| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Eilserus |
Posted - 17 Jul 2013 : 09:36:51
Hello all,
Can't really seem to find an answer to this, so here's the scenario:
We have a blind ogre, with a goblin witchdoctor riding in a harness on his back. The ogre is holding a rope that is tied around a small treasure chest [2x2x2]. The ogre is also dragging a dead bugbear in the other hand. So when combat breaks out:
What damage should the treasure chest do: 1d6?
What damage should the body of the bugbear do: 1d4?
How many hits do you think a chest will take before it explodes into splinters? If a small chest is 25 pounds empty, that thing would have to hit like a sledge wouldn't you think?
Pretty curious as to how others handle improvised weapons. :)
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| 11 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| TBeholder |
Posted - 16 Nov 2021 : 02:40:35
For rules on primitive non-metal weapons, see primitive and metal-poor settings. That is: Dark Sun, Maztica and maybe Living Jungle (Malatra).
quote:
Originally posted by BEAST
Have you considered that the chest might be fabricated of petrified wood, with iron band reinforcements? That might lend it a bit of durability for a few more whacks.
Dark Sun has a spell for this ("Petrification"/"Petrify Wood", Level: 1, Duration: CL*6 rounds).
Of course, permanent petrification would be more useful (level 3, perhaps).
For applications other than bludgeons, even more useful if it's partial, so that wood retain elasticity, but reduce flammability).
Or opalization, both for decorative value (also, this way some shaping and coloring can be done on a living plant before it's harvested) and because xylopal can be used as a component for reverse gravity, thus perhaps for items with the same spell (obviously more suitable for crafting than iron filings, and adding more transformed wooden panels or tiles would allow to shape and scale the area as desired).
Another curious question: how fungi should be handled for spells affecting wood?
Treating them as wood doesn't feel right. A separate variant of the same level? |
| Eilserus |
Posted - 18 Jul 2013 : 19:04:42
That's a neat idea with petrified wood. Might have to use that. :) |
| BEAST |
Posted - 18 Jul 2013 : 17:47:58
quote:
Originally posted by Eilserus
I was thinking more of a Master Blaster type comedy scenario, as the frustrated goblin witchdoctor is going to be bonking the blind ogre on the head with his bone leg tribal fetish, trying to direct the brute. I'm picturing the chest eventually exploding in a spray of copper coins that the ogre might trip in. I'll have to remember the rubber chicken slinging idea. heheh :)
Oh, yeah, I totally got the Master Blaster vibe, too.
That image just got obliterated by the image of Fozzie yelling, "Wokka! Wokka! WOKKA!"
Have you considered that the chest might be fabricated of petrified wood, with iron band reinforcements? That might lend it a bit of durability for a few more whacks. |
| Joebing |
Posted - 18 Jul 2013 : 16:31:31
I had a similar scenario once that played out like this:
1) Svirneblin attack party with gnomish flamethrowers and beartrap paddles (see Dungeon 80, "The Frothing Miscreant").
2) A svirneblin crit misses with flamethrower, hitting another gnome, just as the gnome he hit is hit by a beartrap paddle wielded by a PC (Janni wearing a gauntlets of ogre strength).
3) Beartrap paddle jams, so PC uses the flaming gnome in beartrap as a weapon. ruled 2d6 for the damage (1d6 gnome, 1d6 fire).
4) PC retires, opens tavern called "The Flaming Gnome", mounts charred skeleton in beartrap paddle behind bar.
A bugbear would probably do 1d8+Str mod damage, but even for an ogre may need two hands to swing the body. I usually treat anything situation using a dead body as a weapon (it seems to happen a lot in my campaigns - my PC's think not outside the box, but outside of the semi said box is in) like this: for effective weapon use (one-handed, possibly multiple attacks), the corpse must be two size classes smaller or the PC/NPC must have a Str over 25, with the corpse being on the lower end of the size class below. All other instances with a corpse larger must use two hands.
I have seen stuff like the chest too (like I said, the players in my campaigns are out there). Full of coins is around 40# in your scenario, so use 1d10 or 1d12 plus Str mod. The ogre, to swing one-handed on a rope, would need to start spinning like a top, unless the rope is less than 2 foot long, and would have to keep the motion up (whirling up to speed as you put it).
How the chest breaks would depend on the material and condition of it. I am assuming it is wood, so even in good shape, use the hardness and hp stats in the DMG for a chest. Use the ogre's attack roll against the hardness, just as you would against the PC's, subtract damage dealt to PC's from the hp of the chest.
You can also simplify the last part (I have had to do this WAY too many times). If the ogre hits 3 times dealing over half max damage each time, or crits once, the chest explodes apart. Remember, the coins, upon the breaking of the chest, can do subdual damage to others as well, even more if the edges are sharpened or the others in the room have weak spots. |
| Eilserus |
Posted - 18 Jul 2013 : 06:13:51
Well, the treasure chest has a rope tied around it, I'm thinking something like a ball and chain style and weighs 25 pounds empty, probably 40 or so with coin. I'm not sure a 10 foot tall ogre would have a problem swinging it around, though maybe he'd only be able to attack once every other round as he whirled it up to speed. |
| Delwa |
Posted - 18 Jul 2013 : 04:13:43
If you want a real headache, treat the chest as falling damage from a heavy object (there is a chart in the DMG Under falling damage. Can't recall page number ) then add the ogre's Str bonus. I agree though, he should have to use both hands. |
| Eilserus |
Posted - 18 Jul 2013 : 00:29:16
I appreciate the feedback everyone. :)
@Beast
I was thinking more of a Master Blaster type comedy scenario, as the frustrated goblin witchdoctor is going to be bonking the blind ogre on the head with his bone leg tribal fetish, trying to direct the brute. I'm picturing the chest eventually exploding in a spray of copper coins that the ogre might trip in. I'll have to remember the rubber chicken slinging idea. heheh :)
A typical ogre is pretty far outside the power of the group at the moment so was attempting to gimp one down, that they may be able to beat with some clever tactics or have to flee from. |
| BEAST |
Posted - 17 Jul 2013 : 22:24:44
*envisions the Muppet, Fozzie the Bear, slinging a rubber chicken* |
| The Arcanamach |
Posted - 17 Jul 2013 : 21:04:44
I don't think a dead body would make a very good improvised weapon. First, ogres are big but they aren't THAT big...not big enough to swing a limp body effectively anyway. I wouldn't go above 1d6 damage for the body and, frankly, that's a bit high (it would lack the impact capability of a club). As for the chest you should have better damage at 1d8 or MAYBE 1d10. BOTH should require two hands to swing. |
| MisterX |
Posted - 17 Jul 2013 : 18:09:09
I'd go for 1d10 or even 1d12 for the chest and at least 1d8 for the body. Compare it to the damage of the clubs giants use…
To the explosions: Just use the rules for breaking objects. Give the chest (and the body as well) a hardness and hitpoints and do the math accordingly: With every hit that supercedes the hardness, substract the difference from the hitpoints. When the hitpoints reach zero, the improvised weapon breaks. |
| idilippy |
Posted - 17 Jul 2013 : 16:05:52
While it isn't official I like to think of improvised weapons being breakable and use the pathfinder goblin weapons as an example. The dogslicer breaks on a roll of natural 1, so I tend to simply go with that for improvised weapons. If you want the weapon to break faster you could raise it to being broken on a 1-2 though, or even 1-4 if it was a really rickety weapon.
I would also raise the damage 1 step for each of those. The ogre improvised treasure chest flail doing 1d8, the bugbear body 1d6. I think that's reasonable damage while still being sub-par compared to any large real weapon the ogre could wield. |
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