| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| jordanz |
Posted - 17 Nov 2012 : 21:33:09
Do petrified beings age? If not have there been any canonized instances of ancient (hundreds or thousands of years old)petrified beings getting turned back flesh and living normal lives? I would think such beings could serve as sources of valuable ancient information.
Also what about Undead? Are they immune to petrification? It seems strange that non corporeal undead could be turned to stone ... |
| 22 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| The Sage |
Posted - 25 Nov 2012 : 01:24:39
quote:
Originally posted by Derulbaskul
quote:
Originally posted by The SageUnless you already knew to what I was referring [and your query apparently suggests you're not], how can you assume I'm incorrect?
Simple.
Because the generic use of the title is not capitalised. It's only capitalised when used specifically.
And, again, you had no idea of whether I was using it generically or not. So, again, you cannot wholly assume that I was incorrect. You simply didn't have enough information to form your own conclusion. |
| Thieran |
Posted - 24 Nov 2012 : 18:39:11
quote:
Originally posted by Derulbaskul
quote:
Originally posted by The SageUnless you already knew to what I was referring [and your query apparently suggests you're not], how can you assume I'm incorrect?
Simple.
Because the generic use of the title is not capitalised. It's only capitalised when used specifically.
I don't think you caught our dear Sage's meaning. |
| Derulbaskul |
Posted - 24 Nov 2012 : 12:38:25
quote:
Originally posted by The SageUnless you already knew to what I was referring [and your query apparently suggests you're not], how can you assume I'm incorrect?
Simple.
Because the generic use of the title is not capitalised. It's only capitalised when used specifically. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 23 Nov 2012 : 20:48:09
I just like to keep things simple. Flesh to stone, stone to flesh ... if a lot of time passes between them and the stone statue gets a little weathered, cracked, eroded, and pigeoned then I might impose some penalty on the System Shock roll: failure equals death, success means person emerges whole and in very much the same condition as before. Perhaps a few millennia of being stoned might also induce some sort of debilitating "hibernation sickness" for a while.
It's a game mechanic and (as has been said) can serve as a narrative plot device. Magic is magic, it just works ... the more accurately we can explain it, the less magical it becomes. |
| Alystra Illianniis |
Posted - 21 Nov 2012 : 01:29:09
Wow, MT. I'm in full agreement with Erik there. Is this possible fodder for a future campaign? If not, it SHOULD be! |
| Erik Scott de Bie |
Posted - 20 Nov 2012 : 22:57:56
Jeez, Mark. That's pretty messed up. It's almost like you need to write that or something.
P.S. Do it!
Cheers |
| Markustay |
Posted - 20 Nov 2012 : 20:05:08
What if the petrified body is acting like a phylactory of sorts - the soul is essentially trapped on the Prime Until the statue is restored.
On the other hand, eventually I think the 'tie' would begin to break down, and at some point you could have the spirit (ghost) of a person haunting the very chamber their 'statue' is in. 
So, yeah, eventually the link would degrade enough where the soul was finally released. Imagine if the statue was turned to rubble, and the poor spirit was just hanging around the pile until it finally crumbled to dust.
Or, what happens if a bunch of statues are reduced to rubble, and those rocks are then (unknowingly?) used to build a wall. That would be one haunted wall!
I can see an evil ruler purposely creating such a wall, but just using the heads of the statues (still screaming in horror). Someone casts flesh to stone on the wall and you got yourself one gruesome wall of bloody heads. Now, imagine setting up some PCs to do just that - they find a scroll with the spell, and then later come across the 'wall of stone heads'. They use the spell, figuring they could just cut through the resulting flesh, and they wind up with quite a mess on their hands (literally). |
| Erik Scott de Bie |
Posted - 20 Nov 2012 : 15:58:13
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
EDIT: Would such a statue be useable as a ready-made body for a stone golem? That would be neat. Would the person's personality be trapped within, and could it eventually regain dominance over its form?
I'd presonally rule that a golem could not be animated if the form was already "occupied" by a sentience.
A valid perspective. My question would be, is it really "occupied," or is the sentience gone and just have the *potential* to return?
Take a flesh golem, for instance. Those are made out of raw materials that were once occupied by a "sentience," and stories are replete with "echoes" of that sentience creeping back into the golem's word and deed. For instance, a golem crafted from the flesh of a murderer might become murderous itself, above and beyond any orders issued to it. And of course, many a mad scientist (particularly but not only in Ravenloft) has attempted to resurrected a beloved friend or companion by crafting a flesh golem from said person's body, with mixed results.
Would a stone golem be so different?
Anyway. 'Tis an interesting subject for story.
Cheers
|
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 19 Nov 2012 : 20:17:49
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
What happens when one of Manshoon's clones gets petrified? (or any clone for that matter) Does another awaken, or would that be a fairly permanent way to nerf such magic? Petrification could really screw with contingencies, unless they were worded to cover that.
I would say this renders the clone unusable, until it is turned back to flesh.
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
EDIT: Would such a statue be useable as a ready-made body for a stone golem? That would be neat. Would the person's personality be trapped within, and could it eventually regain dominance over its form?
I'd presonally rule that a golem could not be animated if the form was already "occupied" by a sentience. |
| Erik Scott de Bie |
Posted - 19 Nov 2012 : 19:28:10
Hmm . . . these are all great ideas! This is what *I* would probably do at my table or in one of my stories.
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
As for the 'weathering' of such statues, wouldn't a simple cantrip take care of such minor damage? I would think most mages would know to do a simple 'housecleaning' magic before de-petrification. If not, I would assume a person who came from an older statue (or one exposed to the elements for awhile) would has cuts and scraps all over them (but not amounting to more then 1D3 of damage, tops).
A mending spell would probably be sufficient to repair a statue, or yeah, you might be looking at damage. If a statue suffers a major blow, I'd note how much damage it inflicted to the stone, and the character would then suffer all that damage (from whatever hit points he/she had at the time of petrification) upon being restored. If he/she receives the benefit of repair/mending spells, they would heal hit point damage based on the level of the spell. I would imagine stone shape would be the equivalent of a pretty good healing spell on a petrified character.
quote:
Which make me wonder about someone who has received a lethal blow but hasn't quite died yet. It would make for an interesting story ( *cough* Erik *cough*) for a group of adventurers to carry around a Medusa head just for such an occasion ("Quick! Bobby's been hit! Show him the head!") It would work along the lines of how some people get frozen RW until such a time a cure is found for what ails them.
So what happens when your guts are spilling out, and at the precise same moment you are petrified? Your friends would not want to un-petrify you until they were in a position to heal such horrific wounds. If they later died (and never came back for you), it would be an interesting statue for adventurers to find. 
Oh, the gruesome stories . . .
quote:
What happens when one of Manshoon's clones gets petrified? (or any clone for that matter) Does another awaken, or would that be a fairly permanent way to nerf such magic? Petrification could really screw with contingencies, unless they were worded to cover that.
For all intents and purposes, petrification is the same as death--you're no longer *alive,* and I don't think your soul is *trapped* in the statue, necessarily. If you are later the recipient of a stone to flesh spell, that's basically like being struck with a raise dead spell if you were just dead. Though that makes one wonder whether there's a time limit--perhaps after a long enough time, the soul just isn't interested in coming back, so when you stone-to-flesh, the person is just dead when they become flesh again. Maybe a saving throw of some kind is in order after a substantial length of time?
To harken back to the Manshoon example, yes, I think one of his clones getting petrified would indeed awaken the next clone. If the first clone became fleshy again, then there would be two Manshoon clones active at the same time, and we all know what happens when THAT comes to pass . . . WAR!!! 
quote:
And lastly, getting back to statues left out in the open. upon reanimation, I'd have the person make a Con roll or they'd get legionnaires disease - they have to be covered with pigeon-poo. 
Ick! But probably a valid concern.
quote:
EDIT: Would such a statue be useable as a ready-made body for a stone golem? That would be neat. Would the person's personality be trapped within, and could it eventually regain dominance over its form?
As I understand it, the wizard has to prepare the body him/herself, but a petrified person might be a valid set of materials (the wizard might not even be aware of the source of the statue). So yes, I could certainly see this happening, and I think it would make a very cool story.
Cheers |
| Markustay |
Posted - 19 Nov 2012 : 18:36:30
As for the 'weathering' of such statues, wouldn't a simple cantrip take care of such minor damage? I would think most mages would know to do a simple 'housecleaning' magic before de-petrification. If not, I would assume a person who came from an older statue (or one exposed to the elements for awhile) would has cuts and scraps all over them (but not amounting to more then 1D3 of damage, tops).
Which make me wonder about someone who has received a lethal blow but hasn't quite died yet. It would make for an interesting story ( *cough* Erik *cough*) for a group of adventurers to carry around a Medusa head just for such an occasion ("Quick! Bobby's been hit! Show him the head!") It would work along the lines of how some people get frozen RW until such a time a cure is found for what ails them.
So what happens when your guts are spilling out, and at the precise same moment you are petrified? Your friends would not want to un-petrify you until they were in a position to heal such horrific wounds. If they later died (and never came back for you), it would be an interesting statue for adventurers to find.
Too bad the Mage Lords never turned any of Elmister's family into statues - it would be pretty epic if he came across one.
What happens when one of Manshoon's clones gets petrified? (or any clone for that matter) Does another awaken, or would that be a fairly permanent way to nerf such magic? Petrification could really screw with contingencies, unless they were worded to cover that.
And lastly, getting back to statues left out in the open. upon reanimation, I'd have the person make a Con roll or they'd get legionnaires disease - they have to be covered with pigeon-poo.
EDIT: Would such a statue be useable as a ready-made body for a stone golem? That would be neat. Would the person's personality be trapped within, and could it eventually regain dominance over its form? |
| Erik Scott de Bie |
Posted - 19 Nov 2012 : 17:45:06
The answer's already been given, but in case we want a pseudo-official response . . . yes, a creature petified is frozen in time and does not age as a creature. If the petrification ends five minutes later or five thousand years later, the creature is in exactly the same state mentally as it was before--and, unless its memory is somehow affected (depending on the method of petrification or the conditions under which the statue was preserved) in the exact same moment. It's entirely likely the subject will immediately recoil or finish the cry of fear it was sounding as it was turned to stone.
And indeed, if the statue is damaged, the unpetrified creature suffers the same loss. A broken off stone hand becomes a severed hand. It depends on circumstance whether this leads to open wounds, but generally the petrification hits your entire set of substances (blood vessels, bone, etc.), which are all unpetrified in exactly the state they are in while petrified.
It depends on the magic as to whether whether the subject's smaller details (like facial features, etc) are altered by being stoned and then being un-stoned. Some petrification creates perfect statues, which would then become perfect, highly-detailed figures (so damaging the facial features of the statue might well translate to the unpetrified creature), while some petrification magic causes a creature to become a rough statue of itself, in which case the unpetrified creature would probably get its same features back (minus any large structural damage like a severed hand, etc).
I may or may not do something just like this in a story one day. You never know.
The undead question is a good one, and my answer is generally "it depends" on the method of petrification. The "flesh to stone" spell would seem logically to target flesh--incorporeal undead do not have flesh, per se, so I would rule that they are unaffected (or, better, that the spell slows them down for a while, but they eventually fight it off). Skeletons don't have flesh, exactly, but their corporeal bodies are just as valid a target as a living person.
But when you're talking about a creature like a medusa or a cockatrice . . . well, the issue gets a little murkier. Basically, if it makes sense to you, the DM, it makes sense at your D&D table.
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Derulbaskul
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
In cases where petrification lasts more then four hours, contact your doctor. 
In cases where petrification lasts more then four hours, contact your Doctor.
...
That's better. 
Why the capitalisation? (You're incorrect, BTW.)
Unless you already knew to what I was referring [and your query apparently suggests you're not], how can you assume I'm incorrect?
Trust me, I'm the Doctor?
Cheers |
| The Sage |
Posted - 19 Nov 2012 : 08:19:44
quote:
Originally posted by Derulbaskul
4E is very specific about what the condition "petrified" means:
- The creature is unconscious.
- The creature has resist 20 to all damage.
- The creature doesn’t age.
Usually a creature is subjected to this condition when it is turned to stone, such as by a medusa. Often the only way to end this condition is by using a power or a magical ritual.
Normally, a creature falls prone when it becomes unconscious. The DM might decide that a petrified creature instead remains upright, posed like a statue.
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
In cases where petrification lasts more then four hours, contact your doctor.
In cases where petrification lasts more then four hours, contact your Doctor.
...
That's better.
Why the capitalisation? (You're incorrect, BTW.)
Unless you already knew to what I was referring [and your query apparently suggests you're not], how can you assume I'm incorrect? |
| Derulbaskul |
Posted - 19 Nov 2012 : 05:55:35
4E is very specific about what the condition "petrified" means:
- The creature is unconscious.
- The creature has resist 20 to all damage.
- The creature doesn’t age.
Usually a creature is subjected to this condition when it is turned to stone, such as by a medusa. Often the only way to end this condition is by using a power or a magical ritual.
Normally, a creature falls prone when it becomes unconscious. The DM might decide that a petrified creature instead remains upright, posed like a statue.
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
In cases where petrification lasts more then four hours, contact your doctor.
In cases where petrification lasts more then four hours, contact your Doctor.
...
That's better.
Why the capitalisation? (You're incorrect, BTW.) |
| The Sage |
Posted - 19 Nov 2012 : 00:35:22
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
In cases where petrification lasts more then four hours, contact your doctor.
In cases where petrification lasts more then four hours, contact your Doctor.
...
That's better. |
| Markustay |
Posted - 18 Nov 2012 : 21:36:39
In cases where petrification lasts more then four hours, contact your doctor. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 18 Nov 2012 : 18:59:07
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Khelben had an petrified illithid in his yard that got turned back after quite some time.
Said illithid was petrified by the original Xanathar, in the comics. |
| Markustay |
Posted - 18 Nov 2012 : 17:19:53
Khelben had an petrified illithid in his yard that got turned back after quite some time. |
| Hoondatha |
Posted - 18 Nov 2012 : 15:00:15
Agreed. There are instances of creatures getting de-stoned perfectly fine a long time after they were turned to stone. Storm talks about it in either Cloak of Shadows or All Shadows Fled. The worry once someone is stoned becomes whether or not the statue takes damage or ages. If it doesn't, your person should be fine. If it does (loses arms, whatever, then the person suffers the same loss. |
| Kentinal |
Posted - 18 Nov 2012 : 12:37:29
I looked at a few rule books to only offer a guess right now as the best I can do.
It would appear that a creature turned to stone does not age as a creature, however might age as a statue. That is the creature in statue form would be same age as when turned to stone as when returned to flesh. A creature does not die of old age because was statue for thousand of years. Creature aging stops, however statue aging can occur. That is wind can weather, parts could be broken off off the statue that was frozen in stone for many years. |
| Artemas Entreri |
Posted - 18 Nov 2012 : 05:11:55
My groups would always play being petrified as being dead. |
| Bladewind |
Posted - 17 Nov 2012 : 23:23:33
It not spelled out in the rules but I'd say no, petrified beings dont age. It was a plot device in a NWN FR (Shadows of Udrentide sp.?)game to get the main character to pass considerable time.
Undead are not immune, but incorporeal undead are only half of the times affected by it (unless the caster of the Flesh to Stone is on the ethereal plane), and they turn to ethereal statues unable to be affected on the material plane. Besides, one can debate wether manifested incorporeal undead have flesh that counts as a a legal target. |
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