| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| The Sage |
Posted - 08 May 2004 : 03:29:22
For those of you with an interest in such topics, here's the latest WotC art gallery covering the soon-to-be-released Complete Divine tome. |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Darth KTrava |
Posted - 21 May 2004 : 04:30:15
I've never used the miniatures other than as a supplement to the RPG game. Thus, I have no need to get the minis handbook unless I see it very, very dirt cheap.
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| Purple Dragon Knight |
Posted - 20 May 2004 : 18:13:49
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
What do you mean "suckered"? Do you not use miniatures in your campaigns?
I fell prey to BATTLESYSTEM nostalgia - that's why I bought it. I bought it solely for the Mass Combat rules, in order to get a a decent 3.5 system for armies, siege, etc. I was somewhat disappointed because the book does not provide any rules to convert the 3.5 game in miniatures terms. The book only offers a combat system that, albeit decent and mechanically sound, relies solely on miniatures stats that you must buy separately. Nowhere do they tell you how to convert from 3.5 to miniatures rules... They provide a shady list of "equivalent" or "similar" abilities that you can assign to monsters in order to make them fit the system the closest, but it's mainly - nay, solely! - geared at the D&D Minis. For example, if you have the "Axe Sister", you can find in the Miniatures Book what her abilities mean in terms of using her in a Mass combat; however, if you have Ftr5/Wiz5/Bladesinger5 PC and want to convert that PC into miniatures rules, you have a LOT of work and guesses to make... too many guesses.
And finally: nothing on catapults, ballistaes or fighting from the parapets... 
But the extra Core classes, most specifically the Marshall class, were a gem, I must admit!  |
| The Sage |
Posted - 20 May 2004 : 14:32:50
I'll admit that I found the War Hulk class intriguing, but I wasn't going to hand over any of my hard earned gold pieces for a tome with material I most likely wouldn't use just to have access to one single class.
Fortunately WotC included the War Hulk class as part of their monthly preview features...
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| Arivia |
Posted - 20 May 2004 : 14:25:34
I wouldn't say suckered, either-it does have some fairly good material in it(the war hulk and warchief spring to mind). It's not for everyone, but it was worth the discount price I got it for(Nice 30% of all hardcover books sales...). I'd actually suggest it to new DMs that can't ask more experienced DMs for help/teaching on a regular basis-if only for the final chapter, which is perhaps the best guide to creating dungeons I've seen in quite awhile. Albeit does use the miniatures, but it does talk about special features, different combat types, and other essentials in easily explainable, frankly dumbed down language. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 20 May 2004 : 13:27:07
What do you mean "suckered"? Do you not use miniatures in your campaigns?
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| Purple Dragon Knight |
Posted - 20 May 2004 : 12:13:47
I agree that Favored Soul has lots of potential though: I wasn't disagreeing with you on that - sorry if this came out wrong. I was merely trying to illustrate my disappointment because I, for one, had been suckered into buying the Miniatures Handbook...  |
| The Sage |
Posted - 20 May 2004 : 11:35:40
I didn't know that PDK, for I do not have the Miniatures Handbook...
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| Purple Dragon Knight |
Posted - 20 May 2004 : 11:33:50
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
The 'favored soul' class appears interesting at a glance, a nice alternative to the standard paladin.
Favored Soul is an identical cut and pasted from the Favored Soul found in the Miniatures Handbook... |
| The Sage |
Posted - 20 May 2004 : 10:16:08
Well, I received my copy of CD in the mail today, after coming home from university. I've only had a chance to skim through most of the material inside so far, but from what I've seen, I like. I completely skipped the PrC section, there's really nothing in that will interest me at the moment. The 'favored soul' class appears interesting at a glance, a nice alternative to the standard paladin.
One of the 'crunchy' parts of the tome I found interesting was the variant 'faith feats' option. In terms of function, they are very similar to the 'force points' in SWd20. I didn't like the fact that you are only presented with three faith feats, when they faith point system could be applied to many aspects of divine belief. It's hopefully something WotC will build upon in later material.
I'll try and do a full review once I've started reading it proper.
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| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 19 May 2004 : 15:14:17
quote:
Originally posted by Gion
Actually,... it was the first forum i found. i apologize for my mistake, i looked for a place to say hello to everyone but i didn't find it.
My excuses to everyone
No worries. Did you find the Welcome forum now to make a post introducting yourself? |
| Thelonius |
Posted - 19 May 2004 : 15:11:50
Actually,... it was the first forum i found. i apologize for my mistake, i looked for a place to say hello to everyone but i didn't find it.
My excuses to everyone
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| Purple Dragon Knight |
Posted - 15 May 2004 : 23:43:50
quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
Ah, but rejecting possible choices not because you have made a choice already, but instead to keep one's self from having to choose, is what I was talking about. If one has to do that, then it's direction that needs to be considered, not small choices.
I don't think direction should be sought at all; I rather think that not wanting to choose further denotes a knowing of one's needs and wants. I am perfectly happy with the multitude of PrCs and feat options we already have, not only with the 3 core books, but with the multitude of FR products. Now, if you'd make a case that the Complete Warrior or Complete Divine are "necessary" to update your old 3.0 splatbooks, if you are a Living Greyhawk campaign member, then I could sympathize... but in the perspective of a FR gamer, these books are utterly useless to me. To introduce them in my campaign would further dilute the less-than-concentrated FR feel fostered by 3.0/3.5 play. I prefer to have my players pick classes like Spellsinger and Battlerager, Elemental Archon and Morninglord of Lathander, etc. I tried a FR campaign last year that allowed the use of splatbooks and only one player out of six chose PrCs and feats found in FR books. Everyone had their own little idea of what they wanted, even trying to push d20 products that were unknown to me, until I put a stop to it and gave them clear character creation guidelines, which summarized as "THIS IS A FORGOTTEN REALMS CAMPAIGN" |
| Bookwyrm |
Posted - 15 May 2004 : 10:38:28
Gion, I'm curious. What made you make an opening post here, and not in the Welcome to Candlekeep area? |
| Bookwyrm |
Posted - 15 May 2004 : 10:37:22
Ah, but rejecting possible choices not because you have made a choice already, but instead to keep one's self from having to choose, is what I was talking about. If one has to do that, then it's direction that needs to be considered, not small choices. |
| Thelonius |
Posted - 15 May 2004 : 10:26:54
Hello, i don't really want to reply anithing, at this moment, i only want to introduce myself, I'M GION DRUID OF THE FÊN VALLEY FOREST. Really pleased to meet all of you, you can find me in the following direction EDWINBALDUR@YAHOO.ES as you can see i'm from the south part of the continent called Hispania, if there are others Hispanians who want to talk to me i'll be pleased to share our knowledge, of course all of the respectables members of the candlekeep Realm are welcome. Great hails to all of you, my dear friends. |
| Purple Dragon Knight |
Posted - 15 May 2004 : 10:17:22
I believe your first paragraph was in response to the Paradox of Choices post I made, and if so, I fully agree with you. Consumers are the cause of the offer; otherwise they'd be no offer. But thinking that the offer has no influence on the consumer would be a false statement though. Don't underestimate the "collector's guilt" effect that so many gamers seem to have these days... I know several gamers (and some of these are not stupid people - they have very successful / intellectually challenging lives) who have told me "I don't care if it's good or bad: I buy all the D&D books."
I am partially guilty of such a crime, as I buy all FR books even if I have apprehension on some of them... however, D&D Core reprints? no Sir! I'm a FR fan, not a Core crap fan. |
| Bookwyrm |
Posted - 15 May 2004 : 09:49:20
You know, PDK, that problem is actually as much a fault of the consumer as it is of the provider. If one has a clear idea of what one wants, such a problem never occurs. It's when one thinks of ephemeral things as having value that lasts beyond their own existance -- in other words, that having this product will make one happier than one was before -- that such things will occur.
In the standpoint of D&D, a player should aways have a clear idea of who his or her character is and where that same character is likely to go, just as that player would consider his or her own life. Myself, I'll probably never be in a position to regret working as an intern for, say, the local TV news station rather than taking a job as at a bookstore. That's because I know books. I like the sight of them, their smell, and the feel of them in the hand. I can't say the same thing for the bright lights of a newsroom.
In the case of a character, it should be pretty obvious, once proper reflection has taken place, whether Feat A or PrC B is good or should be discarded. If it isn't, then the character's player is just coasting, and has likely lost previous enjoyment of the roleplay.
There. Two coppers, and now I'm broke.  |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 15 May 2004 : 04:21:31
quote:
Originally posted by Purple Dragon Knight
But this time around, it seems like a big crunch reprint of books I already have (Miniatures Handbook I already have: I don't need reprints of a book that's already 3.5!!!)
PDK
I didn't read much of the whole thread, just skimmed the first post. But, if that's what the person with the book is saying, about it just being mainly a reprint of previous stuff, I can't say I'm surprised.
Wait a few years for this process to begin again with 4th edition. |
| Purple Dragon Knight |
Posted - 15 May 2004 : 00:16:04
Wow! this review actually reinforces my belief that it's not worth buying... a rare thing indeed! Reviews usually sway me into buying books, as they almost always make me more curious about them. But this time around, it seems like a big crunch reprint of books I already have (Miniatures Handbook I already have: I don't need reprints of a book that's already 3.5!!!)
PDK |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 14 May 2004 : 16:50:17
There's a thread over on ENWorld where someone who has this item is answering questions regarding the contents:
http://www.enworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=88042 |
| Purple Dragon Knight |
Posted - 14 May 2004 : 11:37:54
Aahhhh... found the book's title: "The Paradox of Choice: Why More Is Less", by Barry Schwartz |
| Lina |
Posted - 14 May 2004 : 11:23:25
Maybe I'll take a peek at those links if time permits.
Let's see... time stop spell... drat where did it put it. |
| Sarelle |
Posted - 12 May 2004 : 16:23:50
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
quote:
Originally posted by Sarelle
Maybe it's just the prospect of an entire chapter devoted to playing D&D deity avatars (just like they did back in ol' 2E), but this book has gone up in my estimation thanks to this art gallery.
I'm surprised the chapter isn't entitled: "Tips on how your players can kill a deity's avatar in twelve easy steps without getting their armor smudged."
Well... I don't have CD, nor do I know all that much about it, but the reason I had been plased with a chapter devoted to avatars, was for their role-playing use, how to make a deity work as an active presence in your campaign, etc. I love those sorts of things.
Whilst I'm sure that they would have a section on fighting avatars, I had hoped that wouldn't be all there was. I'll most likely be proved wrong. Though I personally don't mind high-level players fighting deity avatars - it's when they are allowed to kill actual gods that I sigh... deeply. |
| Purple Dragon Knight |
Posted - 11 May 2004 : 21:39:48
Hmm... maybe this will sound weird, but I don't want Complete Divine, even if someone would hand it to me for free. Why? because I have enough choice as it is. I do not want more choice in my life.
A book has recently been written on the paradoxes of choices reducing happiness. Logically, more choices available means higher satisfaction because the probability of getting what you are looking for is much higher. However, recent studies have determined that the abundance of choices we enjoy today is having the opposite effect: having so much choice results in us being less satisfied after a purchase, as we constantly ponder if we made the right decision, even after the purchase is done and over with. This is especially true in regards to high-price items such as houses and cars (the author referred to the "two-week car happiness effect", and how a car just became a car after those two weeks, the contentment fading much quicker nowadays...)
Now, this is why I hate radio shows: I never remember names, titles, etc. I wish I would have a book name for you all... look for one with "choice" or "choices" in the title...  |
| Arivia |
Posted - 11 May 2004 : 20:52:30
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
quote:
Originally posted by Sarelle
Maybe it's just the prospect of an entire chapter devoted to playing D&D deity avatars (just like they did back in ol' 2E), but this book has gone up in my estimation thanks to this art gallery.
I'm surprised the chapter isn't entitled: "Tips on how your players can kill a deity's avatar in twelve easy steps without getting their armor smudged."
And of course this goes directly against what they've said in other 3e products... |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 11 May 2004 : 19:46:50
quote:
Originally posted by Sarelle
Maybe it's just the prospect of an entire chapter devoted to playing D&D deity avatars (just like they did back in ol' 2E), but this book has gone up in my estimation thanks to this art gallery.
I'm surprised the chapter isn't entitled: "Tips on how your players can kill a deity's avatar in twelve easy steps without getting their armor smudged." |
| Sarelle |
Posted - 11 May 2004 : 18:28:03
Personally, I was really liked what I saw in this art gallery. I mean, some of it was quite run-of-the-mill (the ideas for the images, not the artwork itself), but the images of Tiamat in particular were truly impressive.
Maybe it's just the prospect of an entire chapter devoted to playing D&D deity avatars (just like they did back in ol' 2E), but this book has gone up in my estimation thanks to this art gallery. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 11 May 2004 : 07:44:11
Yes. There's a link contained in my post on the 8th May 2004 at 15:22:18, simply scroll up. The URL I've provided will take you to the desktop wallpaper downloads. You have your choice of particular screen sizes as well.
Enjoy  .
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| VEDSICA |
Posted - 11 May 2004 : 02:26:54
As always thank you Sage for the linkage.Much obliged.I really dig the Tiamat illustraion...It's pretty cool.Did you say that it is available for download???? |
| The Sage |
Posted - 09 May 2004 : 07:45:31
I couldn't agree more. Although, I'll probably find more use for this tome than my now ill-considered purchase of the Complete Warrior sourcebook. To date, my players have only the CW tome three times .
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