| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| D-brane |
Posted - 28 Apr 2010 : 11:42:14
Just a general query about something I've always wondered when considering many of the talents Realmslore scribes here at the 'keep.
So basically . . . . How do you go about creating or writing lore for either your home games or for subjects here at Candlekeep? Do you study sources before hand, or perceive a need for new lore about an existing branch of setting material?
This is the kind of stuff I'm curious about. So let's hear from you all (and any designers who want to contribute to this discussion are more than welcome---I want to hear from you as well). |
| 11 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| xaviera |
Posted - 09 May 2010 : 23:13:58
I wanted to flesh out my cleric of Sharess (so to speak), to be able to act as a priestess rather than simply mouthing vague oaths (eg. "Bast's bounteous boobs!"  ), and to be able to hold theological discussions on why her religion was so amazing (beyond the obvious, that is  ) - it was a need that developed out of a desire to roleplay the character more fully. I read all that I could find on the goddess and then started writing stuff that I felt fit with the limited amount of official lore, the world in which I was playing and my own inclinations. Since I'm acting as a player and not a DM in that capacity, anything I publish is prefaced by an 'explanatory note' indicating that it's just one person's interpretation.
When I did DM it was never in any published world so I've always just made up my own stuff out of whole cloth, on the fly if need be. Often I'd run across an interesting idea from history or from a book and incorporate that into my own campaign. Sometimes even a word or a passing description of something will conjure up an idea that later develops into an entire area.
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| Basil the Geek |
Posted - 02 May 2010 : 05:41:16
For me as a DM, it’s all about what the players are looking for in the campaign. I begin by asking each person privately what he or she is looking for in the game, character types, personality profiles, backgrounds and the direction they hope to go in and what end they imagine having.
After the interviews I then spend about a month or more mulling over key concepts of the various players’ desires in relation to the genre to formulate sample details, plot and subplot outlines. This part of the process can get complicated for a Forgotten Realms campaign as there are a multitude of resources available covering a densely detailed history making it easy to flesh out but somewhat difficult at times to be original while not crowding out canon and keeping the experienced Realms lawyers guessing and or entertained.
Eventually a series of campaign options emerge as the details get roughed out as I synthesize all the player desires with information I uncover during the research. I then return to the individual players to make my pitch for the creative thread I think will be the most fun for everyone. The story I secretly select is then refined over another month or so through more study and subtle interrogation of the players to maximize entertainment potential and desired experiences along with a few surprise psychological twists I aim squarely into manipulating a players individual subconscious desires/fears that they might only be dimly aware of.
I’ve found these emotional hooks can also be good for keeping the well read Realms Lawyers entertained, in character, and somewhat metagaming distracted.
Finally I give the players the choice of one of three roughly outlined characters each tailored to his/her needs with plenty of room left over for personal taste fleshing out remaining details. We then get everyone introduced, up to speed in a highly localized and narrative heavy intro pregame game and then onto the official campaign that the players pretty much drive as I generate plot/environmental reactions to their choices between sessions.
An example would be last year’s games. I normally don’t run groups larger than five unless the players are really good and this time I ended up with ten players. One group desired a magic heavy, save the world, action epic with loads of BOOM, while another desired strong character focus, role play, and a grittier, down to earth style yet both wanted to cross over to the other game now and then. A comparison might be; one group wanted Battle Star Galactica while the other Firefly.
Worse yet, the bang, swoosh, zoom group desired Netherese involvement (not the shades) and a flying enclave to play around in while the gritty crowed desired to start in the Highdale coming of age the year before the Time of Troubles and to try out some of the last 3.5 character and prestige classes that came out, especially psionic.
Ugggggh… (not the psi but the complexities)
Well, the enclave concept was actually pretty easily done by simply adapting an old idea I had from another campaign played decades earlier that resembles the Matrix movies. In this adaptation, Ioullaum’s enclave Xinlanal is obliterated in the Netherese diaspora while its inhabitants survive having psychically merged at the last moment with a sentient Mythallar into a virtual Forgotten Realms. In this reality, Karsus succeeds and the virtual reality runs under the god like collective denial of its inhabitants.
Meanwhile, in the real realms, the millions of Xin shards blew into the stratosphere to later rain back down upon Faerun, its collective consciousness still intact, trans-dimensionally dispersed like some psychic fractal. They eventually become much sought after psicrystals...
In that campaign the player’s adventure to discover some of the philosophic, what if, horrors of virtual reality all the while pursued by agents, if you will, trying to force them to conform, rewrite their memories, or simply erase (permanently kill) them. Later they discover a way out and things get really crazy in a Logan's Run sort of way.
Meanwhile…
The other group’s desires necessitated a lot of study having chosen a few odd angles, including one player reading some of Ed Bonny’s Jhaamdath work desiring to be a variant Barbarian and Wilder, another player wanting to eventually try out the Monastic Servant of Auppenser from some sort of Savras Archivist direction, an eventual Cormyrian Purple Dragon, a Ranger wannabe harper and finally the last player wanted to try out Erudite and eventually go Psychic Archivist. Sheeesh, and all of them starting out first level a few years before the Time of Troubles!
During my study of Lost Empires of Faerun I found the story of Dordrien and his survivors fleeing to later Daggerdale to establish a town. From that information I simply created an offshoot group of those colonists who had a dispute deciding to go it their own way. I put the small colony near the High Dale in the Thunder Peaks and gave them a bit of history to excuse turning them all into eventual Barbarians many generations later. Imagine the cultural trauma that could occur having your nation torn apart by civil war then erased by some frighteningly powerful, genocidal enemy.
I simply created a culture full of guilt and fearful of wrathful Elves, who simply wanted to disappear never to attract attention ever again. They degenerated into barbarity in only a few generations and even went so far as to actively attempt to breed out psionics with some success. With Siembia on one side, Cormyr to the other, nasties in the mountains and under the ground and Zents sniffing about all on the doorstep of the Time of Troubles, the adventures pretty much fell into place.
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| Halidan |
Posted - 01 May 2010 : 01:24:33
Cyril Lokner has said most of what I wanted to add to this topic, so I have only a short addition. That is that I add lore that fits in with my player's character backgrounds and with their goals.
I'm fortunate. Most of my players will submit 1-3 pages of well thought out background with their characters. I use these ideas - a lot. One of my players wanted his family to run an apple orchard just outside of Shadowdale. I knew from one of Ed's posts that apples aren't found in the Dales, but I didn't let that stop me. I added to his character background thatone of his grandfathers was an adventuring druid - part of the now defunct Shadowdale druids circle.
Not only did his grandfather bring apples to his farm in Shadowdale after a journey to another Prime Material, but we spent a fair amount of that campaign investigating who killed all of the Shadowdale druids (including the PC's aunt) and bringing them to justice. It was a great adventure arc and completely unplaned. And the best of all was the look on all my players faces when the arc was brought to a conclusion, and the villians defeated. They had really accomplished something outside of the usual campaign.
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| Jorkens |
Posted - 30 Apr 2010 : 18:10:32
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
While I would second nearly everything Jorkens says, I would also add that for me I get ideas from others sources - Movies, TV, non-FR novels, etc... - and then use my knowledge of the Realms to figure out how something similar could be worked-in. NEVER a direct copy, mind you - sometimes so many changes are made to the original concept during 'Realmsification' that it bears little resemblance to the source of the inspiration (as it should be).
Almost everything? How is it possible to disagree with anything said by me on any subject?
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| Markustay |
Posted - 30 Apr 2010 : 16:35:53
While I would second nearly everything Jorkens says, I would also add that for me I get ideas from others sources - Movies, TV, non-FR novels, etc... - and then use my knowledge of the Realms to figure out how something similar could be worked-in. NEVER a direct copy, mind you - sometimes so many changes are made to the original concept during 'Realmsification' that it bears little resemblance to the source of the inspiration (as it should be). |
| Jorkens |
Posted - 29 Apr 2010 : 09:20:57
The idea comes first. It might come from reading through a Realms-product or it could be from another source. Some times its pure whimsy. I then try to fit it in with the Realms in some way, skimming through sources that might contain some elements I want to use, taking notes along the way. Then its just a matter of adjusting the Realms lore to the idea as much as needed. If the Canon goes against something I really like or which fits my somewhat modified view of the Realms, then out it goes. No sources are holy, but I tend to follow the "older lore before new lore" idea, in addition to looking most carefully at anything by Ed. But in the end I decide.
The end result is, that by now, it would be impossible for me to run (or write about for that matter) the canon Realms even if I wanted to. I have to bad a memory and to many years of ideas and modifications to be able to go back. |
| bladeinAmn |
Posted - 29 Apr 2010 : 05:49:21
quote:
Originally posted by D-brane
(Snip)
So basically . . . . How do you go about creating or writing lore for either your home games or for subjects here at Candlekeep? Do you study sources before hand, or perceive a need for new lore about an existing branch of setting material?
(Snip)
I think any good DM will tell you that its an assortment of things.
For me, I was introduced to FR in '03 w/the purchase of the BG2-SoA C-RPG. Later in the same year, I wanted to explore Toril further, and thus began w/the lore from the game, the AD&D game mechanics from the book w/the game, various lore tidbits by Ed from the Wizards website, various lore from the old www.toril.info website (of which most I didn't understand in the perfect contexts that I do now) and a colour-printed 3e FR map.
From '03 to '05, I would juss stare and stare and stare at the map, often for hours at a time. For real. After initial familiarization, I'd figure out where it'd be logical where I could establish additional human and demihuman civilizations in Amn, Tethyr, and the Baldur's Gate area would be (judging the fertility of the landscape and the relative closeness to other cities, so to band together against monstrous invasions efficiently, as neccessary). Then I'd figure out where the monstrous humanoids would have their settlements and attack-and-retreat bases.
That's how I started my initial ability to DM low-to-mid-level wargaming in the Realms, using BG2's 2e rules and xp tables.
Then I began surfing CK and other FR websites, and adding more non-canon lore (such as the village of "Sanctuary" in the Misty Forest), and understanding the canon-lore from that old toril.info website, and thus enhance the stories to accompany the wargaming.
Then in '05, I got the Lands of Intrigue PDF, and every aspect of my homebrew, including my ability to create the storylines for my campaigns, juss went up tenfold. That sourcebook's storylines are all very open-ended, and do an outstanding job of initiating the potential DM to delve deep into the human psyche, such as the various motives that evil ppl have for the things they do, neutral and good ppl the same, what folk can and have learned from history, and the mistakes that folk make when allowing history to repeat itself.
So the combination of the BG C-RPG series, the complimentary programs thereof that dug into the game system for to dub as a Monster Manual, the game's 2e game mechanics, LoI, and various info from websites all combined, were the initial things to inspire my campaigns in terms of geography, wargaming, and the creating of original storylines. I've since procured a number of other sourcebooks (such as some of the Volo's Guides), and they only enhance everything, due to the solid lore they offer, and the limitless storylines they offer thereafter, due to the way they're written.
Since that time, I've taken a great example from how BG2-SoA was written; and that is to not limit your sources of inspiration to juss FR lore. There are a number of instances in the game that refer to things from Planescape and SpellJammer---the prior of which has a solid influence on my campaigns due to seemingly most Toril natives paying such attention and awareness to the gods and demigods beyond, the latter of which only has a subtle influence on my campaigns, much like how folk on Earth generally don't pay full attention to the inexplicable happenings in our skies---and even a quest regarding people from Krynn.
I follow that example by allowing everything from what I see in RL and my favourite movies and non-fantasy books to include in my campaign (ie-I got the details and characters from the PotC series sailing in my homebrew Sword Coast and Trackless Sea).
Even w/all that, I think the best way for a DM to maximize his/her creativity, is to NOT do it for the campaign they're running, but rather, juss to make stories to entertain themselves being the main goal in mind. That's how Stephen King grew to become the best book writer, IMO. He wrote for to satisfy himself first w/quality stories, and then w/that as his M.O., all his fanbase gets satisfied thereafter (as opposed to writing for the masses at the expense of his own enjoyment). That's how I began to write my campaigns, for my own enjoyment first, and I'm sure those who've been a part of my campaigns felt equally satisfied thereafter.
I mean, creating a storyline strictly for the players can be a good and exceedingly competent method in its own right. But if you do a storyline that satisfies you, independently of what others feel or say, then your campaign and skills as a DM can not only be competent, but also very inspired.
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| Cleric Generic |
Posted - 28 Apr 2010 : 18:26:53
Usually a bit of realms lore that I come across will inspire an idea for an adventure that I'll build on, which usually involves remodelling existing lore a bit. Case in point; my current game features a version of Gargauth that behaves more like Heath Ledger's Joker than what pure canon might suggest, and Deckon Thar has mutated into an undead city state ruled by not-completely-hostile ancient and sagely former bandit kings.
Somewhat less frequently, I'll come up with an idea for an event/major NPC/whatever and start looking for ways to integrate it into existing lore. Case in point; I wanted a Lovecraftian horror to drop out of the sky and start generating mutant zombie cults leading to a zombiepocalypse. Waterdeep proved to be an ample playground for such shenanigans, and the ancient Netherese were a good candidate for getting over involved in such things in their glory days.
Another thing I've often kept myself amused with is coming up with novel ways of integrating not strictly realmsian monsters, magic and other stuff into the setting. Examples; barghests being developed into the god-kings of various goblin tribes in the Rauvin mountains and generally being viciously intelligent and well informed, and Shadar-Kai being re-dubbed Dancers in Twilight and generally being creepy and associated with Shade. |
| Cyril Lokner |
Posted - 28 Apr 2010 : 17:08:06
I've shared some of my own Realmslore with all of you here, which can be accessed via the links in my signature. The way that I went about it was:
1) I picked an area that felt familiar to me. Part of it was the geography of Daggerdale and part of it was the frontier feeling that mimics how the history or my home state of South Dakota went through. Daggerdale, in a way, is home to me.
2) I've read and reread all the official lore I can find on Daggerdale and the immediate surrounding areas (Border Forest, Desertsmouth Mountains, Spiderhaunt Forest, Dagger Hills, Tarken Hills, etc.) and followed any lore trails that lead from those readings.
3) I then pick something that has been left undeveloped officially. Hadreth's Glen was mapped on the Forgotten Realms Interactive Atlas; Shattered Stone Orcs were introduced in the adventure The Return of Randal Morn; and Tachepp was mentioned in Elminster's Ecologies- The Settled Lands.
4) Once I've picked my topic, I then start refering to all the official lore I've read and start making some connections that make since given the information we have available. Then I just start filling in details, a little bit at a time. I refer to articles that other Candlekeep contributors have written, because I feel that they are the last "canon" writers since I have chosen not to move on to 4th ed. I pull in things from campaign journals here at Candlekeep as well, tweeking it as needed to fit official lore and other stuff I have stolen or came up with on my own to make the most cohesive story I can.
5) I submit it on these forums and wait for expert advice on what needs to be corrected and what I've missed. The scribes here really are experts and help me keep the Forgotten Realms feel.
Cheers,
Cyril Lokner
quote:
Originally posted by D-brane
Just a general query about something I've always wondered when considering many of the talents Realmslore scribes here at the 'keep.
So basically . . . . How do you go about creating or writing lore for either your home games or for subjects here at Candlekeep? Do you study sources before hand, or perceive a need for new lore about an existing branch of setting material?
This is the kind of stuff I'm curious about. So let's hear from you all (and any designers who want to contribute to this discussion are more than welcome---I want to hear from you as well).
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| Ashe Ravenheart |
Posted - 28 Apr 2010 : 16:32:29
(THO can prod me any time... *ahem*)
For me, it's one of two things:
1) Adventuring through the Realms in a game, generating our own lore for what goes on during the campaign.
2) Seeing a 'gap' in current lore and then going through the motions of 'wouldn't it be cool if...' |
| The Hooded One |
Posted - 28 Apr 2010 : 16:13:17
I prod Ed into opening his mouth or moving his fingers on a keyboard.
love,
THO |
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