| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| The Sage |
Posted - 01 Aug 2005 : 06:23:43
I'm moving this here, to keep both scrolls neat and tidy -
quote:
Originally posted by Melfius
Mayhap we should should construct three lists here:
Natural Wonders of Faerūn
Man-Made Wonders of Faerūn
Divine Wonders of Faerūn
An example of Divine Wonders would be the Well of Spells referenced on pg.5 of Volo's Guide to All Things Magical
quote:
Originally posted by Gray Richardson
There are 3 deep trenches in the Sea of Fallen Stars that descend to unplumbed depths.
As for man-made wonders (well, dwarf-made anyway) there is a really cool bridge, the Stone Bridge that spans the River Dessarin which was built by dwarves 5,000 years ago. It is a mile long, 100 feet wide and 150 feet tall. I think it should qualify as one of the wonders of the ancient world.
|
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Faramicos |
Posted - 17 Aug 2005 : 11:35:44
I will go home and make a brief summary on the Wailing Dwarf and post it here tomorrow. |
| Alaundo |
Posted - 17 Aug 2005 : 08:43:08
quote:
Originally posted by hammer of Moradin
So, are we looking for where the information is found, or a brief description of them that someone puts together?
Well met
Both, my dear hammer. We don't do things by halves around here, remember  |
| hammer of Moradin |
Posted - 17 Aug 2005 : 04:55:35
So, are we looking for where the information is found, or a brief description of them that someone puts together? |
| Alaundo |
Posted - 16 Aug 2005 : 17:20:02
quote:
Originally posted by Faramicos
Then lets get to it guys... Lets find the books and which page the description is on. Then it will be easy to fit the new official wonders of the realms into an adventure... Perhaps we could even get the new tome "Mortal Made Wonders of the Realms" written and stored here in Candlekeep. Lets ask Alaundo.
Well met
Indeed, Faramicos. I would be happy to see a scribe pen down some details on these particular locales as a summary  |
| Faramicos |
Posted - 16 Aug 2005 : 11:28:37
Then lets get to it guys... Lets find the books and which page the description is on. Then it will be easy to fit the new official wonders of the realms into an adventure... Perhaps we could even get the new tome "Mortal Made Wonders of the Realms" written and stored here in Candlekeep. Lets ask Alaundo. |
| Melfius |
Posted - 16 Aug 2005 : 10:57:50
quote:
Originally posted by Lady Kazandra
quote:
Originally posted by Melfius
Some will be easy (Myth Drannor, Undermountain) so you can bet I can find that, but others (The Wailing Dwarf, The Dragonwall) have limited notations, like novels.
I wouldn't call the write-up for the Wailing Dwarf in Dwarves Deep limited. It's pretty comprehensive and gives a good detailing of the stronghold.
Okay, I'll admit it - I forgot where it was!  |
| Lady Kazandra |
Posted - 16 Aug 2005 : 05:20:08
quote:
Originally posted by Melfius
Some will be easy (Myth Drannor, Undermountain) so you can bet I can find that, but others (The Wailing Dwarf, The Dragonwall) have limited notations, like novels.
I wouldn't call the write-up for the Wailing Dwarf in Dwarves Deep limited. It's pretty comprehensive and gives a good detailing of the stronghold.
|
| Melfius |
Posted - 16 Aug 2005 : 03:13:40
We have our winners! YAY!!!! 
Our list of the Seven Mortal-Made Wonders of the Realms are:
Myth Drannor (18 votes - WOW!)
Undermountain (6 votes)
The Wailing Dwarf (5 votes)
The Dragonwall (3 votes)
Candlekeep (2 votes - sorry Alaundo!)
Spirit Soaring (2 votes)
The Moonbridge (2 votes - thanks Shadovar!)
Now for some write-ups. First, I would ask for help from everyone to post locations of as much lore as possible on these Wonders. Some will be easy (Myth Drannor, Undermountain) so you can bet I can find that, but others (The Wailing Dwarf, The Dragonwall) have limited notations, like novels.
Thanks in advance! |
| Melfius |
Posted - 06 Aug 2005 : 03:54:55
The poll is posted! Cast yer votes NOW! |
| RAKKIR |
Posted - 05 Aug 2005 : 21:52:09
I would like to chime in with an idea.
I think we need to restrict a "wonder" to a SINGLE thing. I've been thinking about this and it means a few of my other suggestions have to go off the list. Such as Deep Imaskar.
It was the "Hanging Gardens of Babylon" not "Babylon in general." Likewise it was "The Lighthouse of Alexandria," not "Alexandria."
This means, in my mind, that a few things have to come off the list, such as "Cormanthyr" and "Deep Imaskar." I think the flying Enclave of Iolioum barely squeaks by as one thing because a FLOATING MOUNTAIN (the base of the enclave) is impressive enough to stand as a wonder all by itself. Even before you add a city to the top of it. The city just may add a little iceing.
I think if we start adding whole cities it defeats the purpose. Because then I can just say "Arabel...well, now that I think about it...CORMYR itself is pretty much a wonder...well, hell, why not just throw in the ENTIRE MOONSEA region too just for good measure."
Therefore, I think our items need to be ONE thing.
Like The Wailing Dwarf of Undermountain or Candlekeep.
I think that the items need to be SINGLE things. |
| Melfius |
Posted - 05 Aug 2005 : 18:40:15
Well, let's think about this. Would the ancient Egyptians have thought that their Giza pyramid was a wonder? Or would they have just thought, "Eh, we're pretty good at this pyramid-building thing. Let's make one bigger." |
| Faramicos |
Posted - 05 Aug 2005 : 15:40:22
Good idea with the poll. Good to see what people think... About the ruins, my oppinion is that to qualify for the title of WONDER the structure had to qualify when it was complete and unharmed. |
| Melfius |
Posted - 05 Aug 2005 : 15:30:31
Okay, maybe I should open a poll at this point and see how everyone votes. What do you think? |
| Melfius |
Posted - 05 Aug 2005 : 15:29:38
Just a minor correction here: it was the Lighthouse of Alexandria, not the Library, that is on our 'real-world' list. Sorry! |
| The Sage |
Posted - 05 Aug 2005 : 14:15:45
Remember, I only said a MINOR wonder.
quote:
Originally posted by Faramicos
A ruin c can, in mt mind, only be a wonder if the structure stood as a WONDER before its destruction. Simply because it is a vast and fascinating ruin doesnt make it a wonder.
I disagree. The ruins of Bhaulin, unlike most of the ruinous places in the Realms, are remarkably well-preserved. These ruins have likely provided centuries of wonder and amazement for the many generations of people who have inhabited the region.
And let's not forget that this was once a great stronghold of the Imaskari -- that in itself should suggest that the ruins warrant some serious consideration.
|
| Faramicos |
Posted - 05 Aug 2005 : 10:14:51
A ruin c can, in mt mind, only be a wonder if the structure stood as a WONDER before its destruction. Simply because it is a vast and fascinating ruin doesnt make it a wonder. It would remove some of the glory in the concept of a wonder if a ruin could qualify simply because it is a ruin... I would like to hear if there is more to the Raurin city of Bhaulin besides it being a ruin. What was it like before its destruction? |
| The Sage |
Posted - 05 Aug 2005 : 02:35:27
For the minor-listing of man-made wonders... I'd also consider the Raurin city of Bhaulin -- the Drowned City. It's believed to be over four thousand years old and the ruins are quite extensive. Bhaulin is one of the last strongholds of the ancient Imaskar Empire.
See The Horde boxed set for more information.
|
| Melfius |
Posted - 05 Aug 2005 : 02:21:12
Well, I am trying to keep this down to seven, and I thought these were more impressive. No? |
| DDH_101 |
Posted - 05 Aug 2005 : 02:13:51
You forgot the Moon Bridge. |
| Melfius |
Posted - 05 Aug 2005 : 00:15:19
Okay, let's keep this going! Here's an updated list:
Undermountain
Candlekeep
Cormanthyr
Deep Imaskar
The Dragonwall
The Wailing Dwarf
Ioulaum Enclave
Wow. These are really looking great!
Any last-minute suggestions? |
| Faramicos |
Posted - 03 Aug 2005 : 16:30:51
The fact is just that it isnt a WONDER if it is easily copied or if there is hundreds of examples of structures like it or even some more marveleous around the world. This is the modern thesarus explanation of the word WONDER: "marvel, miracle, nonpareil, oddity, phenomenon, portent, prodigy, rara avis, rarity, sensation, sight, spectacle, stunner, wonderment"... These just dont aply if it is a sight seen daily. The WONDER have to be a stand alone achievement of architecture. You have to lose your breath when you see it and you have to marvel at the beauty or complexity of it. There werent build hundreds of great pyramids because it took to much to create them and the library of Alexandria werent copied because it was of so vast proportions that it would be impossible to collect so much knowledge elsewhere, at that time... I hope you can understand my point. It realy have to be something special to be a WONDER... Or else the word will lose its meaning. |
| RAKKIR |
Posted - 03 Aug 2005 : 15:27:46
I want to take something off my list as I was thinking about this. I don't think Shade belongs on the list.
However, I don't think the Karsus enclave belongs on the list.
I think that should go to Iolioum's enclave. Which was the first.
Everything else was just a grander copy.
My reasoning is this:
The Empire State Building is one of the seven modern-wonders of the world.
Sure, since it's has been built a lot of "bigger" and "grander" buildings have been made, and it is no longer the tallest.
However, it -WAS- groundbreaking in it's day (even though several other buildings constructed at the same time were close.).
My point however is, that it was the FIRST. Even though "bigger and better" copies came along later, it was the FIRST. That's why it stands out.
Hence, this is why I think Iolioum's enclave should stand above the Karsus enclave. |
| RAKKIR |
Posted - 03 Aug 2005 : 15:18:34
I still stand by the Hosttower of the Arcane
There reallyl hasn't been a single picture of it (to my knowledge, though Volo's Guide to the North MIGHT have it.) outside of the Forgotten Realms Atlas. If you see it in the FR atlas you realize how big it is! It's freaking huge.....hundreds and hundreds of feet tall shaped like a giant tree with one main trunk then four spindly branches. It's obvious titanic magic keeps it up otherwise it would collapse under it's own weight. Remember, not all the wonders of the ancient world had to be "super huge" to qualify. MOST were pretty large, but some (hanging gardens/Temple of Zeus) were not necessarily huge. They were just stunning specimens of architecture/engineering or the thing people just marveled at.
And the reason I nominated the Herald's Holdfast is it is a place of knowledge that people make trips to see. Just like the Library of Alexandria. Of course, Candlekeep would probably be a more appropriate example of this. |
| Asgetrion |
Posted - 03 Aug 2005 : 13:09:52
Melfius, I don't think too many people in Faerun have heard about the splendor of the Karsus Enclave (isn't it 'Jiksidur' in LEoF?). But that applies only if we use the phrase "most people must know about it" as a qualifying method.
Personally I would like to add Myth Lharast to this list, as there are legends about it in Amn and Tethyr.
|
| Faramicos |
Posted - 03 Aug 2005 : 10:19:20
Remember my fellow sages that a WONDER should be something awestriking in size or beauty, it should be unique and irreplacable. We need to consider the requirements for a wonder. Many architectural structures are impressing and beautiful, but they are simply not as special as to be considered a WONDER. Think of the likes of the great pyramids and the great wall of China, or the likes of them... Realy unique and impressing in all aspects. |
| Melfius |
Posted - 03 Aug 2005 : 03:18:55
I'd like to use somewheres like the Elven Court, but what I want to make sure of is that it stands out above the rest in some way. If it is to be the Eleven Court, what about it makes it grander, more wonderful, than any other elven settlement/city? |
| DDH_101 |
Posted - 03 Aug 2005 : 02:29:53
Castle Perilious: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/FR_ART/Places/CastlePerilous.jpg
Elven Court of Cormanthyr: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/FR_ART/Places/ElvencourtinCormanthor.jpg |
| Melfius |
Posted - 03 Aug 2005 : 01:51:31
So noted, oh Sage! |
| The Sage |
Posted - 03 Aug 2005 : 01:28:44
quote:
Originally posted by Melfius
I actually was considering Deep Imaskar, but then it occurred to me - no one really knows about it yet.
Deep Imaskar should definitely be worthy of consideration regardless of how little most people in the Realms know about it. Both its creation and the end result would at the very least mark it as something "above-the-norm" for the Realms... so I'd place it on the "possible" list of man-made wonders.
|
| Melfius |
Posted - 02 Aug 2005 : 23:13:21
Okay, let's look at some of these wonderful suggestions! Please bear in mind that this is just my thinking on them. I would be more than happy to discuss them further if I am missing some crucial fact!
DDH has suggested Chasolné. I love the pic! I am hesitant to add it to the list, however, as it seems (to me, anyway) that the Wailing Dwarf would (pardon the pun) dwarf this creation.
RAKKIR has alot of great ideas, as well. Once the Watercourse Trilogy is out (and said canal is finished) it will most definitely make the list. Unless some deity decides to muddle into it of course! 
The Host-Tower and the Herald's Holdfast, while impressive for their architecture, really are no more than that - great architecture.
Shade, unfortunately, is really no different than your run-of-the-mill Enclave, with the exception that it still is in use. When compared to Karsus Enclave, it seems minor. Ditto for other Enclaves. I would just stick with Karsus Enclave.
I actually was considering Deep Imaskar, but then it occurred to me - no one really knows about it yet.
ode904 - Mithril Hall and Aghairon's Tower both fall under the same heading as the Host-Tower and Hearld's Holdfast (or the Ivy Mansion).
Folks, these are some great ideas! Please don't think I am just shooting things down out of hand. If you disagree, please tell me where and why. I am just offering my thoughts, and they have been wrong on many occasion! 
Keep 'em coming, please! |
