and it was Thay that attempted to bind Eltab to Thakorsil's Seat and that would've been bad for everyone. So now with that botched affair in 1373 DR, Eltab is once again locked under the Citadel of Conjurers (in Impiltur?) and maybe they need the Jade Phoenix NPC to re-bind the Everlasting Wyrm/Souldrake/Xavarathimius to keep watch over Eltab once again.
So the premise of the adventure is sort of two-fold. One, you have the Durthan annis hag sorceress Chaul organizing Telthors (spirit-creatures), the other Durthan, and armies amassed by Warduke on a grand crusade though Rasheman.
Then there's the second part of re-sealing the Souldrake via the sword Hadryllis in Impiltur's Citadel of Conjurers to make sure Eltab is firmly secured in his prison. The Crusaders of Myrkul are willing to help in this task to ensure Eltab doesn't escape and because it's a ritual as old as their organization - Maybe Xavarathimius somehow spurned or brought upon the wrath of Myrkul in some vendetta or power grab and his knights set out to put him down as a memory to never cross Myrkul?
So now I need to figure out how to connect the two? I can have the NPC Jade Phoenix (I was thinking of making him Male half-Mulan/half-Rashemi human Crusader 1 (Kossuth)/ Stalwart Battle Sorcerer 6/ Jade Phoenix Mage 10) decide to take the journey and seal away the Souldrake once again but his lands in trouble and needs to break the Durthan's lines before he can leave?
Hmmm, so on the idea that the dracolich spurned Myrkul somehow... maybe he stole the ritual that created himself as a dracolich from the church of Myrkul (to note, this is before the Cult of the Dragon came about that this being became a dracolich)?
|
| Delnyn |
Posted - 23 Apr 2020 : 02:26:22
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
As a side adventure, have the party retrieve the golden hammer and return it to Strongheart the paladin. Maybe he can give the party the intel on Warduke.
Ohhh man....that's an idea! I thought Strong heart wielded a magical intelligent longsword though? Or was retrieving his hammer a part of the Episode of D&D he was in?
Otherwise, I absolutely might include that.
EDIT: on a side note - how would you stat Strongheart? Human Paladin 18? Maybe with a strong devotion to the Fists of Valor knighthood!
The hammer was indeed from the cartoon. The action figure had the longsword. If Warduke is an 18th level fighter, making Strongheart an 18th level paladin is reasonable. Fist of Valor knighthood works. |
| Diffan |
Posted - 23 Apr 2020 : 01:32:29
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
I admit I struggle with the same. However, canonically they DO go in and fight the dragon and kill it every century. Since Myrkul was NE, I picture these crusaders as LE. Thus, maybe they have a code of honor and maybe there is some reason why they need it bound. As to Eltab, one thing to recall is that they just happened across him the first time. They then "lured" him into servitude and ended up his servants instead. They then were led on an ill-advised raid of Mulhorand. I'm not actually picturing a lot of love lost in that relationship at the end. They may have followed him out of fear.
Yeah, and it was Thay that attempted to bind Eltab to Thakorsil's Seat and that would've been bad for everyone. So now with that botched affair in 1373 DR, Eltab is once again locked under the Citadel of Conjurers (in Impiltur?) and maybe they need the Jade Phoenix NPC to re-bind the Everlasting Wyrm/Souldrake/Xavarathimius to keep watch over Eltab once again.
So the premise of the adventure is sort of two-fold. One, you have the Durthan annis hag sorceress Chaul organizing Telthors (spirit-creatures), the other Durthan, and armies amassed by Warduke on a grand crusade though Rasheman.
Then there's the second part of re-sealing the Souldrake via the sword Hadryllis in Impiltur's Citadel of Conjurers to make sure Eltab is firmly secured in his prison. The Crusaders of Myrkul are willing to help in this task to ensure Eltab doesn't escape and because it's a ritual as old as their organization - Maybe Xavarathimius somehow spurned or brought upon the wrath of Myrkul in some vendetta or power grab and his knights set out to put him down as a memory to never cross Myrkul?
So now I need to figure out how to connect the two? I can have the NPC Jade Phoenix (I was thinking of making him Male half-Mulan/half-Rashemi human Crusader 1 (Kossuth)/ Stalwart Battle Sorcerer 6/ Jade Phoenix Mage 10) decide to take the journey and seal away the Souldrake once again but his lands in trouble and needs to break the Durthan's lines before he can leave? |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 23 Apr 2020 : 00:13:39
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
possibly with the help of the Crusaders of Myrkul?
I'm not sure why the Crusaders of Myrkul would help keep a Dracolich bound? Wouldn't they want to release the Souldrake (thus weakening the binds on Eltab?)
I admit I struggle with the same. However, canonically they DO go in and fight the dragon and kill it every century. Since Myrkul was NE, I picture these crusaders as LE. Thus, maybe they have a code of honor and maybe there is some reason why they need it bound. As to Eltab, one thing to recall is that they just happened across him the first time. They then "lured" him into servitude and ended up his servants instead. They then were led on an ill-advised raid of Mulhorand. I'm not actually picturing a lot of love lost in that relationship at the end. They may have followed him out of fear. |
| Diffan |
Posted - 22 Apr 2020 : 18:05:20
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
possibly with the help of the Crusaders of Myrkul?
I'm not sure why the Crusaders of Myrkul would help keep a Dracolich bound? Wouldn't they want to release the Souldrake (thus weakening the binds on Eltab?) |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 22 Apr 2020 : 17:35:56
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
So basically the new Jade Phoenix Mage is the old spirit of Turoth and he's needed again as the Souldrake (which we know is Xavarathimius aka the Everlasting Wyurm) is possibly close to escaping due to the actions of both the Durthan Chaul and with help of the Knights of the Eternal Dragon.
The sword Hadryllis is needed to stop the Everlasting Wyurm with a ritual the Jade Phoenix needs to complete in order to restore the bindings on the Souldrake.
Yes! I forgot the part on possibly tying in Hadryllis, but yeah, that definitely works. So, maybe they have to awaken "the Phoenix" in Amruthar and then escort the Phoenix and the Jade Phoenix character to the Sharawood to renew the bindings... possibly with the help of the Crusaders of Myrkul? But then as that is happening, the party has to leave this scene behind and transport themselves to Immilmar to stop the Durthans and Warduke. Maybe even the Durthans and Warduke have been hiding out in the ruins of Shandaular in the Council Hills area of the Shaar and using the ancient portal link between there and Ashanath. |
| Diffan |
Posted - 22 Apr 2020 : 16:52:43
So basically the new Jade Phoenix Mage is the old spirit of Turoth and he's needed again as the Souldrake (which we know is Xavarathimius aka the Everlasting Wyurm) is possibly close to escaping due to the actions of both the Durthan Chaul and with help of the Knights of the Eternal Dragon.
The sword Hadryllis is needed to stop the Everlasting Wyurm with a ritual the Jade Phoenix needs to complete in order to restore the bindings on the Souldrake. |
| Diffan |
Posted - 22 Apr 2020 : 16:09:54
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
Glad to help. That being said, if you DO do that storyline, make sure that the Jade Phoenix NPC has to help the phoenix against the dracolich. Let that be something going on in the background with the NPC without distracting from the accomplishments of the PC. BTW, not sure why I'm fixated on this, but having Warduke with a powerful version of a frostbrand weapon made by the Durthans comes to mind. Maybe having a priestess of Auril that's in love with him to help him (casting protections, casting heals, etc..)
Well his Longsword in the show freezes Dungeon Master to a tree, so there is already a penchant for that. His 3.5 stats have him wielding a +3 human bane flaming burst bastard sword but to keep it more thematic to the show AND the setting of Rasheman, cold works better.
Also Chaul is followed by a Half-orc cleric of Luthic and she has multiple cold spells prepared including Ice Axe. So there's a good possibility that the two (Warduke and Durakh) are a thing.... |
| Diffan |
Posted - 22 Apr 2020 : 15:47:02
quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
As a side adventure, have the party retrieve the golden hammer and return it to Strongheart the paladin. Maybe he can give the party the intel on Warduke.
Ohhh man....that's an idea! I thought Strong heart wielded a magical intelligent longsword though? Or was retrieving his hammer a part of the Episode of D&D he was in?
Otherwise, I absolutely might include that.
EDIT: on a side note - how would you stat Strongheart? Human Paladin 18? Maybe with a strong devotion to the Fists of Valor knighthood! |
| Delnyn |
Posted - 22 Apr 2020 : 04:25:57
As a side adventure, have the party retrieve the golden hammer and return it to Strongheart the paladin. Maybe he can give the party the intel on Warduke. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 22 Apr 2020 : 02:46:45
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
Warduke? As in the old D&D cartoon bad guy? Neat.
Aye, one and the same. He was given stats for 3.5 in Dungeon magazine #105 as an 18th level Human Fighter. He's a Challenge Rating of 20, due to the items he has and the Grafts placed on him. His Strength is 32 and has all the Fighter feats in 3.5 PHB it seems, lol.
Will he be a challenge for my PCs? Possible, though they've been running rough-shod through most of the monsters in the Anauroch adventure so far. So I'm curious to see how they'll fare.
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
Well, if you DO do that campaign... consider having it be that the Durthans were involved with binding the Everlasting Wyrm and not just the wychlaran (or rather there was no split yet). The Durthans are all about cold. Maybe the Wychlaran tell them they must find the "Telthor of the Reborn Phoenix" to help them against the dragon. They maybe have to find the Jade Phoenix mage (maybe a Crusader warmage or Crusader Wizard) and help him achieve his end goals. Maybe the artifact that is the Daarthos Koruna is an artifact of Kossuth that actually is an egg of a Phoenix that has been stopped from hatching. Maybe they have to bring the Daarthos Koruna (i.e. phoenix egg) to Amruthar in Thay and touch it to the artifact which seems to have ties to Kossuth beneath that city. Of course, the red wizards protect this artifact and don't just let anyone go walking up to it.
This could give you a chance to play with the NPC itself without a player having to dream up all of this (or you presenting it and them not getting it). You could then play with the rules like you're wanting to do. In the end, you have the phoenix taking on this ultra-powerful dracolich, while the players take on the durthans and warduke.
That's an awesome idea! That way I can also incorporate Thay in there and have an adventure set in and around the Unapproachable East!
Glad to help. That being said, if you DO do that storyline, make sure that the Jade Phoenix NPC has to help the phoenix against the dracolich. Let that be something going on in the background with the NPC without distracting from the accomplishments of the PC. BTW, not sure why I'm fixated on this, but having Warduke with a powerful version of a frostbrand weapon made by the Durthans comes to mind. Maybe having a priestess of Auril that's in love with him to help him (casting protections, casting heals, etc..) |
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