| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Fletcher |
Posted - 02 May 2005 : 22:16:27
I have been running a long campaign, (going into its 5th year) and some of the characters are gold elves wanting to return to Evermeet and get involved with the politics there. I think they are happy with how they have done in Cormyr and are ready to try to increase the nation's alliances with the elven nation of Evermeet.
I was wondering if anyone could point me in a direction to obtain the information necessary to run a detailed political campaign based out of Evermeet?
I've started to re-read all of the books, articles and campaign settings, attempting to put together a comprehensive list and structure to the elven society in Evermeet.
It is a bear of a task, and with some of the contradictions and fairly sizeable gaps in information so far, i was wondering if this has been done already?
Looking for major clans/houses/families and what type of elf.
Where they stand in elven society (High, middle low nobility or commoner)
Who they are allied with.
Who they are enemies with
What their goals(if any) are.
Right now I have a very very bare skeleton, and would appreciate any help.
Please keep the disbelieving laughter down to a dull roar so I can hear any responses.
Thanks for your time. |
| 24 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| khorne |
Posted - 28 May 2005 : 09:50:02
quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher
quote:
Originally posted by khorne
I wish I was in your group fletcher. One of my favorite characters is a human ranger who is an elf-friend, but he goes rabid every time he sees a gold elf(a bit like the manshoon clones) so the other members in the party always have to watch him because although he gets along quite well even with forest and wild elves, the results would be disastrous if he saw an Ar`Tel`Quessir.
Thanks! I'm would try to make your experience as enjoyable as possible.
Why does your ranger go rabid? What happened to him to not only make him an elf-friend but a rabid gold elf hater?
Was one of them your father? (NNNOOOOoooooo! He's not my father!)
It involves the moon elf he married, the twin daughters they got, and a visit from a bunch of racist gold elves who make kymil nimesin look like a saint(glow and all). At the end of it, his wife and children were murdered, and he himself was tortured. The rest of the party arrived just in time to save him. The things we did with those gold elves afterwards were........not nice.
(And one of the golds was a Durothil, so he`s marked that house above the rest)
Edit: in other words, he has a serious grudge........... |
| Fletcher |
Posted - 27 May 2005 : 23:44:58
quote:
Originally posted by khorne
I wish I was in your group fletcher. One of my favorite characters is a human ranger who is an elf-friend, but he goes rabid every time he sees a gold elf(a bit like the manshoon clones) so the other members in the party always have to watch him because although he gets along quite well even with forest and wild elves, the results would be disastrous if he saw an Ar`Tel`Quessir.
Thanks! I'm would try to make your experience as enjoyable as possible.
Why does your ranger go rabid? What happened to him to not only make him an elf-friend but a rabid gold elf hater?
Was one of them your father? (NNNOOOOoooooo! He's not my father!) |
| khorne |
Posted - 27 May 2005 : 19:04:54
I wish I was in your group fletcher. One of my favorite characters is a human ranger who is an elf-friend, but he goes rabid every time he sees a gold elf(a bit like the manshoon clones) so the other members in the party always have to watch him because although he gets along quite well even with forest and wild elves, the results would be disastrous if he saw an Ar`Tel`Quessir. |
| Fletcher |
Posted - 20 May 2005 : 18:55:04
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher
He is thinking of marrying into a family with a strong magical history, such as the Miritar, Alastarra, Durothil, or Haladar clans.
Oh do come back and share when he makes a selection. I'll be very interested to see who he ends up with or who decides to end up with him. 
Our wise and powerful mage had decided that the Durothils have the best lineage for marrying into, and has decided that he will marry into a cadet branch of the Durothils known for having several members of the house in training to be High mages, and one bladesinger working on a name for himself, rescuing artifacts from Myth Drannor.
The engagement has gone well for almost 2 years. How ever with the expenses incurred by the engagement parties, and presents, as well as financing a large expedition to negotiate with the Vhaerun drow in Cormanthyr, and the making of a mithril Golem his noble house is looking at bankruptcy.
So his is working up a devious plane to get cash. The elves consider him to be very human in his actions. Always rushing from place to place, never settling down, and they are watching him to see if he can act like an elf. If not there are going to be serious social consequences.
To avoid the loss of social status he has come up with a scheme to get away. He will be a major participant in running a large and detailed ceremony for a half elf that has done great things for the elven nations. He will then profess his exhaustion and take a vacation to his family house on the north coast of Evermeet.
There he will leave a simulacrum of himself, a few guards (including one polymorphed to look like his familiar) while he goes and looks to find a source of funds. Only his captain of the guard, his financial advisor and his fiancée are to know he is going. His simulacrum is to act the exhausted dandy refusing to see anyone for a time while recuperating from his efforts. Meanwhile the real elf is off adventuring in the planes looking for an old friend and some cash.
He is leaving behind the following situation:
His father and his fiancée’s father are currently negotiating with the Vhaerun Drow and things aren't going well. The Drow are having issues with the rights for non elves, especially the local humans and Dwarves. Negotiations are North Korea tense with both sides posturing, and the surface elves trying to find a way to placate the Drow, without allowing them too much freedom and power.
To make the situation even more interesting, there are factions on both sides that don't want the negotiations to suceed, and are working very hard to accomplish this. No bodies have shown up yet, but they aren't far off.
I so love when players leave, deteriorating tense and fragile, situations in the hands of NPC's who are showing a distinct lack of control of the situation. It allows for all sorts of things to go wrong.
If he isn't back by the time things go bad, I'm pretty sure his fiancée will have a few words for him for abandoning their parents to the mercies of the Drow.
|
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 05 May 2005 : 04:33:20
quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher
He is thinking of marrying into a family with a strong magical history, such as the Miritar, Alastarra, Durothil, or Haladar clans.
Oh do come back and share when he makes a selection. I'll be very interested to see who he ends up with or who decides to end up with him. |
| Fletcher |
Posted - 05 May 2005 : 04:10:43
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher
Bags! Now I have to plan for a 5-10 year sub-plot of his wife hunting, political bargaining, and of course the whole pre-engagement, engagement pre-nuptials, nuptials and the rest.
It will be interesting to see what family he sets his eyes on, and what he is going to do to get their attention and blessing.
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
This wife hunting going to happen pre-negotiations? If so, that could lead to further complications if his wife's family is involved directly or indirectly with the negotiations. Does he wish the wife to be from another Ar'Tel'Quessir family? Or is he clearly open to any etriel from a noble clan?
This Ar'Tel'Quesser definitely is going after other Ar'Tel'Quessir blood. None of the 'lesser' elven races for him. Well that's what his father is going to push anyway. As a player he has played his character very lenient towards the shorter lived races. He has always had pity on them, but treated them as equals. (The few times he didn’t the party fighter literally bent him over his knee and spanked him.)
He is thinking of marrying into a family with a strong magical history, such as the Miritar, Alastarra, Durothil, or Haladar clans.
The family planning will take place starting before the negotiation attempt with the drow, and will develop through them. Who knows there may even be some tension between fiance's in this mess.
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
Make it a nice walking stick. I saw plenty of cool ones when I used to go on volksmarches in Germany.
 Be my pleasure
[quote]Originally posted by SiriusBlack
What's that line...it's not the years baby...it's the mileage. 
I'm not sure how many miles there are on this thing, but its reset at least once. |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 05 May 2005 : 02:57:25
quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher
No I haven’t read those, but one of my players has the books, so I’ll borrow from him.
The novel in the Sembia series that I mentioned is Heirs of Prophecy by Lisa Smedman. A very good novel by an excellent writer.
quote:
I am indeed a George R.R. Martin fan. I love the Game of throne series.
Talk about a series that could inspire anyone when it comes to political intrigue.
quote:
Any person with a minor working knowledge of how the intelligence industry works knows that every piece of information has to corroborated, because any one source can be compromised.
Sounds like you might have some personal experience with intelligence gathering.
quote:
On a side not of interest, the wizard wants to strengthen his political clout and wants to form a political marriage.
Oh, more opportunities to complicate his character's life....
quote:
Bags! Now I have to plan for a 5-10 year sub-plot of his wife hunting, political bargaining, and of course the whole pre-engagement, engagement pre-nuptials, nuptials and the rest.
It will be interesting to see what family he sets his eyes on, and what he is going to do to get their attention and blessing.
This wife hunting going to happen pre-negotiations? If so, that could lead to further complications if his wife's family is involved directly or indirectly with the negotiations. Does he wish the wife to be from another Ar'Tel'Quessir family? Or is he clearly open to any etriel from a noble clan?
quote:
 I’ll be sure to send you a walker with the tennis balls.
Make it a nice walking stick. I saw plenty of cool ones when I used to go on volksmarches in Germany.
quote:
But I think I am beginning to understand. House and yard work, vehicle repairs, wives, children, real jobs…
It now takes the rest of the week to recover from these gaming sessions, instead of being fine the next day. Ooh my achin’ joints!
What's that line...it's not the years baby...it's the mileage. |
| Fletcher |
Posted - 04 May 2005 : 22:20:41
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
Sembia would also be the most flexible as there is still a great deal FR fans don't know about the nation. Did you read any of the novels from the Sembia series? There was one that focused on a near elven/human war.
No I haven’t read those, but one of my players has the books, so I’ll borrow from him. I like Sembia as a villain because it reminds me of the colonial powers. It has more money and manpower than anyone else, and it wants to expand to show how great of a nation it is, and if it incidentally makes a few hundred merchants extremely wealthy…so be it.
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
Well said. By the way, are you a George R.R. Martin fan? I wouldn't be surprised if so with the level of intrigue you seem to enjoy in your games.
I am indeed a George R.R. Martin fan. I love the Game of throne series. I am also a fan of non-D&D fantasy authors Robert Jordan and Terry Goodkind. But my all time favorite genre related stories are still Ivanhoe and the Black Arrow.
quote:
I am fairly certain that the drow, who tend to live in a constant state of very lethal politicking will catch on to what the elves are doing and either use the elven spies to deliver false information. Another possibility is capture or kill them as the standard drow practice for being stupid enough to be caught. A third possibility is that they will use the elven prying as an excuse to embarrass the elven delegation in hopes of gaining the upper hand in the negotiation. “After all YOU were sneaking around and spying on US. How can we believe that you will be honorable in this?”
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
I can see Vhaeraun dark elves using the first and third possibilities listed above. I don't see them capturing or killing anyone. But, Vhaeraun's love for duplicity and intrigue would definitely have his followers trying to give any spies/agents some false information.
And yes, it would fit perfectly for the Vhaeraun leaders to act insulted at any elven spies they catch. All the while, such action is something Vhaeraun dark elves would be expecting from the other side.
I must say that I am always curious at my players ability to trust any information that they garner through illicit means. Any person with a minor working knowledge of how the intelligence industry works knows that every piece of information has to corroborated, because any one source can be compromised.
I expect that if one agent gets compromised they will take everything at face value and try to use it in negotiations. We’ll see.
On a side not of interest, the wizard wants to strengthen his political clout and wants to form a political marriage. He is also planning of trying to make a couple elven babies. Bags! Now I have to plan for a 5-10 year sub-plot of his wife hunting, political bargaining, and of course the whole pre-engagement, engagement pre-nuptials, nuptials and the rest.
It will be interesting to see what family he sets his eyes on, and what he is going to do to get their attention and blessing.
quote:
We used to game every week, but as our lives have progressed we have cut back to meeting once a month for an all day session. 20 hours of gaming! Woo hoo!
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
I remember such long gaming sessions. Alas, I was younger back then...
I’ll be sure to send you a walker with the tennis balls. But I think I am beginning to understand. House and yard work, vehicle repairs, wives, children, real jobs…
It now takes the rest of the week to recover from these gaming sessions, instead of being fine the next day. Ooh my achin’ joints!
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
I thought I was dealing with a group of adults, but wanted to ask.
Don’t let our significant others hear you call us adults. They think we act like a bunch of 13 year olds with expanded vocabularies. Though we have moved away from eating cheap pizza, hand fulls of pixi-stix and chugging mountain dew by the hogshead. Now we are eating BBQ chicken fresh off the grill, salad, fresh fruit, blanched greens and drinking beer or tea. Late night just includes a little more coffee or tea.
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| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 04 May 2005 : 18:59:18
quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher
Few are more selfish than those who have been harboring a secret hurt or pain for a century or three.
Indeed, even worse if it's a clan/family with a secret hurt that has been passed down through the ages.
quote:
Most likely Sembia. Some elves actually have fond feeling for some people in Cormyr, where as the greedy merchants of Sembia have a long history of finding new ways to read old treaties. Not to mention Cormyr is still recovering from a long and painfully expensive war. Sembia is still a strong rich nation, and a much greater threat to elven plans. More people. More money. More evil.
Sembia would also be the most flexible as there is still a great deal FR fans don't know about the nation. Did you read any of the novels from the Sembia series? There was one that focused on a near elven/human war.
quote:
In some cases both. There are groups and factions which are just the extended limbs acting on the will of a single powerful or charismatic figure. So, if you want to eliminate a faction that is causing a problem, eliminate its motivator or organizer. Some other elf may step in, but it will mean that they need to take time to reorganize, and the person taking over may not be as effective.
Well said. By the way, are you a George R.R. Martin fan? I wouldn't be surprised if so with the level of intrigue you seem to enjoy in your games.
quote:
I am fairly certain that the drow, who tend to live in a constant state of very lethal politicking will catch on to what the elves are doing and either use the elven spies to deliver false information. Another possibility is capture or kill them as the standard drow practice for being stupid enough to be caught. A third possibility is that they will use the elven prying as an excuse to embarrass the elven delegation in hopes of gaining the upper hand in the negotiation. “After all YOU were sneaking around and spying on US. How can we believe that you will be honorable in this?”
I can see Vhaeraun dark elves using the first and third possibilities listed above. I don't see them capturing or killing anyone. But, Vhaeraun's love for duplicity and intrigue would definitely have his followers trying to give any spies/agents some false information.
And yes, it would fit perfectly for the Vhaeraun leaders to act insulted at any elven spies they catch. All the while, such action is something Vhaeraun dark elves would be expecting from the other side.
quote:
scribble scribble scribble. I like the way you put that. I had thought of it being done more for Evermeet or because it goes against the will of the gods or something.
Oh, the good of Evermeet or for the good of Corellon also sounds like a Durothil. "I know better than the foolish moon elves" is how they can be used.
And figures that believe they are doing something for the good of their nation/god/race are often more scary than any figures who are open about having purely selfish interests.
quote:
We used to game every week, but as our lives have progressed we have cut back to meeting once a month for an all day session. 20 hours of gaming! Woo hoo!
I remember such long gaming sessions. Alas, I was younger back then...
quote:
Ages range from 29-33.
I thought I was dealing with a group of adults, but wanted to ask.
quote:
But its the quality not the quantity of gaming. I’ve had the fortune of gaming under some really great GM’s :Jim Milligan, Les Clark and Damian Gillaume. And I’ve played with some great crews over the years, including the Atomic Rocket Games crew back in junior college.
Ray Ellis, Tim Witherow, Steve Zimmerman...amazing how easy it is to remember some great past gamers I played with although I haven't seem them for over a decade. |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 04 May 2005 : 18:46:36
quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher
For the sake of keeping these idividual posts to a fairly reasonable length I'm going to break it up a bit.
Aw, where's the fun in that?  Seriously, I understand. Long posts don't bother me as much as those messages that are very long without a single paragraph break. Reading some of those posts make me realize it's time to perhaps get my eyes checked.
quote:
I just finished reading that portion of ed's notes last night.:) I have put the entire family as he listed it. It will definitely add a little bit of flavor that isn't colored entirely by my mind.
I should have no problem putting what Ed posted into my Nierdre Clan. It's simply how I wish to merge that information with what I created. From the scenes of Brindarry Nierdre and Vhoori Durothil together in Evermeet: Island of Elves, I've made the Nierdres an ancient ally of the Durothil clan. Thus, it's been interesting to have in my campaign these two clans linked through the ages but with two vastly different opinions now on N'Tel'Quess. The Durothils are the strong traditionalists and my Niedres are...well....Progressive? Radicals? Inclusionary? One or all of those terms fits.
quote:
I should get it by the end of the week, but I'm going to be traveling for work tomorrow through Wednesday next week, so I won't be around to pick it up until next week.
If you have any questions between now and then about the novel just let me know. I'm sure you've already found the threads devoted to it here at Candlekeep.
quote:
Yup, the Llothites are a little too well known(and that is what they are expecting). I think it is more fun to have a Vhaeraun’s guys running the show when the PC’s are expecting it to be Lloth’s llewd lladies.
Oh, so much fun that they are expecting that. I feel it makes sense that it would be Vhaeraun's followers. The fun thing about using them is that they most likely would like the negotiations to work. Vhaeraun dark elves have no problems with uniting with the other elven races....as long as these other subraces realize the Vhaeraun dark elves should be in charge.
Hmm, always wanting to lead rather than follow...what other subrace does that remind me of?
quote:
Hmm…interested in mythals. That is an angle I hadn’t really pushed towards the front of my mind. And you are right, I can think of all sorts of people who would be distressed if the drow developed mythals. They are powerful and dangerous enough as it is.
Not to spoil anything too much, but the upcoming second novel in the Last Mythal series might give us a chance to see if the Vhaeraun dark elves have made any progress in these efforts. I hope...I hope. |
| Fletcher |
Posted - 04 May 2005 : 17:33:00
Here is part two, connected to the above post.
quote:
3) Some elves are using the negotiations with the drow as a way of embarrassing powerful political foes.
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
Selfish people will be found in every situation.
Few are more selfish than those who have been harboring a secret hurt or pain for a century or three.
quote:
5) Some are hoping to divert the drow attention to the human during the negotiations
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
A certain human nation? Sembia? Cormyr?
Most likely Sembia. Some elves actually have fond feeling for some people in Cormyr, where as the greedy merchants of Sembia have a long history of finding new ways to read old treaties. Not to mention Cormyr is still recovering from a long and painfully expensive war. Sembia is still a strong rich nation, and a much greater threat to elven plans. More people. More money. More evil.
quote:
6) Some are expecting the negotiations to go very wrong and are using it to eliminate certain elements they disagree with.
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
Elements or figures?
In some cases both. There are groups and factions which are just the extended limbs acting on the will of a single powerful or charismatic figure. So, if you want to eliminate a faction that is causing a problem, eliminate its motivator or organizer. Some other elf may step in, but it will mean that they need to take time to reorganize, and the person taking over may not be as effective.
quote:
7) Some are using the negotiations to attempt to gain information on the strengths and weaknesses of the drow.
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
That could be something that certain aides to the elven diplomats are charged with. Assist the negotiators, but while you are there, assess the dark elven forces. How will that go over if the dark elves realize what is being done?
I am fairly certain that the drow, who tend to live in a constant state of very lethal politicking will catch on to what the elves are doing and either use the elven spies to deliver false information. Another possibility is capture or kill them as the standard drow practice for being stupid enough to be caught. A third possibility is that they will use the elven prying as an excuse to embarrass the elven delegation in hopes of gaining the upper hand in the negotiation. “After all YOU were sneaking around and spying on US. How can we believe that you will be honorable in this?”
Or something along those lines using a transgression to put doubt into all other actions by the elven nations.
quote:
I'll probably think of a couple other sub-currents, plots and bluffs such as the following:
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
For what it's worth, your players sound like they have a wonderfully imaginative DM.
They enjoy it, or they wouldn’t have stuck it out this long. Though on occasion I think it drives them batty. But I find that a continuous storyline that builds from one plot to the next is the best way to go. I have managed to make it through all these years and only had to plunk down three tangential adventures in order to get time to organize and plan the long term story.
I have a personal favorite ploy to keep the environment alive. I throw out a couple rumors every now and then. I keep track of the time I put the rumors out there, and over time they evolve. Some get solved by other adventuring parties, and some escalate into large headaches, and others just fade from the wagging tongues.
It also gives the players between 4-10 options to choose to explore at any time. It allows them much more freedom of choice and keeps the game from becoming linear. Not to mention I encourage them to come up with hobbies and activities of their own. Right now one has become a master chef and the other has become a sketch artist, a middling architect and a great landscaper.
quote:
2) A Durothil family member will go and arrange to have himself be at one of the meetings in order to attempt to critically sabotage the negotiations and prevent dealings with the drow. Of course this could precipitate the war, but that isn't their primary concern.
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
And what you can always have a Durothil like that fall back on is, "I was doing this for the elven race." Amazing what some will attempt to justify with such a statement no matter what the race.
scribble scribble scribble. I like the way you put that. I had thought of it being done more for Evermeet or because it goes against the will of the gods or something.
quote:
It will be up to the PC's to either arrange to go to the negotiations, arrange for the negotiations not to happen or perhaps insure that most of these malcontents are not with the delegation.
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
How often do you meet to game? This sounds like a campaign that could go on for quite some time. And if you don't mind me asking, what are the ages of everyone involved?
Sirius
We used to game every week, but as our lives have progressed we have cut back to meeting once a month for an all day session. 20 hours of gaming! Woo hoo! We then keep the things moving and resolve issues via email. Those fly fast and furious. Ages range from 29-33.
I’m the short time gamer as I started when I was 16, and I’m the youngest in the group.
But its the quality not the quantity of gaming. I’ve had the fortune of gaming under some really great GM’s :Jim Milligan, Les Clark and Damian Gillaume. And I’ve played with some great crews over the years, including the Atomic Rocket Games crew back in junior college.
|
| Fletcher |
Posted - 04 May 2005 : 17:27:47
For the sake of keeping these idividual posts to a fairly reasonable length I'm going to break it up a bit.
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
One idea is for them find some allies to their cause in members from Clan Nierdre. Ed Greenwood in his thread recently revealed a large amount of current information on this clan that might be helpful with your campaign. As he stated, House Nierdre "differed from most sun elves of Myth Drannor in eagerly embracing the 'dream' of all demin-human races dwelling in harmony." That belief in my campaign has passed down to current day Nierdres although Ed's information did state that "today, most of the Nierdres are as haughty as most sun elves towards non-elves."
I just finished reading that portion of ed's notes last night.:) I have put the entire family as he listed it. It will definitely add a little bit of flavor that isn't colored entirely by my mind.
quote:
I've ordered the novel Forsaken House and I am waiting impatiently to read it.
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
How soon til you get it? You'll see some new noble clans featured in that book.
I should get it by the end of the week, but I'm going to be traveling for work tomorrow through Wednesday next week, so I won't be around to pick it up until next week.
quote:
I see the negotiations being used in the following ways:
1) some elves might actually think negotiating could work(think Nazi era appeasement)
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
I can see that being a belief by a small percentage. What is the religion of the dark elves that they will be negotiating with? Vhaeraun?
Yup, the Llothites are a little too well known(and that is what they are expecting). I think it is more fun to have a Vhaeraun’s guys running the show when the PC’s are expecting it to be Lloth’s llewd lladies.
quote:
2) Some elves are using it as a delaying tactic to gain time to prepare.
[quote]Originally posted by SiriusBlack
Yes, even the ones who might wish for the negotiations to work might secretly be making preparations for an invasion already if negotiations fail. After all, last we heard canon wise, the dark elves were very interested in the mythal. If they have been making progress towards that aim in your campaign, well, some elves will never let that happen.
Hmm…interested in mythals. That is an angle I hadn’t really pushed towards the front of my mind. And you are right, I can think of all sorts of people who would be distressed if the drow developed mythals. They are powerful and dangerous enough as it is. |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 04 May 2005 : 01:45:07
quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher
They are both Gold Elves.
Oh yes, a political campaign should definitely be done with this subrace in the spotlight.
quote:
One is an old offshoot of the Nimsin clan that still bears the Nimsin honorific and has direct ties to that once again illustrious house. This household has a great history of powerful Druids, Rangers and other Wilderness sages.
An interesting thing to remember is Nimesin clan is a minor branch of House Durothil. That should bring up some intriguing connections for that character.
quote:
The other is an offshoot of the MythDrannor Durothil's that changed their name through marriage and deeds to Ack'Quan. The Ack'Quan clan tends to be very pro-integrationist. The Ack'Quan family has a history of mage craft, and bardic abilities. They have a bastard started offshoot Clan, the Ur'Quan that have taken up the more martial side and number quite a few great fighters, but remarkably few spell casters. Not a single Ur'Quan has ever become a bladesinger.
Ah, so again, another connection to the Durothils. Wonderful for a DM and challenging for the players. 
quote:
I am definitely planning on making an issue of how unhappy some of the great families are with their long time association and continued interest with the humans. They are in Evermeet pushing for greater integration with the human nations after all.
One idea is for them find some allies to their cause in members from Clan Nierdre. Ed Greenwood in his thread recently revealed a large amount of current information on this clan that might be helpful with your campaign. As he stated, House Nierdre "differed from most sun elves of Myth Drannor in eagerly embracing the 'dream' of all demin-human races dwelling in harmony." That belief in my campaign has passed down to current day Nierdres although Ed's information did state that "today, most of the Nierdres are as haughty as most sun elves towards non-elves."
quote:
I've ordered the novel Forsaken House and I am waiting impatiently to read it.
How soon til you get it? You'll see some new noble clans featured in that book.
quote:
I see the negotiations being used in the following ways:
1) some elves might actually think negotiating could work(think Nazi era appeasement)
I can see that being a belief by a small percentage. What is the religion of the dark elves that they will be negotiating with? Vhaeraun?
quote:
2) Some elves are using it as a delaying tactic to gain time to prepare.
Yes, even the ones who might wish for the negotiations to work might secretly be making preparations for an invasion already if negotiations fail. After all, last we heard canon wise, the dark elves were very interested in the mythal. If they have been making progress towards that aim in your campaign, well, some elves will never let that happen.
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3) Some are using the negotiations as a way of embarrassing powerful political foes.
Selfish people will be found in every situation.
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4) Some are hoping to either make a secret alliance with the drow
I was already thinking that this might be a charge the player characters and their clan members end up having levied against them. After all, they are already associating with humans, thus to some it won't be that big of a stretch to believe they would make alliances with dark elves.
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5) Some are hoping to divert the drow attention to the human during the negotiations
A certain human nation? Sembia? Cormyr?
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6) Some are expecting the negotiations to go very wrong and are using it to eliminate certain elements they disagree with.
Elements or figures?
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7) Some are using the negotiations to attempt to gain information on the strengths and weaknesses of the drow.
That could be something that certain aides to the elven diplomats are charged with. Assist the negotiators, but while you are there, assess the dark elven forces. How will that go over if the dark elves realize what is being done?
quote:
I'll probably think of a couple other sub-currents, plots and bluffs such as the following:
For what it's worth, your players sound like they have a wonderfully imaginative DM.
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2) A Durothil family member will go and arrange to have himself be at one of the meetings in order to attempt to critically sabotage the negotiations and prevent dealings with the drow. Of course this could precipitate the war, but that isn't their primary concern.
And what you can always have a Durothil like that fall back on is, "I was doing this for the elven race." Amazing what some will attempt to justify with such a statement no matter what the race.
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It will be up to the PC's to either arrange to go to the negotiations, arrange for the negotiations not to happen or perhaps insure that most of these malcontents are not with the delegation.
How often do you meet to game? This sounds like a campaign that could go on for quite some time. And if you don't mind me asking, what are the ages of everyone involved?
Sirius |
| Fletcher |
Posted - 03 May 2005 : 22:19:12
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
What subrace are they? Did you make their characters part of an established elven noble clan? Or made up their clan solely for your campaign?
They are both Gold Elves. One is an old offshoot of the Nimsin clan that still bears the Nimsin honorific and has direct ties to that once again illustrious house. This household has a great history of powerful Druids, Rangers and other Wilderness sages.
The other is an offshoot of the MythDrannor Durothil's that changed their name through marriage and deeds to Ack'Quan. The Ack'Quan clan tends to be very pro-integrationist. The Ack'Quan family has a history of mage craft, and bardic abilities. They have a bastard started offshoot Clan, the Ur'Quan that have taken up the more martial side and number quite a few great fighters, but remarkably few spell casters. Not a single Ur'Quan has ever become a bladesinger.
quote:
I like how you are going for nuances and subtlety which are wonderful things for a political campaign. Besides what you mentioned above, recall that no matter the amount of good the PCs have done on the mainland, some elves will look down upon them for associating with humans. That's another element that could be introduced to drag the clan's status down.
I am definitely planning on making an issue of how unhappy some of the great families are with their long time association and continued interest with the humans. They are in Evermeet pushing for greater integration with the human nations after all.
quote:
Richard Baker's novel that I and kuje31 previously mentioned would help somewhat there. In the council scenes you clearly get an idea as far as how some members (who are part of noble clans) feel towards the mainland. All I can say is, the biggest obstacle, just from that novel, to negotiations with the dark elves in the Cormanthor would probably be the Durothils.
I've ordered the novel Forsaken House and I am waiting impatiently to read it. I see the negotiations being used in the following ways:
1) some elves might actually think negotiating could work(think Nazi era appeasement)
2) Some elves are using it as a delaying tactic to gain time to prepare.
3) Some are using the negotiations as a way of embarrassing powerful political foes.
4) Some are hoping to either make a secret alliance with the drow
5) Some are hoping to divert the drow attention to the human during the negotiations
6) Some are expecting the negotiations to go very wrong and are using it to eliminate certain elements they disagree with.
7) Some are using the negotiations to attempt to gain information on the strengths and weaknesses of the drow.
I'll probably think of a couple other sub-currents, plots and bluffs such as the following:
1) The Nimesin are supporting the negotiations because three of the lords who are most adamant against increasing the elven armies stock of shock lances (made by their wizards) will be going as chief negotiators, and administrators. But they will profess to be doing so in an effort to stop or delay a war. They will also have put a spy or three into the entourage. One to watch their enemies, one to spy on the drow, and a third will be a skilled assassin in case a scene needs to be arranged.
2) A Durothil family member will go and arrange to have himself be at one of the meetings in order to attempt to critically sabotage the negotiations and prevent dealings with the drow. Of course this could precipitate the war, but that isn't their primary concern.
3) An advisor to the queen will support the negotiations in return for having support on a key issue of interest to him.
It will be up to the PC's to either arrange to go to the negotiations, arrange for the negotiations not to happen or perhaps insure that most of these malcontents are not with the delegation.
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| Kuje |
Posted - 03 May 2005 : 18:43:31
Grins at Sirius.  |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 03 May 2005 : 17:57:40
quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher
Thanks for the info.
You're welcome.
quote:
The game started in 1200 year of the Buckler, and has progressed through the current game year of 1389 year of the forgiven foes. Several generations have passed for much of the party.
An epic campaign that spans centuries and moves well into the future of Faerun...someone is after my own heart.
quote:
But after more than a hundred years of adventuring with non-elves they are looking forward to going to Evermeet to join their family there.
What subrace are they? Did you make their characters part of an established elven noble clan? Or made up their clan solely for your campaign?
quote:
I am working on a primarily political plot at the moment which involves their clan in danger of losing their place in elven society. I am planning on the enemies of their clan to arrange to have the most respected clan leader to be the head of a delegation to speak with the drow emerging in the forests of Cormanthyr. Ostensibly to negotiate a peace, and head off a war that is brewing. Should it fail, the loss of prestige, not to mention the possible loss of head of the clan, will reduce their status greatly, and make them easy to blame for everything that goes wrong during the war.
I like how you are going for nuances and subtlety which are wonderful things for a political campaign. Besides what you mentioned above, recall that no matter the amount of good the PCs have done on the mainland, some elves will look down upon them for associating with humans. That's another element that could be introduced to drag the clan's status down.
quote:
One of the things I am working on is trying to get a handle on how the elves handle internal politicking and which clans are allies and which ones are enemies. Which clans are backstabbing sycophants clawing their way up the social ladder by cutting every one else down, and which ones are building themselves up in a positive fashion.
Richard Baker's novel that I and kuje31 previously mentioned would help somewhat there. In the council scenes you clearly get an idea as far as how some members (who are part of noble clans) feel towards the mainland. All I can say is, the biggest obstacle, just from that novel, to negotiations with the dark elves in the Cormanthor would probably be the Durothils. |
| Fletcher |
Posted - 03 May 2005 : 17:20:17
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
Fletcher,
The Elves of Evermeet tome would be a good start for what you are looking for as it has some basic information on some of the families/clans present on the island.
Elaine Cunningham's novel, Evermeet: Island of Elves details a some of the island's history which could inspire the campaign.
Finally, for a brief look at the current politics of Evermeet, Richard Baker's last novel, Forsaken House is a wonderful resource. You get to see the Queen and her council in action.
You mentioned that your characters "are happy with how they have done in Cormyr and are ready to try to increase the nation's alliances with the elven nation of Evermeet."
What have they done in Cormyr? Anything that might provide a tie-in to Evermeet? Additionally, what time frame is your campaign set in?
Thanks for the info.
The game started in 1200 year of the Buckler, and has progressed through the current game year of 1389 year of the forgiven foes. Several generations have passed for much of the party.
They have over the generations completed tasks such as the reviving of the lost fort into a vibrant (if small) community. They have tackled unsuccessfully the cult of Malar in the Hullack Forest. Aided in the freeing of Arabel and harassed the orcish forces out of the Kings Forest.
They have currently retired from the active forces of Cormyr. One acted as a scout leader and the other as a war wizard who developed some rather effective, though expensive, tactics against large forces. They are retiring after rooting out several traitors who had been accepting money from Sembian merchants to falsify documents about the status of the forces on the eastern border of Cormyr. The traitors rerouted supplies and reinforcements to the west, leaving the border of Cormyr vulnerable to invasion.
But after more than a hundred years of adventuring with non-elves they are looking forward to going to Evermeet to join their family there.
I am working on a primarily political plot at the moment which involves their clan in danger of losing their place in elven society. I am planning on the enemies of their clan to arrange to have the most respected clan leader to be the head of a delegation to speak with the drow emerging in the forests of Cormanthyr. Ostensibly to negotiate a peace, and head off a war that is brewing. Should it fail, the loss of prestige, not to mention the possible loss of head of the clan, will reduce their status greatly, and make them easy to blame for everything that goes wrong during the war.
One of the things I am working on is trying to get a handle on how the elves handle internal politicking and which clans are allies and which ones are enemies. Which clans are backstabbing sycophants clawing their way up the social ladder by cutting every one else down, and which ones are building themselves up in a positive fashion.
So I have been reading and reading and gathering a better idea, but there is so much further to go before my players get to Evermeet. I think I'm going to have to distract them with a cheesy side adventure until I get my head wrapped around this.
Once again, thanks for the advice on where to look.
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| The Sage |
Posted - 03 May 2005 : 04:12:10
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
Thus, I'll take any information I can get in the remaining two novels within this series.
While I've always made the habit of writing up notebooks containing novel Realmslore references each time I read an FR novel, I can see that my notebooks for the entire Last Mythal trilogy will be extremely useful for all my elven-based campaigns in the Realms.
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| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 03 May 2005 : 03:05:09
quote:
Originally posted by kuje31
Teach me to reply when I'm not awake. I mean novel in the 2nd part. Edited and bah, ignore me like every one else does. Echo? What? Huh?
What?
And to try and steer this back on topic...
Fletcher,
As I previously mentioned, depending upon when your campaign takes place, Richard Baker's Last Mythal series could be the most benefial resource out of all the ones I and someone else mentioned.
The first novel in that series featured some dynamic scenes of Queen Amlaruil and her current day council. It left me with a strong desire to see a sourcebook featuring the various current day Elven noble houses. Alas, I doubt such a product will ever see print. Thus, I'll take any information I can get in the remaining two novels within this series.
SB who reminds everyone politics and intrigue are much more fun than a moonblade scimitar +5. |
| Kuje |
Posted - 03 May 2005 : 02:11:49
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
quote:
Originally posted by kuje31
Feels like I'm being the ignored Scribe again. :) Coughs on Sirius.
My answer was more verbose. Besides you used the phrase Evermeet sourcebook twice. That phrase is too general. How am I as a scribe to know if you mean the novel or gaming product? Both actualy are books that are sources of information on Evermeet.
Teach me to reply when I'm not awake. I mean novel in the 2nd part. Edited and bah, ignore me like every one else does. Echo? What? Huh? |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 03 May 2005 : 01:56:42
quote:
Originally posted by kuje31
Feels like I'm being the ignored Scribe again. :) Coughs on Sirius.
My answer was more verbose. Besides you used the phrase Evermeet sourcebook twice. That phrase is too general. How am I as a scribe to know if you mean the novel or gaming product? Both actualy are books that are sources of information on Evermeet.
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| Kuje |
Posted - 03 May 2005 : 01:50:00
Feels like I'm being the ignored Scribe again. :) Coughs on Sirius. |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 03 May 2005 : 01:14:51
Fletcher,
The Elves of Evermeet tome would be a good start for what you are looking for as it has some basic information on some of the families/clans present on the island.
Elaine Cunningham's novel, Evermeet: Island of Elves details a some of the island's history which could inspire the campaign.
Finally, for a brief look at the current politics of Evermeet, Richard Baker's last novel, Forsaken House is a wonderful resource. You get to see the Queen and her council in action.
You mentioned that your characters "are happy with how they have done in Cormyr and are ready to try to increase the nation's alliances with the elven nation of Evermeet."
What have they done in Cormyr? Anything that might provide a tie-in to Evermeet? Additionally, what time frame is your campaign set in? |
| Kuje |
Posted - 02 May 2005 : 22:42:32
The Evermeet sourcebook has some of the houses but not really where they stand on the Isle.
Um other then that I'd read Elaine's Evermeet Arilyn novels. The Evermeet novel. Richard Baker's Last Mythal novels but only book 1 is out right now.
Cormanthyr: Empire of the Elves sourcebook is also useful because you can get ideas from that main elven city. Ed's Elminster in Myth Drannor novel as well. |
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