| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 10 Jun 2007 : 16:47:19
After the discussion on Spellsingers in some of the other threads I decided to try my hand at these guys, so I thought I'd post my take on the class here. Let me know what you think. |
| 8 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 28 Jul 2007 : 20:27:13
Sometimes really simple solutions occur to you after you do a whole lot of work. I was just looking at the Prestige Bard PrC from the SRD/Unearthed Arcana, and thought, this is more or less what a Spellsinger should be, a character that casts a wider range of spells while still gaining bardic abilities.
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/prestigiousCharacterClasses.htm#prestigeBard
I think in order to make it a bit more "Spellsingery" though I might have the character gain Eschew Materials as a class ability to represent, and the special requirement that the character cannot cast cast spells silently and all spells that do not have a verbal component are no longer on the character's spell list.
How does this (much simpler) variant work for my fellow scribes? |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 18 Jun 2007 : 22:59:25
You know, I was just looking over that PrC the other day when I was thinking of the Moonshaes, but for some reason it didn't click that that was a full "standard" caster/bard progression class. Thanks for the bump in the right direction. I would have responded earlier, but I didn't see your post come up as a reply. |
| EytanBernstein |
Posted - 15 Jun 2007 : 10:57:11
Take a look at the Fochluchan lyrist, a druid/bard progression. It should help you with balance. I think bardic music is a good feature for requirement. It precludes you from needing to indicate much in the way of spellcasting. |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 15 Jun 2007 : 02:28:56
Thanks for your input Eytan (and for some reason I couldn't see that you had posted from the responses before). The main thought I had about the Spellsong substitution would have been for the healing spells that normal mages don't have access to, which they would from this feat, though you make a good point that this might bleed into Warmages, Dread Necromancers, and the like.
I wasn't quite sure how to word the bardic spellcasting requirement, since I know its a no no to require a class, but requiring a class feature is okay.
My initial gut reaction was to allow the Spellsong training on an unlimited basis, but for some reason I felt like I needed to reign this back in. Thanks for confirming my initial instincts on this one.
I did think that if I provided a dual progression, the class should drop down to a d4 for hit dice.
Once again, thanks for the input. |
| EytanBernstein |
Posted - 10 Jun 2007 : 22:28:54
As to the PrC, be really careful with the language in the spellcasting class. Your requirements stated that any two arcane spellcasting classes qualify, so your spellcasting should really be in line with this. It doesn't mention bardic spellcasting in the requirements, so it shouldn't be limited to such casting in the text.
Your pre-requisites should probably read:
Race: Elf or half-elf
Skills: Knowledge (arcana) 8 ranks, Perform (singing) 8 ranks, Spellcraft 8 ranks
Feats: Spellsong substitution, Skill focus (perform)
Spellcasting: Ability to cast 1st level bard spells and first level spells in another arcane spellcasting class.
Special: Must have the bardic music class feature
Also, there's really no reason to limit the spellsong training to once per day per spellsinger level.
If I was redesigning the class, I'd keep your +1 bard/+1 arcane and keep the spellsong enchantment feature of the class in RoF. I'd ditch the Improved Counterspell requirement (it never fit the rest of the class) and probably the rest of the music related abilities. |
| EytanBernstein |
Posted - 10 Jun 2007 : 22:22:57
quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
Spellsong Substitution
Your knowledge of song and spell blend to allow you to learn spells outside of your normal range.
Prerequisite: Elf or half-elf, Skill focus (Perform)
Benefit: You may add one spell from the bard spell list to the spell list of another arcane spellcaster, at one level higher than its normal level as a bard spell.
Special: You may take this feat multiple times. Each time it applies to a new spell to be put on your arcane spell list.
This wouldn't be useful to all that many characters. In fact, the only characters to truly benefit wouldn't really be your target audience (warmages, dread necromancers, and the like). The significant majority of spells on the bard list already appear on the sor/wiz list a slightly higher level. |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 10 Jun 2007 : 16:50:09
Spellsinger
Spellsingers are rare elven practitioners of an elven form of magic that relies heavily on the ability of Spellsong, a technique that allows for a greater range of magical affects for an arcane spellcaster. Like bards, spellsingers use song to cast their spells, but unlike bards, they are more focused on the ability to actually cast magical spells.
Most spellsingers are wizard/bards, although some sorcerer/bards follow this path as well. Other classes rarely end up following this path. Almost all spellsingers are elves, but the only real requirement for the class is a significant amount of elven blood, so the class is also open to half-elves.
NPC Spellsingers are usually found in traditionally elven lands, serving either at bardic colleges or arcane schools. They often serve as fonts of lore as well as educators of other generations of elven spellcasters. Elves have a great deal of respect for those that have the dedication to follow this path.
Hit Dice: d4
Requirements
To qualify to become a spellsinger, character must fulfill all of the following criteria.
Race: Elf or half-elf
Skills: Knowledge (arcana) 8 ranks, Perform (singing) 8 ranks, Spellcraft 8 ranks
Feats: Spellsong substitution, Skill focus (perform)
Spellcasting: Ability to cast 1st level arcane spells in two separate classes
Special: Must have the bardic music class feature
Class Skills
The spellsinger's class skills (and the key abilities for each skill) are Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Decipher Script (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Disguise (Cha), Gather Information (Cha), Knowledge (any)(Int), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Speak Language (none), Spellcraft (Int), and Use Magic Device (Cha)
Skill Points at Each Level: 4 + Int modifier.
Class Features
All of the following are class features of the spellsinger prestige class.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Spellsingers gain no proficiency in any weapons or armor.
Spellsong Training: You are trained in how to apply the techniques of spellsong to various spells that you have learned. You may learn arcane spells that do not appear on your non-bardic spell lists as if they were on your spell lists, but when they are learned or known in this manner, they are one level higher than they would normally be. Thus, a spellsinger may learn cure light wounds as a second level wizard spell, if they can find an arcane scroll of the spell to study from. You may learn or known one spell in this manner per level of spellsinger that you have.
A non-spellsinger arcane caster cannot learn these spells from your spellbook. This ability to apply the techniques of spellsong are a one way benefit. You may not know spells normally unavailable to bards because they are on your other spell list.
Spellsong trained spells always have a verbal component and can never be modified with a Silent Spell feat.
Spellsong Conversion: You have learned to completely incorporate your spellsong abilities into your normal spellcasting. Once per day per level of spellsinger you may drop a prepared spell or a spell slot from your non-bard spellcasting class in order to spontaneously cast a spell that you know as a bard. The spell or spell slot dropped must be one level higher than the bard spell being spontaneously cast.
Spells converted in this manner always have a verbal component.
The Spellsinger
Class Level-----BAB-----Fort-----Ref-----Will-----Special-----Spells/Day
1st_______+0______+0_______+2_______+2______Spellsong Training_____+level in arcane/+1 in bard
2nd +1 +0 +3 +3 +1 arcane/+1
bard
3rd +2 +1 +3 +3 +1 arcane/+1 bard
4th +3 +1 +4 +4 +1 arcane/+1
bard
5th +3 +1 +4 +4 Spellsong Conver. +1 arcane/+1
bard |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 10 Jun 2007 : 16:48:30
Spellsong Substitution
Your knowledge of song and spell blend to allow you to learn spells outside of your normal range.
Prerequisite: Elf or half-elf, Skill focus (Perform)
Benefit: You may add one spell from the bard spell list to the spell list of another arcane spellcaster, at one level higher than its normal level as a bard spell.
Special: You may take this feat multiple times. Each time it applies to a new spell to be put on your arcane spell list.
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