| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Jacinth Greyfox |
Posted - 21 Mar 2004 : 14:51:57
Can anyone direct me to where i can find some information about what constellations are visible from Faerun? My players are currently heading along the Golden Way from the East towards Two Stars where the stars of East and West meet. As one of the characters in the group is a Swami and Astrologer he is certain to ask questions about this ..... |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Markustay |
Posted - 11 Jan 2013 : 05:13:00
I would guess that that is an OLD NDA dating from when SJ was a current setting - can't be talking about FR's stars when their might be designers doing stuff in space. Its a shame that they never bother to lift these things when they become obsolete.
quote:
Originally posted by Razz
Mind linking what you have, Markus? About to run a seafaring campaign in the Realms and constellation and star lore is a dire necessity.
I found THIS right here at Candlekeep, although its mostly homebrew. I only used two of the canon ones (he was good enough to differentiate between the canon and non-canon ones).
I just needed names to slap on my tropic circles to make them more 'Realmsy'.  |
| The Sage |
Posted - 10 Jan 2013 : 02:49:11
quote:
Originally posted by Razz
What surprises me is that Ed is under NDA with the constellations and stars of note in the Realms which means something that is to be published on the topic is supposed to come about. I hope it's the next "Ed Greenwood Presents" book.
The other possibility, aside from what Wooly just noted, is that the NDA was so broadly organised, that any direct references to stars and constellations in future material also fell under its protection. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 09 Jan 2013 : 23:24:12
quote:
Originally posted by Razz
What surprises me is that Ed is under NDA with the constellations and stars of note in the Realms which means something that is to be published on the topic is supposed to come about. I hope it's the next "Ed Greenwood Presents" book.
Well, it means something was planned... WotC rarely lifts NDAs, so the constellation NDA could have been in effect for a decade or longer. Even if it was recent when Ed said that, that was still back in 2008 when I shared that blurb. |
| Razz |
Posted - 09 Jan 2013 : 18:07:26
Mind linking what you have, Markus? About to run a seafaring campaign in the Realms and constellation and star lore is a dire necessity. |
| Razz |
Posted - 09 Jan 2013 : 17:49:51
What surprises me is that Ed is under NDA with the constellations and stars of note in the Realms which means something that is to be published on the topic is supposed to come about. I hope it's the next "Ed Greenwood Presents" book.
Or better yet, I wish they could do more broad topics in the Eye on the Realms Dragon articles instead of "this nobleman" or "that door under that one house" or "that +2 dragon tickling dagger" or whatever |
| Markustay |
Posted - 04 Jan 2013 : 22:06:12
This thread is full of dead links 
Does anyone have a current list of FR's Constellations, or know where I can find one?
Nevermind - I found enough of what I needed. |
| Hawkins |
Posted - 18 Mar 2009 : 22:35:21
I'm not sure if someone posted this before, but www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Castle/2566/stars.htm" target="_blank">HERE is a helpful page detailing some official and unofficial (fan made) constellations. |
| Rinonalyrna Fathomlin |
Posted - 14 Sep 2008 : 19:52:20
As someone with amateur-level knowledge of the constellations, I agree with your rant. |
| Vangelor |
Posted - 14 Sep 2008 : 08:43:44
While of course one may freely invent for one's own campaign, my understanding from various of Ed's realmslore replies was that judicial astrology - that is, the art or science of deriving omens from the relative positions of the visible planets against a fixed star apparant background - is not widely used in Faerun, although certain astronomical observances (solstices, etc.) are used to guide things like planting or harvest and to determine the time of certain religious observances.
Was the Dragon magazine article a Faerunian zodiac? Who was the author?
Also, some of this stuff, especially the old "Stars of Faerun" lore, is astronomical (and astrological) tripe - that is to say, it reflects a deep ignorance of how our view of the heavens works.
If you go far to the east... you won't see different stars, they will be the same stars you see in the west. You will see them rising sooner than you would at home, but relatively at the same time, compared to the rising and setting of the sun at that season. You need to change you latitude, not your longitude, to see a different celestial hemisphere, because the planet rotates toward the east - everything rises there, and sets in the west, just like the sun.
So a star can be "in the west", but only at a certain time of night (before it sets) at a certain time of year (when it is visible in the night sky). Hence, a town "where the stars of the east and west meet" only makes any possible sense if it is a town between two cultures that name the constellations differently, and hence both sets of names / constellations "meet".
Sorry to go off on a rant, but this sort of thing, along with random lunar phases or tides, drive me nuts. ;) That said, in my campaign, if a planet needs to appear in the sky at a certain time for the sake of plot, there it is.
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| Purple Dragon Knight |
Posted - 11 Sep 2008 : 21:30:31
Boozehound: I have NWN2, but I am currently playing the single-player campaign that comes with it (that, and I have no ranks in "Knowledge: Computers"), so what does this do? |
| Boozehound Blue |
Posted - 11 Sep 2008 : 17:53:12
I've put the system on the ign vault here if anyone's interested: http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=NWN2UI.Detail&id=108 |
| Boozehound Blue |
Posted - 26 Aug 2008 : 08:46:32
Hi,
I just joined after stumbling here from a google search, but I've been working on a Realmspace astronomy/astrology system for NWN and NWN2 for about a year now, which is a confluence of the zodiac laid out in that Dragon issue, Realmspace, and our own solar system. It operates like any typical astrology site, allowing players to enter their birth data, then accurately calculating a 'real world' chart before translating into this fantastic nomenclature. Additionally, it can interpret all of the many aspects of natal and synastric astrology- literally 700+ readings.
I'm currently in the process of making a gui for NWN2-both an astronomical clock that handles the various calculations, and an astrology chart (based upon a Vedic Jyotish chart); but I've been wondering about my interpretations. Currently, they are simply transposed from 'reality' unto fantasy because I've yet to find any fullsome body of work on the matter; and I lack the fantasy background to write something convincing to a purist.
In any case, I thought I'd mention it here if anyone has some input. I've put a couple of pictures on the web: http://www.flickr.com/photos/57759692@N00/2796866741
Also, the NWN system is viewable here: http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=Modules.Detail&id=5628
If I can get over a few coding hurdles I'll have the gui up in a couple weeks... hopefully.
Also, for anyone interested in coding a system (like a epheremides) which utilizes our solar system's orbital data, here is a step by step process by which to do so: http://stjarnhimlen.se/comp/ppcomp.html#5a.
Again, if anyone has any insight (or questions?) they'd like to share, that'd be great. I would be open to collaborate on a stand-alone- er, thingy; but my coding knowledge goes as far nwscript and its (apparently) bastardized xml.
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| DorianAdricus |
Posted - 15 Jul 2008 : 19:51:32
Indeed, that is a great resource, rjfras. I also checked out Dragon #340 for some rule mechanics based around Profession (astrologer). While I love the RP possibilities of the Almagest of Handreth, I was sorely disappointed with the Dragon article.
I don't really like the way they set up the "birth feats". Especially if you compare them to other feats that you can only take at 1st level (like some of the better Realms regional feats), they are pretty weak. Additionally, the only use they suggested for Profession (astrologer) was that one could work up a profile for someone in 1d4 hours and roll two d12's, gaining variable, small pluses and minuses to various specific actions for that day. The concept of it is kind of like Schrödinger's horoscope. The lucky or unlucky actions only exist if you are looking at them. Additionally, there is no point to having a high rating as the best one can accomplish by beating a high DC is to make a little bit more cash selling the service, not actually getting better in game benefits.
I might try working up something based on AJA's constellations and Ed's revelations about the confluence of constellations and the idea of travelings stars, but if anyone has taken a shot at this before or would like to throw out some ideas, please do |
| rjfras |
Posted - 15 Jul 2008 : 07:26:51
Check out
The Almagest of Handreth http://realmshelps.dandello.net/datafind/almagest.shtml
also The Realms Random Birthday & Birth Sign Finder http://realmshelps.dandello.net/datafind/bday.shtml. After you get a birthday or put your characters in, be sure to click the "Natal Horoscope" part of the line at the bottom "Natal Horoscope from the Almagest of Handreth"
While it's not "official" it is adapted pretty well IMHO. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 15 Jul 2008 : 00:01:27
quote:
Originally posted by DorianAdricus
Has anyone done any more with integrating the work in Dragon #340 on Knowledge (astrology) and the Faerunian zodiac? I find myself also with a Sublime Chord in the making with an interest in using those ranks of prereq. skill.
There is no Faerûnian zodiac.
quote:
Hi again, everybody. Ed sails into Wooly Rupert’s question: “I was reading the Dragon Magazine article on fantasy astrological signs, earlier this eve... It made me ponder a couple of things. Though both topics have been discussed, I don't believe anyone has ever thought to ask Ed. So... Does astrology exist in the Realms? Is there a zodiac? And what constellations exist in the Realms?”
Ed replies:
Yes, Wooly, there’s astrology in the Realms, though not by that name and not as we know it. Rather, soothsayers and fortune-tellers use the position of the stars (and sometimes, especially in the Shining South and Calimshan, by the position of tokens tossed blindly onto a star-chart) as one influence in predictions and divinations. There’s no zodiac by that name, nor are people deemed to have characteristics because of the “sign they’re born under” (as real-world astrology has it) or “year they’re born in” (as in real-world Chinese beliefs). Rather, individuals are said to be marked by a “guiding star” or “falling star” (comet or meteor shower), or by a conjunction of constellations that may have occurred at their birth (particularly if this conjunction is rare, or has a fell reputation).
There ARE constellations in the Realms, and I’ve provided some sketchy star-lore in print over the years, Elaine and others contributing more. As Eric said, AJA has done a very good job of gathering it all together (as well as weaving in his own lore) - - and I’m afraid I can’t comment too much more on the constellations, because, again, TSR is sitting on paid-for but unpublished Ed Greenwood lore, so an NDA applies.
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| DorianAdricus |
Posted - 14 Jul 2008 : 23:50:22
Has anyone done any more with integrating the work in Dragon #340 on Knowledge (astrology) and the Faerunian zodiac? I find myself also with a Sublime Chord in the making with an interest in using those ranks of prereq. skill. |
| monknwildcat |
Posted - 23 Apr 2008 : 05:15:21
Egad! I knew of Gygax's passing, but somehw I missed this! Much obliged, scribes!
A player in my campaign read up on the Sublime Chord PrC with a knowledge(astrology) prereq and wants to begin ranks in the skill. I had no idea how I was going to create background for him. I am amazed and grateful for the work and ideas presented. This will be of immense assistance! |
| Big Mac |
Posted - 12 Apr 2008 : 13:14:00
quote:
Originally posted by Jamallo Kreen
I echo Wenin -- at least one of the links was still broken as of today.
Sadly a lot of D&D related websites have been abandoned by their creators and many have already dropped off of the Internet.
I'm interested in Realmspace, but SJR2 Realmspace doesn't have anything about constellations. Beyond the Moons (the official Spelljammer website) has quite a bit of information about Realmspace, but nothing on constellations yet.
(I think it would be nice if, at some point, some sort of joint Candlekeep/Beyond the Moons team could be set up to help create more content for Realmspace. I'm sure that both FR and SJ DMs would be equally interested in the Realmspace constellations.) |
| Rinonalyrna Fathomlin |
Posted - 19 Mar 2008 : 13:56:18
Sorry to hear that. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 19 Mar 2008 : 00:09:44
Indeed. I just heard it on the radio a moment ago.
quote:
Originally written by Arthur C. Clarke
The only way of finding the limits of the possible is by going beyond them into the impossible.
Truly, he has now moved beyond, and into the impossible. Even in death, Clarke still has something left to teach us.
We will never know his like again. |
| Jamallo Kreen |
Posted - 18 Mar 2008 : 23:47:54
Alack the day! Where better on Candlekeep to announce the sad news than this scroll? Arthur C. Clarke has just died.
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| Jamallo Kreen |
Posted - 18 Mar 2008 : 23:10:14
I echo Wenin -- at least one of the links was still broken as of today.
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| Wenin |
Posted - 08 May 2007 : 08:49:08
Anyone have the files that were referenced via links in the first few posts? |
| Lemernis |
Posted - 08 May 2007 : 04:42:56
FYI, I have consolidated the above system into an article in the Exodus: Shadows of the South Player Handbook here. |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 17 Jun 2006 : 01:32:21
I'll have to see if there is a good way to condence the information in the article, as it was pretty extensive. Actually, there were a few articles that were interconnected in that issue, but I will have to see if I can distill them to their simplest components. |
| Lemernis |
Posted - 17 Jun 2006 : 01:21:55
I was cleaning up old bookmarks and came across your reply. If you send me the material in question I'd be interested to see what I can do. Feel free to PM me with it, or email me (address available via my profile--if you email please include "KnightErrantJR" in the email title). Not to get carried away with it, but I do think a system like this could add one more new layer of fun. |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 21 Jan 2006 : 04:53:29
Its been a little while since this was active, but I was just wondering, for anyone that has Dragon 340, any ideas on how to match up the zodiac signs in there (and their corresonding feats) with the existing Torilian constellations, and with the ideas in this thread? |
| Lemernis |
Posted - 03 Dec 2005 : 23:39:38
Btw, thanks AJA, I agree very much with that way of looking at it.
Just a few more observations and comments:
I examined the planetary rulerships, detriments, exaltations, and falls using the substitution process I've outlined with real world astrology, and imo there are too many mismatchs in this regard in the Torilian system to work well. Something like that would really require inventing designations that are unique to the Torilian planets and signs. Maybe I'll get around to that one day, but it's not really necessary. Probably better to keep this as simple as possible anyway.
I now see that the Torilian planets aren't always the same distance from the Sun as their real world astrological symbolic counterparts. For example, in the Torilian solar system Anadia (Toril's planet that most resembles Mars symbolically) is closest to the Sun--whereas in real world astronomy Mercury is closest to the Sun.
Therefore, strictly for the purposes of plotting the planets' movements, one might treat Mercury, rather than Mars, as Anadia, for example. And ditto for any other planets in the two systems whose orbits more closely resemble each other. Not something I would bother with myself, but if one wanted to be more meticulous about such things there it is.
The Harptos calendar uses 30 day months with 5 holidays that fall in between certain months, and one leap day holiday (Shieldmeet) every four years. Just use the real world calendar, and then find its match with the Torilan calendar, eg, Hammer = January, Alturiak = February, etc. If you want to get it exact, I'd suggest counting the total number of days from the 1st of January/Hammer, otherwise just substituting the date will have you within a day or two. The further into the year, the further off the calculations will be if you just go by substituting the date, though.
The Torilian Moon has a 30 day cycle whereas the real world Moon has a 28 day cycle. Fortunately, the WotC calendar tool (link given below) calculates the Moon's phase for you, for any year.
Harptos calendar sites:
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/frx/20050525x
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Castle/2566/calendar.htm
http://www.phoenyx.net/realms/calender.htm |
| Lemernis |
Posted - 02 Dec 2005 : 12:18:50
Just to round this out, here is a bit more information on the planets:
The archetype for the luminaries and planets is their elemental energy, but flavored with different archetypal associations from the various Torilian deities.
Sun
Fire as symbolized by Kossuth is a force of purification. Kossuth's ideal of purification draws upon a smithing analogy. Fire in a smith's forge strengthens and purifies metal. Thus, Kossuth's dogma is to seek challenges that forge the soul into a higher state of development, and a stonger, more powerful, purer form. The impulse here resembles something the ancient Greeks refered to as "Arete", which means excellence in action, to improve oneself, to seek perfection, to shine brightly, to be the best.
Kossuth's domains includes Renewal. The energy of the spring and the dawn celebrated by Lathander are indicated by the Sun. The Sun represents revitalization, refreshment, new growth, and energization.
In the correspondence between Torilian and real world astrology, the Sun may be viewed as a combination of real world astrology's Sun and Jupiter. In ancient astrology Jupiter was a planet associated with kings. So leadership and administration in general, organization, ambition, things grand or majestic, etc., are indicated by the Sun.
Element: Fire
Elemental Deity: Kossuth
Associated Archetypes: Lathander, Milil
Selune
Water as symbolized by Istishia is a force of constant change. The basic impulse captured here is one of adaptation and flexibility. The cyclical nature of water's changing states is emphasized. Cycles in nature repeat eternally, therefore consequences to one's actions is represented. To some degree fairness and justice are also indicated, at least in the broad spiritual sense of reaping what one sows in life.
Istishia's domains include Destruction, Storm, and Travel, and these are manifested in the Torilian Moon's influence upon the oceans and tides.
The goddess Selune and her domains of Travel and Protection are indicated by the Torilian Moon. Selune is the divine matron of navigators, guides, seekers, questers, and wanderers.
Element: Water
Elemental Deity: Istishia
Associated Archetypes: Selune, Shaundakul
Anadia
"(Kossuth) Reddish color, also often associated with Garagos the Reaver (humans). The orcs call the planet Gruumsh's Eye, and believe that, at the end of the world, the Eye will purify Faerun in a rain of fire, leaving only the orcs to rule. The elves call Anadia Uluemyn, and associate it with the god Solonor Thelandira."
Anadia is nearly identical to real world astrology's Mars, the god of war. In contrast, in the Torilian system, however, cruelty seems more prominent in the Warrior archetype's darker manifestations.
Anadia represents fire's basic elemental energy as symbolized by Kossuth, but here with an emphasis on fire's destructive power.
Kossuth's domains includes Suffering. Anadia symbolizes an utter ruthlessness that is typically in a battle to the death. In its civilized manifestations the planet also represents the warrior's courage, his readiness to assume risk of death or physical debility in a heartfelt cause. At its most refined, this impulse reflects a mature ownership of struggle, adversity, and pain as essential to growth. In its darker forms it represents the bully, tyrant, and sadist. Survival of the fittest, competition, domination, supremacy, and martial ability are symbolized by this planet. Controled, this energy is skill in combat. Uncontroled it is destructive, mindless rage.
Element: Fire
Elemental Deity: Kossuth
Associated Archetypes: Tempus, Garagos, Tyr, Red Knight, other deities favored by warriors
Coliar
"(Akadi) Bluish-white color. The elves call Coliar Luridel, and associate it with Erevan Ilesere. To the humans of the Heartlands, Coliar is commonly called the Philosopher's Star, and is associated with the legendary sage Alaundo."
The element of air as symbolized by Akadi is the impulse of freedom, and following one's desires and interests wherever they may lead. Like the air and wind, this planet symbolizes resistance to structure and constraints.
Akadi's domains includes Travel, Illusion, and Trickery. She is popular with rogues and rangers. A ranger's love of freedom and wild, open spaces is indicated. Coliar's darker manifestation is represented by the rogue, and activities requiring stealth, deception, and lawbreaking.
Coliar is associated with sages and philosophers because the air element represents the restlessness of the mind in search of greater knowledge, experience, and wisdom. The mind's ability to see beyond the literal, and it's capacity for abstraction and invention is also symbolized.
Element: Air
Elemental Deity: Akadi
Associated Archetypes: Azuth, Mystra, Oghma, Gond, Savras, Mask, Brandobaris
Karpri
"(Istishia) Blue-green color. The elves call Karpri Ochael, and associate it with Rillifane Rallathil."
Like Selune, Karpri also symbolizes the element of water as symbolized by Istishia. Karpri emphasizes water's beauty, and the fact that it is a source of life that connects all living things. Forms of connectedness including love, passion, attachment, care, and nurturing are all represented here.
Element: Water
Elemental Deity: Istishia
Associated Archetypes: Sune, Eldath, Sharess
Chandos
"(Grumbar) Brownish color. The elves call Chandos Iaras, and associate it with Labelas Enoreth."
The element of earth as symbolized by Grumbar is an impulse of stability and endurance. This planet represents that which is timeless and unchanging, like the mountains. Chandos also represents structure, consistency, limitation, and the law.
Element: Earth
Elemental Deity: Grumbar
Associated Archetypes: Tyr, Azuth, Kelemvor |
| AJA |
Posted - 02 Dec 2005 : 10:08:38
Well, I like it. 
I like it alot, actually. It follows real world patterns for consistency, but still retains much of the "secondary-world verisimilitude" (as Faraer would probably say ) to mark it as Of The Realms, and not just generic fantasy.
And I especially like the "associated archetypes" sections. Lends itself to lots of plot hooks, and shadowy religious cults, and lost temples that can only be found when the light of a certain planet shines through a certain constellation it does.....
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