| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Slavorian Nightrunner |
Posted - 11 May 2012 : 03:46:32
so the Ssri-tel-quessir is now returned to their place among the elven races. might anyone have a guess as to the racial stats of the Dark Elves? |
| 12 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Lord Karsus |
Posted - 14 May 2012 : 02:13:02
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Some stayed kind of wild and remained greens, or civilised a touch and became wood [copper] elves.
-RoF claimed that Wood Elves came into existence because of "Wild" Elves (which wouldn't be very wild, if you think about it) were interbreeding and intermixing with Moon Elves and Sun Elves (and presumably Star Elves, in certain places). We know this isn't really how offspring among mixed Elven subrace pairings works, so it's poppycock in my book, but... |
| Markustay |
Posted - 12 May 2012 : 04:03:37
My current theory is that the wild elves are the dark elves that were not of Ilythiir stock.
This means that in 4e, the redeemed elves are really nothing new - they are the Ilythiir wild elves returned to their original appearance.
From my work on the Elves of Faerūn project, I deduced that the Ilythiir were one of the most prolific of the 'great clans' of elves that left Faerie, along with with the Vanir (silver/light elves) and others, but their were many smaller septs (minor clans) that were of various racial stocks. There were even offshoot-tribes from major clans, like the Miyeritar (who broke from the Ilythirir, thus having Ilythiiri blood).
The one major difference - other then size - between the Great Clans and the minor were that there were a mixture of racial types amongst them (probably due to marriages/interbreeding), so we have some anomalies (although one sub-race was usually predominant). For instance, one of the most heavily inter-mixed great Clans was the Nesti - just be glad Toril got none of those. 
Anyhow - violent, xenophobic, feral - you can see how easy it is to say the Drow came from Wild Elven stock (which is a sub-group of the Sylvan/Green Elves). In my fantasy entomology (which is NOT the study of Ents), I've made it so that Gru-Agach literally translates to 'wild tribe'. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 12 May 2012 : 01:53:29
Indeed.
It seems that the issue many have with the origins of the wood elves and wild elves in 3e is based on previous lore -- the fact that most of the 1e/2e FR sourcebooks make the connection between wild and wood elves and how they were essentially the same race. Elaine Cunningham's novels during 2e that feature wood/wild elven characters also portray this and she has made comments about it here at Candlekeep.
Then in 3e, we had Races of Faerūn telling us that in the aftermath of the savage Crown Wars, it was then that the green elves went in one of two racial directions -- leading to the split in 1e/2e Green/Wood/Wild Elves that we now see in 3e. Some stayed kind of wild and remained greens, or civilised a touch and became wood [copper] elves. |
| Lord Karsus |
Posted - 11 May 2012 : 22:45:44
-I generally use the term 'Wood Elves', but 3e appropriated the term and spun it incorrectly, so then as a result, some people get their panties all twisted when I call them 'Wood Elves'. 'Sylvan Elves' is a nice replacement- though, aren't 'Sylvan Elves' something else in 2e Greyhawk? |
| Markustay |
Posted - 11 May 2012 : 22:34:27
I just use the term 'Sylvan' rather then 'Green', because its less confusing.
Ergo, you have Sylvan Elves, and you have Eladrin Elves, which means we still have the two major Tolkienesque branches of the race (which are further divided into dozens, if not hundreds, of sub-races).
I have no problem with it. Its kinda funny that the word these days for 'dark green' is 'Hunter' - kinda fitting, no?
Just be glad we don't have light green elves as well... but I suppose Avocado Elves might be found somewhere in Maztica.
If you recall, LK, I had theorized my hypothetical 'brown elves' (nomadic) were of dark green stock, but not Ilythiiri. This is the ethnic group most commonly found in Zakhara, but clusters can be found elsewhere as well (the Poscader Elves of lower Anchorome and that odd tribe in The Raurin).
The basic premise is brown elves are nomadic, and prefer plains and other 'open areas' to forest, but lead a very similar lifestyle, and have many cultural facets, in common with wood elves (yes, its a rather obvious likening of elves to Native Americans). In 4e, the Elves of Elfharrow would be along the lines of the brown elves. |
| Irennan |
Posted - 11 May 2012 : 20:56:51
Add the Spellplague cataclysmic consequences to that and -alas- most of them are probably dead now, turning Lolth's children efforts into something totally pointless at the end of the day. |
| Lord Karsus |
Posted - 11 May 2012 : 20:14:44
-Right. Only a small number of Drow "reverted" into Dark Elves to begin with. Couple that with the fact that (A) 100 or so years have passed since that happened and (B) that would put them in a distinct disadvantage in both mainstream Lolthite Drow society and in the Underdark, both distinctly competitive and challenging environments, and there's no reason for Dark Elves to really get all that much of a focus when it's relatively improbable for a 'shattered' group such as themselves to get themselves on their feet and do anything particularly worthwhile. |
| Thauranil |
Posted - 11 May 2012 : 15:34:04
That seems a bit lazy but frankly you don't hear anything at all about the dark elves anymore , not as much as a mercenary wizard or a rogue weapons master in the novels.
But i suppose there weren't many in the first place and those few souls must be constantly hunted by the drow. |
| Lord Karsus |
Posted - 11 May 2012 : 04:55:24
-Indeed. I used to couple it with assorted curses, and "What the hell was the reason for that?", but I just don't care enough anymore. |
| Slavorian Nightrunner |
Posted - 11 May 2012 : 04:19:05
hmmm. |
| Lord Karsus |
Posted - 11 May 2012 : 04:17:40
-Dark Elves were retconned in AGHotRin principle to have been Green Elves all along (in principle, as in nothing ever said that they weren't, but for all intents and purposes they weren't, since nothing ever said that they were). So, whatever edition of D&D you use, they use those stats, whatever Green Elf stats are. |
| sfdragon |
Posted - 11 May 2012 : 03:51:26
they are either elf or eladrin with dusky brown skin and black hair. |
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