| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Archimedes of Syracuse |
Posted - 22 Apr 2010 : 22:11:28
Iv been reading FR for about 11 years since 6th grade. I consider it a second home, i read daily and have never read a series i did not like. Iv never roll played in the FR because unfortunately i dont have those kinds of friends so i may not feel the personal closeness to the realms that some of you do. Hard to explain, i know how much i love the FR but i feel like having a character in the realms and living out a life in the realms just ads something more something i havent gotten to experience. Anyways iv been on these boards for years content to read what people have to say never wanting to put my two cents in, so i never made an account. But recently iv been reading so much negativity regarding the new realms that its gotten to the point where i am no longer excited about new books coming out. So i made a name just so i could post this. All i want is for people to come here and tell me positive things about the new realms. im honestly torn i cant decide if i love it or hate it so i just want some love to get me as passionate about the realms as i was a year ago. Thank You everyone. |
| 23 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Alisttair |
Posted - 26 Apr 2010 : 16:38:50
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone
I like Dragonborn.
I didn't like how they(WotC) implemented them.
Should have used the Falling Dragon Eggs hook. Thus they would have built apon existing Realmslore.
You could have different Dragonborn with different ancestry then, some from the Falling Dragon Eggs and others from Returned Abeir. |
| Brimstone |
Posted - 26 Apr 2010 : 14:08:08
I like Dragonborn.
I didn't like how they(WotC) implemented them.
Should have used the Falling Dragon Eggs hook. Thus they would have built apon existing Realmslore. |
| Alisttair |
Posted - 26 Apr 2010 : 13:48:42
I'll add that having Dragonborn running around adds an extra something interesting also. |
| froglegg |
Posted - 24 Apr 2010 : 17:34:34
quote:
Originally posted by froglegg
quote:
Originally posted by swifty
bear in mind in a cople more years 4e could well become as cosy as the old realms.give it time.and lets not forget there were some truly terrible novels set in the old realms.
Cosy? In a couple more years?.....Just in time for 5th edition.  If they wanted to be so bold with a Realms re-start, why not kill off Elminster and Drizzt as well as they killed off the rest? Make it a true Realms re-start. But oh no! Don't touch those sacred cows. We need them for the money.........err we mean the novels that is. I will now put away my soap-box. 
John
Opps  |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 24 Apr 2010 : 17:34:24
quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
After reading the FRCG, there were a couple things I liked. That said, they were smaller things that could easily work in the 3E timeframe as well as the 4E timeframe, and I'd change how both were implemented.
I liked the Five Companies, but I'd make them expatriates and give them a background that was either spelljammer or planar-based.
And I love the idea of a Thayan civil war, but I'd have the end result look like what happened to Clan Wolf in the BattleTech universe. My version of a Thayan civil war would have Tam controlling a couple of Zulkirs and the rest finding out about it, resulting in a schism. Some would stick with Tam, but others would exile themselves to Mulmaster. Mulmaster would become the capital of Thay-in-Exile (just a working name). Thay-in-Exile would still control the Red Wal-Marts and would have more of a neutral, mercantile leaning than the Red Wizzies remaining in Thay. Both sides would call themselves Thayvians and Red Wizards, and would have similar goals, but "loyalist" Thayvians would be more for overt and magical conquest, and the Exiles would be more about subtle and merchantile conquest.
This also gives a lot more opportunities for adventure -- the two sides would obviously be striving against each other. Other power groups might strive against one or both, and may or may not ally with the other faction...
How about this, o Wooly of the Ruperts?
After the schism, the mercantile zulkirs and their followers retreat to Thazalhar. They begin to call themselves Thayvians, taking up the moniker to be distinctive from Thayans (those that still follow Szass Tam).
By setting themselves up in Thazalhar, they put themselves between Tam and Aglarond, thereby winning a few over to the belief that they are no longer interested in conquest. They also strike a non-aggression treaty with the Simbul so they have the back-up of Aglarond if Tam tries to bring them back into the fold forcibly.
That all sounds good, but there's a reason I picked Mulmaster: they've already got a strong presence there, strong enough that it would likely be a natural choice for those exiles fleeing Thay.
They could still have a sizable presence in Thazalhar and do the Arc Royal Defense Cordon thing, but I don't think they'd set their new capital in a place they couldn't control. |
| froglegg |
Posted - 24 Apr 2010 : 17:28:00
quote:
Originally posted by swifty
bear in mind in a cople more years 4e could well become as cosy as the old realms.give it time.and lets not forget there were some truly terrible novels set in the old realms.
Cosy? In a couple more years?.....Just in time for 5th edition. If they wanted to be so bold with a Realms re-start, why not kill off Elminster and Drizzt as well as they killed off the rest? Make it a true Realms re-start. But oh no! Don't touch those sacred cows. We need them for the money.........err we mean the novels that is. I will now put away my soap-box.
John |
| The Sage |
Posted - 24 Apr 2010 : 16:40:41
quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart
After the schism, the mercantile zulkirs and their followers retreat to Thazalhar. They begin to call themselves Thayvians, taking up the moniker to be distinctive from Thayans (those that still follow Szass Tam).
Thinking on this further...
I believe it would tend to be the other way around. At least according to Ed's thinking on the application of both "Thayan" and "Thayvian."
Since Ed has told us previously, that "Thayvian" is actually the more ancient and traditional of the two terms, it's seems reasonable to assume that those individuals who wish to follow the more traditional paths of power in Thay, would identify themselves with the more archaic "Thayvian" term. "Thayan," on the other hand, is an entirely more recent linguistic construct and, thus, would likely better reflect the ambitious nature of the "new" mercantile philosophy of those Red Wizards fleeing to Thazalhar.
Alternatively, you could suggest that the Zulkirs in Thazalhar believe themselves to be adhering to the "true" and "traditional" fortunes of the nation of Thay, and therefore, claim the more archaic term, "Thayvian," as a way of fortifying their intention to represent the pre-rise-of-Tam Thayvian realm.
|
| The Sage |
Posted - 24 Apr 2010 : 16:20:23
quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
After reading the FRCG, there were a couple things I liked. That said, they were smaller things that could easily work in the 3E timeframe as well as the 4E timeframe, and I'd change how both were implemented.
I liked the Five Companies, but I'd make them expatriates and give them a background that was either spelljammer or planar-based.
And I love the idea of a Thayan civil war, but I'd have the end result look like what happened to Clan Wolf in the BattleTech universe. My version of a Thayan civil war would have Tam controlling a couple of Zulkirs and the rest finding out about it, resulting in a schism. Some would stick with Tam, but others would exile themselves to Mulmaster. Mulmaster would become the capital of Thay-in-Exile (just a working name). Thay-in-Exile would still control the Red Wal-Marts and would have more of a neutral, mercantile leaning than the Red Wizzies remaining in Thay. Both sides would call themselves Thayvians and Red Wizards, and would have similar goals, but "loyalist" Thayvians would be more for overt and magical conquest, and the Exiles would be more about subtle and merchantile conquest.
This also gives a lot more opportunities for adventure -- the two sides would obviously be striving against each other. Other power groups might strive against one or both, and may or may not ally with the other faction...
How about this, o Wooly of the Ruperts?
After the schism, the mercantile zulkirs and their followers retreat to Thazalhar. They begin to call themselves Thayvians, taking up the moniker to be distinctive from Thayans (those that still follow Szass Tam).
By setting themselves up in Thazalhar, they put themselves between Tam and Aglarond, thereby winning a few over to the belief that they are no longer interested in conquest. They also strike a non-aggression treaty with the Simbul so they have the back-up of Aglarond if Tam tries to bring them back into the fold forcibly.
So, in other words... something like the Arc-Royal Defence Cordon. Right?  |
| Ashe Ravenheart |
Posted - 24 Apr 2010 : 16:08:49
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
After reading the FRCG, there were a couple things I liked. That said, they were smaller things that could easily work in the 3E timeframe as well as the 4E timeframe, and I'd change how both were implemented.
I liked the Five Companies, but I'd make them expatriates and give them a background that was either spelljammer or planar-based.
And I love the idea of a Thayan civil war, but I'd have the end result look like what happened to Clan Wolf in the BattleTech universe. My version of a Thayan civil war would have Tam controlling a couple of Zulkirs and the rest finding out about it, resulting in a schism. Some would stick with Tam, but others would exile themselves to Mulmaster. Mulmaster would become the capital of Thay-in-Exile (just a working name). Thay-in-Exile would still control the Red Wal-Marts and would have more of a neutral, mercantile leaning than the Red Wizzies remaining in Thay. Both sides would call themselves Thayvians and Red Wizards, and would have similar goals, but "loyalist" Thayvians would be more for overt and magical conquest, and the Exiles would be more about subtle and merchantile conquest.
This also gives a lot more opportunities for adventure -- the two sides would obviously be striving against each other. Other power groups might strive against one or both, and may or may not ally with the other faction...
How about this, o Wooly of the Ruperts?
After the schism, the mercantile zulkirs and their followers retreat to Thazalhar. They begin to call themselves Thayvians, taking up the moniker to be distinctive from Thayans (those that still follow Szass Tam).
By setting themselves up in Thazalhar, they put themselves between Tam and Aglarond, thereby winning a few over to the belief that they are no longer interested in conquest. They also strike a non-aggression treaty with the Simbul so they have the back-up of Aglarond if Tam tries to bring them back into the fold forcibly. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 24 Apr 2010 : 15:48:45
After reading the FRCG, there were a couple things I liked. That said, they were smaller things that could easily work in the 3E timeframe as well as the 4E timeframe, and I'd change how both were implemented.
I liked the Five Companies, but I'd make them expatriates and give them a background that was either spelljammer or planar-based.
And I love the idea of a Thayan civil war, but I'd have the end result look like what happened to Clan Wolf in the BattleTech universe. My version of a Thayan civil war would have Tam controlling a couple of Zulkirs and the rest finding out about it, resulting in a schism. Some would stick with Tam, but others would exile themselves to Mulmaster. Mulmaster would become the capital of Thay-in-Exile (just a working name). Thay-in-Exile would still control the Red Wal-Marts and would have more of a neutral, mercantile leaning than the Red Wizzies remaining in Thay. Both sides would call themselves Thayvians and Red Wizards, and would have similar goals, but "loyalist" Thayvians would be more for overt and magical conquest, and the Exiles would be more about subtle and merchantile conquest.
This also gives a lot more opportunities for adventure -- the two sides would obviously be striving against each other. Other power groups might strive against one or both, and may or may not ally with the other faction... |
| Zanan |
Posted - 24 Apr 2010 : 09:24:59
quote:
Originally posted by swifty
bear in mind in a cople more years 4e could well become as cosy as the old realms.give it time.and lets not forget there were some truly terrible novels set in the old realms.
Yeah, having read some 110odd FR novels I'd say a half-dozen or so might be deemed "truly terrible", a few more terrible ... but over the last decade the standard has been very good indeed. The overall standard has been good as well. The first truly 4E one was Stowaway and it targetted the younger readership and was woeful indeed - size, page-count (and thus pricing), story.
As for DDI ... sure it is a great way to get the younger fans and the whole world of FR fans more involved (if they have credit cards and all), I'm no great fan of reading all I have on my screen nor am I that willing to support the printer and ink industry though. |
| Brimstone |
Posted - 24 Apr 2010 : 08:28:38
quote:
Originally posted by swifty
bear in mind in a cople more years 4e could well become as cosy as the old realms.give it time.and lets not forget there were some truly terrible novels set in the old realms.
Right.
WotC did chose a new model for good or bad to use with the 4E Forgotten Realms.
I have downloaded at least 40 DDI articles for the Realms.(Guess I was wrong on the Realms not getting enough support through DDI) |
| swifty |
Posted - 24 Apr 2010 : 08:11:19
bear in mind in a cople more years 4e could well become as cosy as the old realms.give it time.and lets not forget there were some truly terrible novels set in the old realms. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 24 Apr 2010 : 03:36:56
I have been a realms reader for (only) 3 years now, but I have read almost all the FR books(novels and anthologies), and I must say I partly like and partly dislike the changes brought by the RSE. Alisttair seemed to summarize all that I like. And so as not to discourage you further, Archimedes of Syracuse, I will not enumerate what I do NOT like about changes. But keep in mind always that even though others' opinion matter to some degree, our personal view is what counts most. Some people recommended that I read this and that, and when I did, I regretted it totally. While at times I find that what other loathe to the fullest actually is great for me. As what Ed said, there is always something for everyone in the FR. So even if you will find some changes in the realms disheartening, I am pretty sure some will lift your spirit and make you continue to love the realms.
|
| Zanan |
Posted - 23 Apr 2010 : 23:57:37
quote:
Originally posted by Alisttair
- The people are no longer bombarded by RSE after RSE within a short time span (for now anyways, who knows what the future holds), thus there is some stability in the realms
No insult intended, but that actually made me laugh. Especially after a Realms-Shaking Event that turned the Realms into something pretty much un-Realmsian. Replacing the odd deity here and there, have a half-important Netherese city return, some elves and the like ... opposed by the slaughter of nigh entire pantheons, the demotion if not destruction of deities galore, re-mapping the whole Realms, destroying kingdoms and empires all over the place, slaying a legion NPCs and household names ... yeah, that kind of brings stability.
It's like comparing apples and ... hand grenades.
The "4E" novels I've read so far are "no worse" than those I read before. Matter of fact, you hardly get it more detailed and compact as e.g. The Fall of Highwatch. But nonetheless it hasn't the ring of the Old Realms, or, in other words, as far as I am concerned, you could replace some names and lore terms and read ... just another fantasy novel. Who knows what the future will bring for the New Realms, IMHO, WotC went a few bridges too far with Spellplague, 4E and the Realms.
It is not exactly about love and hate. More about liking and disliking. I've seen 15odd years of Realms come and go, liked them enough to make them "my" prime setting. I had a look at the New Realms and simply don't like what I see and get. A glance to my left tells me that I have books and novels galore, lore to fill campaigns in "my" Realms till I cannot hold my dice any longer and I'm happy with that. As I don't like the New Realms (much like German DSA, Eberron or what have you), I don't invest my time and money into them and have not paid attention to what WotC has done to them ever since the FRPG. And while it is still kind of sad, I don't feel that I lost something doing so. |
| Elfinblade |
Posted - 23 Apr 2010 : 22:51:14
Welcome! I would like to recommend The Blades of the Moonsea by Rich Baker as well as the ones posted by my fellow scribes above as post spellplague novels. Entertaining stuff keeps coming, and even though i'm still playing 3.5 i will keep on reading the novels and gathering the lore of our beloved sanctuary. |
| Jakk |
Posted - 23 Apr 2010 : 22:27:24
Welcome to the 'Keep!
I'm actually one of the resident "Spellplague trolls"... I've become much more easygoing over the past year, as I'm sure the other contributors to this scroll (and others) will agree. That being said, there are things worth looking at in the Brave New Realms (for so I will always think of it).
I think Alisttair handled the positive elements of the post-Spellplague setting well; I'll say that I agree 100% with Brimstone on the quality of the 4E novels, but as far as playing and running games are concerned, I and my gaming group will be sticking to either non-canon Realms or Golarion (Pathfinder). I'm going to try to restrain myself from my "usual negative ranting" (as Alisttair so succinctly puts it) because, IMO, there are things worth taking from the post-Plague Realms, or, if you prefer, good reasons to tell your PCs' stories there.
Laerakond ("returned Abeir") is one such place; I also like the idea of Tymanther, I just don't like the specifics of its implementation (I almost said "execution" but that's a pun I'm not going to analyze). The whole 3E/4E dragonborn thing is Ashe's baby, so I won't touch that argument either. Akanul is another new realm that I like in theory, but am not crazy over in implementation. Both realms would have been far better placed on one of the heretofore-unexplored continents.
I could go on at length about the changes from canon that I have made in my Realms, but I've already done that in other scrolls in these halls, and your original post suggested that you were more interested in what others liked about the new setting. From your comment about not having done a great amount of role-playing in the Realms, I would suggest that you're in a much happier position than most serious Realms role-players who aren't happy with the changes; as I mentioned earlier, even though I'm not a big fan of the 4E Realms as a role-playing setting, I've quite enjoyed all of the post-3rd-edition Realms fiction that I've read, even when Steven Schend ended "Blackstaff" the way he did... in the interests of "no spoilers" I'll not get into specifics.
Anyway, I won't apologize to Alisttair for letting him down on the expectations of a rant; I'm too busy rewriting recent history to fuss about what happened in print. And yes, I plan on submitting my final work to Candlekeep... if it ever gets finished. For those of you who have been here for a while, you'd think I was trying to fill Markustay's shoes or something...  Wherever he is, I hope he's having fun; it would be nice to hear from him, tho... maybe when he gets enough of his homebrew put together... |
| Joran Nobleheart |
Posted - 23 Apr 2010 : 14:19:18
Well met, Archimedes of Syracuse. While I personally can't step in and say much about the new books or anything along those lines, I'd very much like to invite you to join the Candlekeep Inn, where some of our members engage in character roleplay. It's not quite the same as playing actual D&D in the Forgotten Realms, but I think that you'd like it very much, especially if you have a character idea in mind and would like to see what it's like, having that PC of yours interact with others. It's just an idea, and I hope that you'll consider it. Welcome to Candlekeep, and I truly do hope that you discover your love once more for the Realms while here, and that you're able to get to play a character that you might have had in mind for some time, as well as meet others with the same love for the Realms that you have. All my best to you, my friend. |
| Alisttair |
Posted - 23 Apr 2010 : 13:50:56
quote:
Originally posted by Archimedes of Syracuse All i want is for people to come here and tell me positive things about the new realms.
Some people may or may not agree as to the following being considered positive things about the new realms, but you are looking for positive things so I will post some things that are positive (some maybe just IMO) before everyone decides to come and do their usual negative ranting:
- Netheril is back as an empire (not just one city)
- The people are no longer bombarded by RSE after RSE within a short time span (for now anyways, who knows what the future holds), thus there is some stability in the realms
- There is ample opportunity for new bad guys to spring up and make their mark (and in turn, opportunity for new good guys to foil their plots)
- Swordmages(a spinoff of Bladesingers) are present, and not just elves (the Netherese have their Umbriri, which are shadow Bladesingers)
- Cyric is imprisoned but still has influence
- Waterdeep is bigger than before
- Yes I liked the original Thay with the specialist red wizards, but a land filled with Undead is pretty cool too
- Plaguewrought lands are an interesting place to visit
- More pieces of land floating in the air |
| Brimstone |
Posted - 23 Apr 2010 : 13:47:14
The 4E FR Novels are good. I have really enjoyed the Ed series. God Catcher was the best one so far to me. |
| Ashe Ravenheart |
Posted - 22 Apr 2010 : 22:59:33
Welcome to the `keep!
Yes, the post-Spellplague Realms are not for everyone. And the scribes here have been vocal about the lack of support for the game setting in published material, but the novels are still being read and discussed to great length here.
The best thing about the keep is being able to talk to the authors and game designers about the stories they tell directly. I recommend catching up on Ed's Scroll for insights into the Realms.
Finally, in response to my fellow scribes above, the 'old guard' here may not like all the changes that have been brought about, but their love of the Realms has never been in question. I'm also over on Loremaster, but I lurk more than I post over there. |
| Cleric Generic |
Posted - 22 Apr 2010 : 22:33:50
Hey! Welcome to the 'keep!
Right, yeah, this place and 4e enthusiasm... hmmm...
Basically, don't hold your breath. I and a number of other 4e types spend a fair amount of time at loremaster.org, where you might have more luck finding 4e realms jollity and witty banter, but the traffic there is, as yet, nowhere near as high as here.
As for the post-plague novels themselves; I've not read any of them, but it's the same authors as before and I've heard some generally good noise about them, so all I can recommend is that you look in one of the novel novel shelves and see which ones are getting the best feedback.
If you have any specific queries about the post-plague realms, I and the other spell-scarred scribes lurking about here in the back of the class and causing a ruckus will gladly oblige, I'm sure! |
| sfdragon |
Posted - 22 Apr 2010 : 22:30:51
the old guard and some of those who have not been around with the realms did not like some of the changes.
pick up the Ed Greenwood Presents: Waterdeep series. |
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