| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| myorke |
Posted - 27 May 2011 : 15:47:19
I'm fleshing out a smugglers guild for my Melvaunt campaign and part of the organization is a large gang of street urchins, orphans, and muggers that patrol the docks, targeting those that do not belong, etc.
Assuming that most of these kids are 0 or 1st lvl commoners, they would likely have no more than 4 ranks in sleight of hand (3.5 rules) and rarely an ability bonus. Since pickpocketing would require a DC20, they probably would not be very good at doing this well. Size and speed and familiarity with the area would probably be enough to balance the failed efforts a lot of the time, though they would end up dealing with the law enough.
My question: What would the profits of such an effort be? Given that honest work nets as little as a silver piece a day for some labourers, I wouldn't expect that these kids would see a whole lot more than that without attracting a lot of attention from the law.
Given that they have to kick up 50% to a guild handler for the permission to work the dockside, would 2 sp/day seem like a reasonable gain before kick-up? |
| 6 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| myorke |
Posted - 02 Jun 2011 : 18:03:58
You've hit the nail on the head. The original post was just about the street urchin portion of the gang, kind of a lowest level, street-level eyes, etc.
The rest of the organization deals in three main areas:
- smuggling (running warehouses and dock crews, skimming exports, stealing expensive items coming in or out, bringing in illegal items)
- slavery (capturing new slaves, switching valuable slaves with lesser ones)
- extortion (protection and collection, intimidation, bribery)
The other branches of the group include a small assassination group, some internal management (quartermaster, spy), and a "specialist" who is actively running a few adventuring groups. Their goal is to explore and retrieve magic items for the high levels of the organization who may or may not be bank rolling an evil group further afield (Zhentil Keep, or similar).
At this point, I've left gambling and prostitution to another group. It's likely taking place in my Melvaunt, but I haven't needed to directly introduce those elements yet. |
| Aldrick |
Posted - 28 May 2011 : 19:50:15
I'm rather certain that the leaders of the gang would be earning a profit off of them. They'd make sure of it. The urchins main benefit in joining the gang isn't to become wealthy it's protection, and theoretically such protection doesn't cost much to the leaders of the gang.
My thoughts....
- The gang is likely going to have the kids turning tricks for sailors coming into port. The gang is acting as their pimp.
- The gang uses intimidation tactics on the locals, and likely beats the crap out of / kills anyone who harms those who belong to the gang.
- The gang shakes down merchants and requires local businesses to offer "protection" money. Those that fail to pay find bad things happening to them, their family, or their business. Even a little kid can light a fire and burn a building to the ground.
- The gang forces the kids to steal things on its behalf, particularly from ships that make their way into port. It's easier for merchandise to get misplaced when it's being moved from the ship to a warehouse.
- The stuff that the gang steals can then be fenced on the streets or used.
- If there is anything that is illegal to buy or sell in Melvaunt the gang likely traffics in it as well.
- Some of the kids are sold into slavery, giving extra profits to the gang.
- Some kids are given to wizards for experimentation, either as favors or for more profits.
- Kidnapping and ransoming members of a merchants family. They likely wouldn't target anyone overly powerful, more along the lines of the family of street merchants and in particular certain wealthy foreigners who come into port. (Wealthy foreigners would have a tendency not to have any influence in Melvaunt.)
The list goes on and on.... Pretty much, anywhere the gang can turn a profit, it's going to look for opportunities to do so. They wouldn't restrict themselves to just pick pocketing, which in the end, is never going to be all that profitable even if all the kids were amazing at it. Most of the pick pocketing opportunities are likely drunken sailors, ships docked in port, and distracted merchant vendors.
The gang likely nominally protects the kids from the law, either through bribing or intimidating the guards, perhaps a combination of both. For example, if the guards decide they want to start ruffing up the kids, well... the gang would likely target that guards family, and I'm pretty sure the other guards will get the message after the family is kidnapped and returned to the guard bit-by-bit - a finger here, an ear there... |
| myorke |
Posted - 28 May 2011 : 17:01:30
Thanks for the great responses!
I am definitely going for a more realistic take. My main interest was in relation to how the gang would fit, profit-wise, into a larger criminal guild. Would a group of essentially expendable urchins (as nasty as that may be, Melvaunt is a nasty city) actually turn a profit for its handler, an Artful Dodger type who runs the gang and kicks-up his profits? It would be mean and meager, but the main benefit would be having a lot of eyes and ears on the ground.
The handler would also have a rotating stable of potential recruits were any of the urchins to show promise or talent.
If things take a more evil twist, the urchins might also find themselves as fodder for a wizard's experimentation, etc. |
| Kentinal |
Posted - 28 May 2011 : 13:16:17
At low levels, you are better off being a cutpurse in crowds or assassin if funding a lone target. Picking a pocket of unskilled, even if successful would not likely pay more then one gold. Low level thieves would only practice their skill, with in the guild or with friends. Once getting higher in levels and skill is the time to start to look for targets that might pay one hundred gold or more. |
| Aldrick |
Posted - 28 May 2011 : 08:05:50
Well... I'm not sure what you're going for in terms of theme. Are you looking for something of a romantic notion (something Peter Pan / Robin Hood-esk) or something more realistic?
If you go for the romantic notion, then the kids are going to need the ability to evade the law effectively, have a decent chance of success, work as a group, and have a family-ish vibe to the whole operation. There would likely be one kid, perhaps the male and oldest, who is tough and keeps everyone in line but is ultimately benevolent and works to protect his little group of thieves.
If you're going for something more realistic... then it has to start with the law. These kids are going to have no power, influence, or anyone to morn them when they're dead. And make no mistake, death is a certainty for them sooner rather than later, if not by the law, then by screwing with the wrong person. The law, no matter how shabby, isn't going to tolerate a bunch of kids running around causing trouble - especially if they're easily caught. So what is the punishment for thievery in Melvaunt? It could range from the loss of a hand, to being flogged, all the way down to being thrown in the stocks. Now, ask what is the punishment for repeated thievery?
These kids are obviously going to be repeat offenders. It is ultra rare for people to steal unless they have to in order to survive. These kids are stealing to survive. They don't really have much of a choice; it's not like there is a social safety net in existence for kids like these, and it is unlikely that the law distinguishes between adult and child offenders.
How is your economy working? It's actually rare for most common folk to have a large amount of coin. Most of the money they "earn" is subsistence-level living. It's enough money to feed themselves and their families, and sometimes not even that really covers it. Most of their actual trade would be barter rather than exchange of coins. Coins are valuable and thus are better held onto when you don't have something you can't trade for something else.
As a result, the kids are likely mostly targeting food from merchant vender's. Things they can actually eat, trade for food, or bring back to the gang to pay for protection. Being a thief isn't a glamorous life. It doesn't afford luxury or a better living, it provides you with a means to survive day-to-day, and if you're really good week-to-week. PC's are generally an exception, and not the rule. They'd also be targeting more lucrative targets such as wealthy merchants and nobles rather than common folk - who tend to be only marginally better off than the orphans themselves. Since it's based on the docks, the bulk of those targeted will be sailors and other people coming to port.
Sailors actually will have some small amount of money, though the bulk of their payment is likely incorporated into the fact that they're given food plus room and board upon the ship. Their payment is likely roughly what an unskilled worker makes, and they'd probably spend the bulk of that (if not all of it) the moment they hit the docks (gambling, prostitutes, and alcohol).
Speaking of prostitutes, more than a few kids are likely turning tricks for the sailors. It'd certainly be a more lucrative and steady income than stealing from merchants, and it also has the nice advantage of not being illegal thus protecting you from the law. Of course, that is simply replaced by fears of being raped, not paid, or badly treated by the sailors.
Though, that's where the gang comes into play. Each member of the gang is required to give something back to the gang. The kid or guy at the top likely keeps the bulk of the wealth obtained, sharing smaller portions of it with his most trusted lieutenants (it keeps them loyal). The point of the gang isn't friendship, family, or camaraderie, rather it is a more basic need: protection.
They'd join the gang because they would need to... and if they don't, well that's their turf and they'd likely cut their throat and throw them off the docks into the Moonsea. No one is going to come looking for them because they likely don't have any family, and even if they did that family has no power otherwise their child wouldn't be forced to turn tricks / become an outlaw in the first place.
Now, in contrast to the bulk of the members of the gang, the leader and his lieutenants are probably doing pretty well. At least as well as any legitimate business owner in the area, possibly even a little more depending on how many members they have and how much turf they control.
Every day of the kids life is like a living nightmare. They're not sure when their next meal is, whether they're going to die today, whether they're going to be beaten or raped (sometimes even by the guards!), or something worse - because nobody cares about a Wharf Rat. If one of them ends up dead they're easy enough to replace, no one is going to be looking for them, and because they are such a nuisance to begin with those in power would almost certainly view the death as a blessing.
That would be the most realistic take on what it would be like to be in such a position. Not really a pretty picture, which is why I asked if you wanted the more romantic theme. |
| Sill Alias |
Posted - 28 May 2011 : 05:01:02
Why? The urchins can gang up and use various con tricks to make distraction and take the silver or gold easier. J. Swift, anyone? It depends on team play of theirs. |
|
|
