| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Lady Morbannaon |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 01:56:07
Hi,
Just a quick question that I know one of you all will be able to help me with 
Are drow ogl?
I'm asking because i'm currently reviewing an ebook for a site and they mention drow but don't have any affiliations with wizards or have any declaration in the front of the book.
Any ideas?
Heidi |
| 21 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Zimme |
Posted - 10 Oct 2006 : 13:35:22
quote:
Originally posted by Aquanova
quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
quote:
Originally posted by Zimme.
Im stunned!! Drow are mythical creatures!? is it from the sagas of Iceland or is it the Shetland islands? That I never heard before! I believed that drow was the invention of some gamer.
Well, although the drow may share some aspects with mythical creatures and the name has been seen in folklore the creatures as we know them are created by game designers ( one of Gygax' inventions I believe?). Most of the creatures in D&D have been changed to a degree that gives them little resemblance to the mythical creatures that inspired them. Take for example trolls, which, as seen in D&D, owes more to Poul Andersons version than the stories of northern Europe.
Yeah, the real-world dark elves are very different from drow in D&D, and are more like the pixie/sprites most people associate with the word "elf," rather than the LotR-esque beautiful, shrewd, and obsidian-skinned/snow-haired dark elves we know and love (well... some of us love).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_elf This article should give you an idea on the subject.
Oh, well you learn a little something new everyday thank you for the explanations guy's. |
| Aquanova |
Posted - 05 Oct 2006 : 19:59:27
quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
quote:
Originally posted by Zimme.
Im stunned!! Drow are mythical creatures!? is it from the sagas of Iceland or is it the Shetland islands? That I never heard before! I believed that drow was the invention of some gamer.
Well, although the drow may share some aspects with mythical creatures and the name has been seen in folklore the creatures as we know them are created by game designers ( one of Gygax' inventions I believe?). Most of the creatures in D&D have been changed to a degree that gives them little resemblance to the mythical creatures that inspired them. Take for example trolls, which, as seen in D&D, owes more to Poul Andersons version than the stories of northern Europe.
Yeah, the real-world dark elves are very different from drow in D&D, and are more like the pixie/sprites most people associate with the word "elf," rather than the LotR-esque beautiful, shrewd, and obsidian-skinned/snow-haired dark elves we know and love (well... some of us love).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_elf This article should give you an idea on the subject. |
| Lady Morbannaon |
Posted - 03 Oct 2006 : 18:11:50
Thanks for all your help, I'll now be able to happily read the book i'm meant to be reading without worrying about it.
Also thanks everyone for the mythology lessons, I so need to look into it all.
Heidi |
| Jorkens |
Posted - 03 Oct 2006 : 07:55:33
quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
Hmm I thought Beholders where from Chinese mythology or something theres one in that Kurt Russel movie Big trouble in little China town
I seem to remember ( I could be wrong as I cant find the reference right now) reading that the beholder was a creation of Robert Kuntz, I think it was in one of Gygax' threads. The creature in Big Trouble in Little China is indeed very similar to the Beholder, but I think it was Carpenter who lent the idea for the movie. |
| Jorkens |
Posted - 03 Oct 2006 : 07:38:16
quote:
Originally posted by Zimme.
Im stunned!! Drow are mythical creatures!? is it from the sagas of Iceland or is it the Shetland islands? That I never heard before! I believed that drow was the invention of some gamer.
Well, although the drow may share some aspects with mythical creatures and the name has been seen in folklore the creatures as we know them are created by game designers ( one of Gygax' inventions I believe?). Most of the creatures in D&D have been changed to a degree that gives them little resemblance to the mythical creatures that inspired them. Take for example trolls, which, as seen in D&D, owes more to Poul Andersons version than the stories of northern Europe. |
| Dargoth |
Posted - 03 Oct 2006 : 05:37:02
quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
Beholders, yuan-ti, illithids, and a few others that slip my mind right now don't show up in the SRD. But to your question, yes, dark elves, or drow are.
Hmm I thought Beholders where from Chinese mythology or something theres one in that Kurt Russel movie Big trouble in little China town |
| Zimme |
Posted - 03 Oct 2006 : 04:07:53
quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
I remmeber reading somewhere that Drow are actually from real world mythology (One of the islands north of Scotland I think) so like Goblins, Ogres and Trolls WWizards couldnt copyright them
Im stunned!! Drow are mythical creatures!? is it from the sagas of Iceland or is it the Shetland islands? That I never heard before! I believed that drow was the invention of some gamer. |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 03 Oct 2006 : 01:49:26
quote:
Originally posted by Reefy
quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
There are only a handful of D&D creatures that WOTC has kept out of the SRD, and even then, apparently some company really push their limits. For example, there is a product that features "mind flayers" which are not included in the SRD, but they are never referred to as illithids in the book and are actually given another similar name as a race name. Its a pretty obvious one though.
Beholders, yuan-ti, illithids, and a few others that slip my mind right now don't show up in the SRD. But to your question, yes, dark elves, or drow are.
Ah, I never realised that. Umber hulks are another one, because I remember looking for them in the SRD before and being confused as to why they weren't there.
Wait, you looked for an Umber Hulk and got confused . . . there is a certain logic there . . . |
| Reefy |
Posted - 03 Oct 2006 : 01:45:01
quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
There are only a handful of D&D creatures that WOTC has kept out of the SRD, and even then, apparently some company really push their limits. For example, there is a product that features "mind flayers" which are not included in the SRD, but they are never referred to as illithids in the book and are actually given another similar name as a race name. Its a pretty obvious one though.
Beholders, yuan-ti, illithids, and a few others that slip my mind right now don't show up in the SRD. But to your question, yes, dark elves, or drow are.
Ah, I never realised that. Umber hulks are another one, because I remember looking for them in the SRD before and being confused as to why they weren't there. |
| Ardashir |
Posted - 02 Oct 2006 : 18:26:21
quote:
Originally posted by GothicDan
The Drow were probably the Svartalfir - literally translated, "The Dark Elves." As opposed to the Ljossalfir, "The Light Elves." Respectively, residents of Svartalfheim (Dark Elf Home) and Ljosalfheim (Light Elf Home), two of the Nine Worlds of the World-Ash.
- *Not a Norse fanatic at all.*
Yes, that's my own take as well, though the Old Norse probably imagined the svartalfar to be more like dwarves (duergar?) than elves. But the Norse also had something called a drow, which lived in a burial barrow and was more like the AD&D wight.
OT, but over in Champions (from HERO Games, please spend all your non-FR dollars on their stuff, thank you. ;) they seem to view their Fantasy/ later mythic dark elves as being basically AD&D drow. |
| GothicDan |
Posted - 02 Oct 2006 : 03:01:01
The Drow were probably the Svartalfir - literally translated, "The Dark Elves." As opposed to the Ljossalfir, "The Light Elves." Respectively, residents of Svartalfheim (Dark Elf Home) and Ljosalfheim (Light Elf Home), two of the Nine Worlds of the World-Ash.
- *Not a Norse fanatic at all.* |
| Beirnadri Magranth |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 05:15:57
oh ok. lol now this thread makes a lot more sense to me. yeah i know about open gaming license etc. i just didnt know there was an abbreviation (ive heard srd as an abbrev.)
thanks kejr |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 04:46:30
Open Game License . . . the stuff that WOTC has developed that they don't mind if you use and/or won't send their lawyers to come calling upon you if you put in your game products.
Technically there are two terms here . . . the SRD is the Source Reference Document for the d20 System. You can, if you follow certain rules, declare that your product is d20, or you can fudge on some of the rules and make something OGL, which is still using some of the material in the SRD, but not enough of it that it can be considered d20.
Now as to exactly what you can and can't put in something and the exact line between d20 and OGL is, I don't know, but for the most part, if you qualify for one or the other, you are okay as far as legal action goes from WOTC.
A Game of Thrones? d20 system. Conan RPG? OGL.
If you look in the back of any of the third party books (the d20 ones) you can see the agreement that they have to sign off on to get that status.
You can do some more research if it really keeps you up at night here:
http://www.wizards.com/d20/ |
| Beirnadri Magranth |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 04:39:49
whats ogl? |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 02:14:41
Yeah, and elf/dwarf/troll were all kind of muddled together in Norse mythology, depending on the story. |
| Dargoth |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 02:10:31
Im pretty sure the real world drow where "Evil creatures who came out of the ground at night and abducted naughty children took them back to their homes underground"
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| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 02:08:00
quote:
Originally posted by Lady Morbannaon
quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
I remmeber reading somewhere that Drow are actually from real world mythology (One of the islands north of Scotland I think) so like Goblins, Ogres and Trolls WWizards couldnt copyright them
Thanks for your answer I didn't know that and i'll have to look into the mythology if it is true, my partner is from Scotland so his mother may know more.
I'm wondering how far an author can push it though without being sort of obvious the drow in the book i'm reading are described as ' dark and distant cousins of the elves who live underground in vast cities and are of dark in colouring'
Any thoughts?
In the Green Ronin book Plot and Poison its pretty obvious that the drow presented there are D&D style drow, and they even have a goddess known as the Spider Queen, though she is never called Lolth. She was cast from the heavens by the Elf Lord (I've heard all of this somewhere before).
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| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 02:06:12
There are only a handful of D&D creatures that WOTC has kept out of the SRD, and even then, apparently some company really push their limits. For example, there is a product that features "mind flayers" which are not included in the SRD, but they are never referred to as illithids in the book and are actually given another similar name as a race name. Its a pretty obvious one though.
Beholders, yuan-ti, illithids, and a few others that slip my mind right now don't show up in the SRD. But to your question, yes, dark elves, or drow are.
I think the actual mythological term for dark elves was Trow, but I can't be certain. I beleive they were from Norse mythology (hey, Thor fought dark elves in the Marvel comics series . . . oddly they didn't look anything like Drizzt). |
| Lady Morbannaon |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 02:04:39
quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
I remmeber reading somewhere that Drow are actually from real world mythology (One of the islands north of Scotland I think) so like Goblins, Ogres and Trolls WWizards couldnt copyright them
Thanks for your answer I didn't know that and i'll have to look into the mythology if it is true, my partner is from Scotland so his mother may know more.
I'm wondering how far an author can push it though without being sort of obvious the drow in the book i'm reading are described as ' dark and distant cousins of the elves who live underground in vast cities and are of dark in colouring'
Any thoughts? |
| Dargoth |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 01:59:38
I remmeber reading somewhere that Drow are actually from real world mythology (One of the islands north of Scotland I think) so like Goblins, Ogres and Trolls WWizards couldnt copyright them |
| Lady Morbannaon |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 01:57:58
And i've just noticed the title of this topic is A drow ogl, that'll teach me to type quickly and not go over what i've written sorry if i got any one confused! |
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