| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Marquant Volker |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 13:43:03
One of my long term PCs is a Elven Ranger that plays in my campaign for about 3 years. For 1,5 - 2 years he wanted to make his own bow, a bow that he would never replace.
He spended a lot of points in craft(bowmaking), and waited as a person and character for a long time.
He is a CG Wood elf of Mielikki, he was born in High Forest but raised in Silver Marches. His character level is 22.
Me and the player agreed that the bow will be called "Starstrike"
The concept is that it will be a Weapon that adds flavour and story, much like Arilyn's Moonblade, not another magical weapon (For examble +5 Flamming Burst, Keen... etc)
I believe it should be sentient, or semi-sentient
Do anyone knows how the elves make their bows? i dont believe the craft them the same way as humans do.
Any powers that could make such a weapon unique?
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| 21 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Hellkeepa |
Posted - 02 Oct 2009 : 23:34:16
HELLo!
Well, you could replace it with the silver and icy burst abilities. Unless I'm mistaken the former is worth a +1 bonus, the latter is definately +2. Which would give the same value as above. The benefit of the icy burst ability, is that it goes well with the frozen tree branch. Could also replace it with the axiomatic/chaotic ability, depending upon wether or not the character is lawful/chaotic.
Read more about the icy burst ability here: http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Icy_Burst
Ranged weapon special abilities: http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Magic_Weapons#Table:_Ranged_Weapon_Special_Abilities
Happy playin'! |
| Marquant Volker |
Posted - 02 Oct 2009 : 22:53:27
I dont know, maybe the force arrows make the bow a little...too alien? Perhaps the Idea Hawkins posted about silver arrows in Moonlight seems better. |
| Hawkins |
Posted - 02 Oct 2009 : 18:25:59
quote:
Originally posted by Hellkeepa
So you're almost correct, only that the DR is "good" instead of "holy".
Though I don't quite see how you got it so that ranged force weapons don't require ammunition (arrows), seeing as it clearly states that they impart this ability upon their amunition. Imparting something on something else, requires that both items exists, I'd say. ;-)
Hellkeepa is correct, the DR it would overcome would be DR x/good. Though if you wanted to overcome the DR of powerful devils (i.e. pit fiends) you would need silver arrows in addition to the holy, and if you wanted to overcome the DR of powerful demons (i.e. balors) you would need to use cold iron arrows. If you want to have the focus on fighting lycanthropes, you could probably swap the infinite number of force arrows to be silver arrows instead, or have the force arrows become silver arrows in moonlight. |
| Hellkeepa |
Posted - 02 Oct 2009 : 00:29:00
HELLo!
The Holy attribute gives the following (taken from the DMG):
quote:
A holy weapon is imbued with holy power. This power makes the weapon good-aligned and thus bypasses the corresponding damage reduction. It deals an extra 2d6 points of damage against all of evil alignment. It bestows one negative level on any evil creature attempting to wield it. The negative level remains as long as the weapon is in the hand and disappears when the weapon is no longer wielded. This negative level never results in actual level loss, but it cannot be overcome in any way (including restoration spells) while the weapon is wielded. Bows, crossbows, and slings so crafted bestow the holy power upon their ammuniation.
Moderate evocation [good]; CL 7th; Craft Magic Arms and Armour, holy smite, creator must be good; Price +2 bonus
So you're almost correct, only that the DR is "good" instead of "holy".
Though I don't quite see how you got it so that ranged force weapons don't require ammunition (arrows), seeing as it clearly states that they impart this ability upon their amunition. Imparting something on something else, requires that both items exists, I'd say. ;-)
As for the abilities and worth of the bow: The force ability is a +3 bonus cost. That coupled with the holy ability, and a +5 enhancement bonus, gives a total weapon bonus of +10; The maximum a weapon can have before turning epic. Totaling 200.000 gp, the +2 wisdom would add another 18.000 gp. The +5 move silently & hide would add another 5,250, including a 30% reduction due to limitation to its use. Quench once per day would add another 8.100 gp, command word activated. Moonbeam 3 times per day, again command word acticated, would add another 7,776 gp (20% reduction in price). What the "plant-to-heal" ability would be worth, I have no idea, but for the rest we have the following numbers: 200000+18000+5250+8100+7776 = 239,126 gp
Might not seem too much, but it's when you add abilities that gives an increase to the magic bonus cost that you'll really rack up the money. For instance, making this a +6 bow would add a whopping 670.000 gp to its value. Adding the "Seeking" ability (+1), would add another (slightly more affordable) 420.000 gp. Making it a grand total of 659.126 gp.
If you want to experiment with further abilities, just use the following table to estimate the price of things:
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Creating_Magic_Items#Table:_Estimating_Magic_Item_Gold_Piece_Values
Remember to multiply all the extra abilities with 1.5, accordingly to the "Multiple different abilities" entry.
The "Magical/Psionic enhancement" table on the following page gives you the cost increase for the "plus" abilities:
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Longbow
As for semi-sentience: *Grin*
Happy playin'! |
| Marquant Volker |
Posted - 01 Oct 2009 : 11:29:32
Last night i thought more about it, the +5 Hide/Move Silently in Natural settings seems fair.
I really liked Green Giant's idea about the bow's string! So lets say the bow is Holy. It bypassed the damare reduction of several creatures (like 10/Holy) and it does extra damage (+2d6?) to evil creatures? Or only dezizens of the lower planes?
The +1 Wishdom is fair, perhaps +2?
Also the bow planted for repairs is just too elven to miss! its so ON!
For a Greater power, the ability to Quench fires by the list HawkinstheDM posted, is looks nice. Protection of the forest is both a ranger and an elven goal. (it also gets along with the Burned Wood material)
I am thinking about the following idea also: When under a starlight nightsky the bow gets extra abilities (it gents empowered). Such as: it can fire magic missiles (per attack for 4d6 (?) charges, it can cast moonbeam (it forces lycanthropes to transform to their animal formes - Malar is an elven archenemy after all), Faerie fire(?) and perhaps a ray spell with 4d8 or 5d8 (ranged touch) (as a full action) The later will be called Horn of the Unicorn or something (i think i saw this spell in Icewind dale 2 -not sure thought)
Tose abilities will be rarely used, it have to be night, not cloudy, on the surface, in the material plane...etc
For all the other time i am thinking about giving the bow the force power, as Hellkeepa posted above, if that happens a cool affect would be that the bow does not need arrows. (is this getting unbalanced?)
I dont like the ressist elements spell, i dont like the idea that rangers are guarded from the natural phenomena by spells, they had to find another way to survive.
The weapon should be semi-sentient (sentient weapons are fun, semi-sentient more mysterious). Like an Moonblade the wielder should be an Elf of good alligment. If someone is a deticated follower of Mielikki helps too. The right to claim the bow could be a mystery, but not as dangerous as a Moonblae. Starstrike does not have the power defy its wielder and vanish him...
what do you think? |
| Hellkeepa |
Posted - 30 Sep 2009 : 03:45:24
HELLo!
As a sidenote to the Magic Missile property of the bow, you could give it the "Seeking" property as well, or instead.
Love the idea about the unicorn giving strands of its mane for the string, and thusly making it a holy weapon. Should bestow negative levels for anyone but a ranger of Mielliki then, to further enhance its ties to its wielder.
The "Force" property is at least defined in the following page, almost at the bottom: http://ww2.wizards.com/Books/Wizards/?doc=fr_lonedrowstats
Happy playin'! |
| Green Giant |
Posted - 30 Sep 2009 : 01:50:29
Some ideas on your bow using the pieces of wood…
quote:
Originally posted by Marquant Volker
A piece of Living wood as a gift from a Dryad (high forest area) - This wood has the ability to heal itself under natural conditions (warmth fresh air etc) it symbolizes something like Rebirth, Circle of life, Raw Essense of the Forest(?) It still bears leaves!
This could give the bow a property similar to living metal found in Magic of Faerun. Essentially the bow repairs itself if damaged or sundered. Maybe it needs to be buried in the earth for a day with plenty of sunlight and allowed to grow to fix itself. Only fire or acid should permanently damage the weapon.
quote:
A piece of Half-Burned wood - This piece of wood was from a great proud Mapple tree of the North, the Icy wind singed amongst its brances for a long time, until a battle raged closed to it. It symbolizes Loss, Protection of the Nature, and perhaps the power of ice? 
This might grant the bow the icy burst weapon special ability and could grant its wielder a continuous endure elements against the cold.
quote:
A piece from a extra planar place, where the PCs found the twin trees of Wisdom and Inteligence (its not FR sorry to post it here, it was just an idea i found in a forum and i gave it a session-length go) He choosed a branch from the wisdom tree - It symbolizes...Wisdom(Really! ) and that nature goes beyond the borders of the material plane
This wisdom piece might give whoever carries the bow an enhancement bonus to Wisdom or a competence bonus to Wisdom-based checks like a circlet of persuasion.
quote:
Finnaly there is a piece of the Giant Oak tree in the reclaimed Myth Drannor, That tree was there when the elves settled Myth Drannor, prospered in the city, lost the city only to reclaim it after hundreds of years by younger generations. This wood is Elven History and the lessons that can be learned from it
The elven wood might only allow those with elven blood to properly wield the bow. To all others it might be a simple +1 bow but in the hands of someone with elf blood, it becomes an epic weapon.
quote:
As Mr.Erik said it could be a nice idea for a God/Godess to bless the weapon. That would be a quite easy part, our Green elf is a Ranger (no suprise here  ) and he is devoted to Mielliki.
I’ve noticed that you haven’t gathered the material for the string that’s going to be used on the bow. How about having a unicorn appear as an aspect of Mielikki and allow the ranger to cut/pluck some hairs from its mane and tail so he can weave it into the string. It might grant the bow the holy weapon special ability.
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| Erik Scott de Bie |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 23:04:24
See Hawkins' astute recommendation of weapons of legacy. This will help not only with building the bow initially (it gives guidelines on what powers to give it, etc.), but also with another character who ends up with the bow in your NEXT campaign. 
Mechanically speaking, shooting 5 magic missiles a round is probably not really overpowered (22nd level wizards can pull that off with ease), but since that's just the magic missile spell, it would cut down on the real benefits of your bow--you probably want to fire real arrows and deal precision based damage and stuff.
You might want to give all it the force property (either that's in a book somewhere , or you can just devise it yourself), so that the arrows it shoots deal force damage but are still basically arrows.
It might also have a 1/day ability like "empowered magic missile as though cast by a 12th level sorcerer."
Generally speaking, you should design a +11 weapon using the rules in the DMG for that purpose. You're in epic, so +6 is reasonable, but you might want to save the pluses for other abilities. Your choice.
The sort of bow I'd want to wield as a 22nd level elf ranger would be a +5 distance (1) seeking (1) speed (4) elven bow, with possibly a rangerish ability like "+5 to hide and move silently checks in a natural setting."
That is, however, not very flavorful. It could make a good template, though, and you could tweak from there.
Cheers |
| Hellkeepa |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 22:51:04
HELLo!
Moonbeam is described in the Forgotten Realms Campaign setting, page 73.
As for the bow, I think a +10 bonus to hide and move silently checks in forested areas would fit nicely. Considering the Living Tree branch, and all. ;-)
Happy playin'! |
| Marquant Volker |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 21:31:23
Thank you all for your feedback, i feel honored. Really.
Very resourcefull ideas and information everyone. Since the topic got more attention than i hoped, let me post more information.
I am the DM in that campaign, the bow is intented for my player. This idea carries along for a long time, my friend waited patiently until the campaign took a slower pace, so his character had the time and experience to make the bow.If i was him i would start singing the "make my bow" song far earlier , however i wanted to make something epic, storywise, not pure powerplay
Now,
As a minor-quest i asked the PC to have his eyes open for pieces of wood he could use, he could combine up to 4 pieces (for maximum effect), so he did, and his final choises are:
A piece of Living wood as a gift from a Dryad (high forest area) - This wood has the ability to heal itself under natural conditions (warmth fresh air etc) it symbolizes something like Rebirth, Circle of life, Raw Essense of the Forest(?) It still bears leaves!
A piece of Half-Burned wood - This piece of wood was from a great proud Mapple tree of the North, the Icy wind singed amongst its brances for a long time, until a battle raged closed to it. It symbolizes Loss, Protection of the Nature, and perhaps the power of ice?
A piece from a extra planar place, where the PCs found the twin trees of Wisdom and Inteligence (its not FR sorry to post it here, it was just an idea i found in a forum and i gave it a session-length go) He choosed a branch from the wisdom tree - It symbolizes...Wisdom(Really!) and that nature goes beyond the borders of the material plane
Finnaly there is a piece of the Giant Oak tree in the reclaimed Myth Drannor, That tree was there when the elves settled Myth Drannor, prospered in the city, lost the city only to reclaim it after hundreds of years by younger generations. This wood is Elven History and the lessons that can be learned from it
As Mr.Erik said it could be a nice idea for a God/Godess to bless the weapon. That would be a quite easy part, our Green elf is a Ranger (no suprise here ) and he is devoted to Mielliki.
There no spellcasting support for the party (its the first time in 4.5 years!), but even if there was i believe this bow is something personal for the Ranger, or maybe something between himself, his faith, and his detication to The People. Yes, it would be more like Bruenor crafting Aegis-Fang
For abilities the Idea of Elven bows if fitting, so an Elven bow it is!
Considering his high level i believe a +5 is OK, +4 is quite low (for lvl 22 ranger) while +6 is something i dont want to give, its better to give more abillities.
Magic missile is a good idea, if this happens it could cast everytime he shot an arrow? considering his attack (with Rapid Shot) he gets 5 attacks per round, would that be 5 maggic missiles?
I was thinking the use of a spell from Icewind dale 2, something like Horn of the Unicorn (preist of Selune got that), dont know if its cannon, but sounds good if Mielikki is about to bless Starstrike
I recall a spell named moonbeam, but i dont remember where i have founded it. perhaps it could be fitting with the bow's name.
As an effect i imagine that the bow has leaves that they respond to the Season, so you get Yellow leaves in Autumn, Green in the summer etc. This goes well with the Living Wood (material) and again the Blessing of Mielliki
The Character of the semi-sentient/sentient weapon could be a combination of the materials provided
hmm...tricky
and hard! any additional help is more than welcome!
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| Hawkins |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 18:33:58
Another resource that you might find useful is Weapons of Legacy. |
| Erik Scott de Bie |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 17:27:16
I definitely agree with the above suggested sources for mechanical notes and creating atmosphere (Elaine's moonblades are an excellent source).
Also, if this is an active character, consider making the crafting of the bow the focus of an adventure. Talk with your DM about it (unless you are the DM, in which case it's easy), and have an adventure that requires you to find a particular rare wood, or obtain a blessing of an elven god/goddess, or something of that nature. You're epic level, so you should be dealing with suitably epic figures in the Seldarine or the elven community.
I think an elven bow lends itself best to semi-sentience and communication by empathy (giving you strong feelings about preserving the elven way of life, etc). Also, when your character eventually passes away, your consciousness might remain within the bow to inspire future generations of wielders (similar to how a moonblade works).
Also, what class is your character? If you're a spellcaster yourself, then craft magic arms and armor should be easy to come by . . . otherwise, it might be a group effort to create your bow. Though of course it's quite reasonable to be able to create it yourself regardless of class (particularly if you do it as an adventure), ala how Bruenor created Aegis-Fang without any levels in any spellcasting class.
Cheers |
| Hawkins |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 17:02:55
You might want to check out the section on Intelligent Items for some ideas. I know that they are normally magical, but I don't see why you shouldn't be able to apply some of the properties to a masterwork bow of elvish origin. Also, Magic of Faerun has a section on 3.0 moonblades from pages 170-171. And here is a link to Elaine Cunningham's further notes on 3.0 moonblades. |
| Delzounblood |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 16:38:51
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
With a name like Starstrike... I'd expect powers such as shedding light, having some sort of light burst upon impact, and maybe causing an arrow to act like a magic missile.
see 4th post "Bow of Eletha"
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| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 15:42:22
With a name like Starstrike... I'd expect powers such as shedding light, having some sort of light burst upon impact, and maybe causing an arrow to act like a magic missile. |
| Ashe Ravenheart |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 14:14:17
And, there's also the little bit on Elven Bows that was released waaaaay back when The Lone Drow came out. Check the link (includes the 3.5 stats for Catti-Brie, Regis, Ivan and Pikel Bouldershoulder, Guenhwyvar, Khazid'hea, etc.), the info for Elven Bows are at the bottom of the article. |
| Delzounblood |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 14:02:12
Don't forget enspelled arrows can change the whole aspect of your archer especially if you use :-
Wooden Arrow.
This is a totally organic arrow.
Made completely from wood and carved with ornate runes, it appears as nothing more than a novelty, or perhaps a woodcarver's doodle. In reality, this arrow is a most dangerous weapon, and it radiates strong en-chantment.
This arrow completely ignores all non organic armour!
I love 2e Elven Archers one of my favorite to play apart from Battlerager dwarves.
Delz |
| Matthus |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 13:56:27
What do you think about communicating with the trees about giving such a sentient weapon. There is no rule I know, but I’m thinking about the Ogier in WoT.
Maybe your DM can make a nice plot involving the search for the right tree and much more…
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| Delzounblood |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 13:55:26
If your up for a little conversion source to use would be
PHBR8 The Complete Book of Elves 2e
FOR5 Elves of Evermeet 2e
---------
Complete Book Of Elves
Elven Bow
During their years of experience, elves have
found that often archers are attacked without
much chance to defend themselves. They have
therefore created the elven bow. It is designed
to fire with the same rate of fire and accuracy,
and yet the elves can use it to fend off attacks
until they can defend themselves with a better
weapon or spell.
The elven bow is a beautiful piece of work,
carved mostly from wood, and is highly decorated
and polished. To fully fulfill its function,
the elf crafters have also given it metal inlays.
These enable the bow to be used as a parrying
weapon until the elf can draw a more suitable
weapon. Meanwhile, the elf's bow has not been
damaged by the attack and can be used again.
If used as an offensive weapon, the elven
bow acts as a club, causing ld6 points to S- or
M-sized creatures, ld3 to L-sized or larger
creatures.
Cost: 150 gp
Weight: 8 lbs.
---
Elves of Evermeet
Bow of Eletha
The bow of a celebrated Green elf warrior, this
weapon automatically doubles the range and
damage of all arrows it shoots. Three times per
day it can also shoot an ordinary arrow, which
has the effect of a magic missile cast at the 12th
level of spell use.
-----
As for how elves actually craft them I am not sure of any particular processes like on a night of a full moon or anything, in my campaign players have just used the relavant feats/profs.
Delz |
| Marquant Volker |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 13:46:19
oops sorry!
We play a mix of 3 and 3.5
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| Delzounblood |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 13:45:17
what edition is this character ? |
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